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ordered a new pc wondering if I can handle game at max
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Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
OK I do not know a whole lot about modern computer systems I play games on computers can kick them when they are working properly I have more of a 486 knowledge base when it comes to pc's so this is what I have coming in.
1 intel 17 870 quad core
4 x 2GB DDR3 1333 Memory
1 TB 7200 HD
1 Geforce 9800gt 1GB DDR3 PCO-e
1 600 Watt max psu
1 Apollo ATX Case
1 22x DVDRW optical drive
1 24in LCD Flat Panel Monitor
1 SKT 1156 MB
1 WIn 7 64bit pro
also the guy at the store said I have like a thread all on my memory so it will run faster and that is why I needed an equal amount of sticks
what I am wondering is if this computer will be able to run CO at max settings with winamp running in the background so I can listen to my old time radio?
1 intel 17 870 quad core
4 x 2GB DDR3 1333 Memory
1 TB 7200 HD
1 Geforce 9800gt 1GB DDR3 PCO-e
1 600 Watt max psu
1 Apollo ATX Case
1 22x DVDRW optical drive
1 24in LCD Flat Panel Monitor
1 SKT 1156 MB
1 WIn 7 64bit pro
also the guy at the store said I have like a thread all on my memory so it will run faster and that is why I needed an equal amount of sticks
what I am wondering is if this computer will be able to run CO at max settings with winamp running in the background so I can listen to my old time radio?
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No, it won't run the game at max settings unless you're willing to accept some pretty choppy frame rates. If you have ideas about running games at max settings, then it helps to buy a more modern video card than a cut down version of a card that launched in 2007. A GeForce 9800 GT makes some sense if you're on a tight budget (say, $600 without peripherals, or $800 including peripherals) and can find one for $70 or so. But you don't buy a Core i7 870 on that tight of a budget unless it's not a gaming system at all.
Giving a claimed wattage on the power supply but not telling you what power supply it is is a huge red flag. It's likely that, if you're unable to change the order, then you should at least consider replacing the power supply immediately upon receiving the machine. A high quality 600 W power supply would be very much overkill for that hardware. A poor quality "600 W" power supply that will explode (literally) if you try to draw 400 W from it isn't appropriate for any hardware. If it were the former, they'd tell you.
You should get two memory modules, not four. For gaming purposes, 4 GB is plenty. If you need 8 GB for non-gaming reasons, then make it two 4 GB modules, not four 2 GB modules.
If they won't tell you what hard drive they're using, then it's probably the slowest, cheapest one that technically meets their specs. At least they tell you it's 7200 RPM, so it's not as bad as it could be. But you're probably used to constantly sitting there and waiting whenever you ask a computer to do anything, so you won't realize that there's anything wrong with that.
They don't tell you at all what motherboard it is, either, which means they could try to **** off some cheap junk from a brand like ECS, Jetway, Foxconn, or Intel on you. The processor tells you that it's a socket LGA 1156 motherboard, so the motherboard description itself doesn't really tell you anything more than that there is a motherboard. It doesn't even tell you what chipset.
Buying Windows 7 Professional is a waste of money unless you need some feature that the professional version offers but Home Premium doesn't. Businesses commonly do, but home users usually don't, and home users that aren't a whole lot more sophisticated about computers than you seem to be virtually never have any use for any of the features restricted to the professional edition.
On the bright side, while I've never used an NZXT Apollo case, it looks like it should be appropriate to the other hardware. Optical drives are such a commodity that there aren't too many ways to mess them up, apart from the LG ones with "Bluebirds" malware/adware in their firmware.
* Intel® Core i5-760 processor
Features an 8MB cache and 2.8GHz processor speed with Turbo Boost up to 3.2GHz.
* Intel® Core i5 processor
Features smart 4-way processing performance with a speed boost.
* Intel® Turbo Boost Technology
Automatically speeds up your processor when your PC needs extra performance.
* 6GB DDR3 SDRAM
For multitasking power, expandable to 16GB.
* Multiformat DVD±RW/CD-RW drive with double-layer write support
Burn your digital media onto DVD and CD formats.
* 1TB Serial ATA hard drive (7200 rpm)
For fast read/write times.
* ATI Radeon HD 5670 graphics
Feature up to 1GB video memory (2GB discrete) for lush images with stunning detail.
* 2 IEEE 1394 (FireWire) ports and 8 high-speed USB 2.0 ports
For fast digital data transfer and easy peripheral connectivity.
* Built-in Ethernet LAN
For flexible wired Web connectivity options.
* Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium Edition 64-bit operating system preinstalled
and as far as budget it was 1700.00 and the pc i listed came in at 1686 with the acer monitor.
I do greatly appreciate your reply and hope to get that vid card straightened out tomorrow and the rest of the stuff I will post and let you know.
Also it came with a 1 year Warrenty on parts and labor.
A Core i5 760 makes sense. For gaming purposes, a Core i7 870 isn't much faster, but it does cost an extra $100. For that kind of budget, you should probably wait for Sandy Bridge motherboards to return, and then get a Core i5 2500, which is much cheaper than a Core i7 870, but dramatically faster. The processors are out, but the motherboards were recalled because the chipsets were defective, and they'll be back as soon as Intel can mass produce the slightly tweaked chipsets to fix the design glitch that would eventually the SATA 2 controller to fail.
