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Robert