It's good that whoever is building it was smart enough to know that you shouldn't get 6 GB of system memory with a Lynnfield processor. Your amount of system memory should nearly always be a power of 2 times the number of memory channels. Lynnfield has a two channel memory controller, so your amount of memory should be a power of 2. Usually that means either 4 GB or 8 GB. For most people, I'd say make it 4 GB. On your budget, you could consider 8 GB.
A Radeon HD 5670 is meant as a budget gaming card. A GeForce 9800 GT is perhaps slightly faster than a Radeon HD 5670, though the 5670 has a much nicer feature set. It's basically a case of a fairly high end card from 2007 being faster than a lower midrange card from 2010. For a gaming card on your budget, I'd say get a Radeon HD 6950, Radeon HD 6970, GeForce GTX 560 Ti, or GeForce GTX 570. Those cards go for about $240-$370, but the video card is the dominant factor in how high you can turn video settings.
I'd still worry some about a 600 W power supply. Seasonic doesn't make 600 W power supplies, so the brands that rely on them for power supplies in that wattage range mostly don't offer 600 W power supplies, either. Maybe he'll get you something nice from Silverstone or Enermax (which do make nice 600 W power supplies), but a lot of prebuilt computers come with cheap junk power supplies that can cause all sorts of problems, from random crashing to damaged hardware.
On your budget, you really should get a solid state drive. Hard drives are an intrinsically slow technology that cannot be made fast. You know how, when you load a program, you have to sit there and wait a while before the program loads and lets you do anything? Likewise, while running programs, a lot of them will sometimes pause a bit and make you wait before it responds? That's typically because it's trying to get data off of your hard drive, and your hard drive is slow. If you had a good SSD, you usually wouldn't have to wait.
Now, there are some programs that will make you wait a bit. My SSD is somewhat dated by now, so it takes about 18 seconds to load Champions Online, from clicking play to the character selection screen being ready to go. On a newer SSD, that would likely go somewhat faster.
Here's my usual link of why you need a good SSD:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/3681/oczs-vertex-2-special-sauce-sf1200-reviewed/6
See the WD VelociRaptor down at the bottom of those charts? That's generally regarded as the fastest consumer hard drive on the market. And it's not even competitive with the SSDs. And yes, higher numbers are better. The best SSD controllers on the market at the moment use the SandForce or Marvell controllers. A 60 GB one goes for around $120, while 120 GB is around $220.
If you need more capacity than that, no problem. You get a hard drive, too. You install the OS and your main programs on the SSD, and then they will be fast. You put data files like music, videos, or pictures on the hard drive, as speed doesn't matter for things like that, but that way, they don't eat up space on the SSD.
Also, find out exactly what parts are being used, as in brand names and models, not just some of the claimed specs.
If you want some reading material, then here's what you should get in a new computer:
http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=102211
For the lineup of modern gaming video cards with prices in line with their performance (not necessarily the prices at which they're actually for sale), check the middle of the first post on this thread:
http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=109623
Prices on some of those cards have fallen a bit, so I should probably lower some of the prices listed a bit. I'll probably get around to that when new cards launch in the next two weeks.
The store owner was there and I did tell him that if I was happy with my pc I would be back in two years to get my wife a new pc because we get a new pc every 2 years but she gets one then 2 years later I get one etc so I get to upgrade every 4 years.
But I am a bit nervous now because I really want to be able to play CO on MAX settings
$115 is an awful lot for a 600 W power supply. Out of 32 "600 W" power supplies on New Egg, only one costs more than that, and even that one (Enermax Pro 87+ 600 W) is still $115 after rebate. I guess there's a Silverstone one that costs over $115 if you include shipping, but from the specs, it looks like it's just really overpriced. But a high price doesn't guarantee that you get something good; the Thermaltake TR2 power supply is $100 including shipping, and awful.
Actually, I don't think a $115 power supply makes a whole lot of sense, unless you need something around 800-900 W, which would be massively overkill for the overwhelming majority of gaming systems out there. (Two high end video cards in CrossFire or SLI might need that sort of power, but that's it.) In the 500-600 W range that is appropriate for most gaming machines, you can usually get something pretty nice for $60-$80. If you pay $115 for a $70 power supply, that's merely overpaying. You can shell out for an 80 PLUS Gold power supply with extremely high energy efficiency and super high end quality, but those tend to cost over $115 unless you find a nice deal. I once saw the Seasonic X-650 on New Egg for a little under $100, for example.
If you're going to make some changes to the order, then you might want to let the store owner know as soon as possible, rather than waiting until everything is assembled.
There's also the question of what you mean by "max" settings. If you mean treating the game like a benchmark where the goal is to get as low of frame rates as possible for your given hardware, then that's just being ridiculous. If you mean turning the main video settings slider to "maximum" while ignoring the things it doesn't affect (most notably anti-aliasing), then that's also being ridiculous. Having anti-aliasing off shouldn't even count as high settings, let alone maximum.
The more sensible thing to do is to turn up the settings that make the game look nicer to you, and turn down the settings that don't make it look nicer. I turn shadows off in most games, for example, simply because I think they look bad. Maybe they look realistic, but I think shadows look bad in real life, too, so why would you want to emulate that in a game? Depth of field is even worse, as it brings a large performance hit to make things look blurrier, and hence worse. SSAO also brings a large performance hit, and does make the game look different, but in my view, not really better or worse, but just different.
If you've got a lot of video card power available, it's much better to use it on things like 4x SSAA, which would have to be enabled through the card's control panel, as the game doesn't give you the option to set the anti-aliasing type. Actually, you can kind of enable 4x SSAA in game, by turning anti-aliasing off, and then typing "/renderscale 2". You'd have to redo that every time you log in, though.
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-P67A-UD3P $160
Sandy Bridge chipsets were recalled, so you can't buy this right now. They're starting to come back. I might pick a different motherboard, depending on what shows up in stock first.
Processor: Core i5 2500 $210
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115073
CPU cooler: probably some combo deal with the processor or some such will be available, so it's an extra $20 or so for an aftermarket cooler.
Video card: GeForce GTX 570 $340
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133370
There's a physically identical for $5 cheaper from Sparkle, but their "lifetime warranty" means, "until we discontinue the card", so I don't trust them. This one comes with two free games, too.
Memory: 8 GB in a two module kit, 1333 MHz DDR3 $80
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231424
You don't really need 8 GB. But on a $1700 budget, you might as well. Memory is cheap now.
Power supply: Antec TruePower New 650 W $80
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371021
Prices on power supplies change constantly, so request an update before you actually purchase something. At $80, this is a good deal. At $100, it wouldn't be such a good deal.
Case: Antec Three Hundred Illusion $55
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129066
That's the cheapest price I've ever seen on it. It's the case I use. Four big fans means plenty of airflow. Though actually, I'd worry a bit about some of the longer video cards not fitting.
SSD: Crucial RealSSD C300 64 GB $125
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148361
Best read speeds of any SSD on the market at that capacity, and pretty good write speeds, too. Sequential write is unimpressive, but that only matters when you're installing software.
If you've never used a good SSD before, you'll be amazed at how much more responsive the computer feels. SSDs are the single biggest leap in computer performance since, well, nothing more recent than the invention of the transistor comes to mind.
Hard Drive: Samsung Spinpoint F3, 7200 RPM, 1 TB $55
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152185
As hard drives go, it's not especially fast or especially slow. But it is cheap.
Optical drive: CD/DVD burners are such a commodity that it doesn't matter much anymore which one you get $24, including shipping
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106333
Operating system: Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit $100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116754
Actually, you can often find it for $5 off in a combo deal with something else that you were going to get anyway.
Monitor: I really don't have a good recommendation here, but let's just say $200.
Total price tag: $1429
Actually, let's assume $30 for an aftermarket CPU cooler, and make the total $1459. Even without overclocking, the stock coolers that come with Sandy Bridge processors are awful.
There may be some sales tax added, depending on where you live. But that stays far within the $1700 budget stated.
One possible upgrade would be to get a larger SSD. For example, an extra $88 over the one above would let you get this instead:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227593
The OCZ Agility 2 isn't quite as fast in reads as the Crucial RealSSD C300, but is significantly faster in writes. I don't know if you'd be able to tell the difference in practical use, even if you had both side by side and were looking for it. The extra money is for 120 GB of capacity rather than 64 GB.
Another possible upgrade would be a larger or otherwise nicer monitor. I don't really have any specific advice on that, though.
Either way I'd say that if you can hold off a month, it might be worth waiting for the sandybridge chipsets to be in full swing, it seems that performance wise it's a whole new world even compared to some of the higher end "extreme" processors.
-Pi
edit:
Do as Quaternion says, but be careful. Because of him I now check tech sites and forums on a nearly hourly basis.
*A processor that is typically about 30% faster, except in programs that scale well to 8 cores or more
*A more modern motherboard platform that may accept future upgrades
*A much higher quality motherboard
*A much more feature-laden motherboard
*A power supply that can deliver higher wattages
*A power supply that is more energy efficient
*A power supply that is less likely to break or damage other hardware
*A power supply that is semi-modular, so that you can remove unneeded power cords rather than having them get in the way or block airflow
*An arguably nicer case
*A solid state drive that will make the system feel dramatically more responsive
*The same memory capacity, but with two modules rather than four--meaning less stress on the memory controller and motherboard, lower power consumption, and the option of future upgrades
*About 3-4 times the video card performance
*Much better video card features, most notably DirectX 11 support
*An equivalent optical drive
*A roughly equivalent (and possibly identical) hard drive
*A roughly equivalent (and possibly identical) monitor
*The same operating system
*A considerably lower price tag
The disadvantage? You have to return the old one and assemble this one yourself. And you have to wait a bit on the motherboard.
Some Biostar and MSI motherboards based on the appropriate LGA 1155 socket have reappeared on New Egg, so they are starting to come back. Nothing that I'd really call appropriate to your needs has returned, though.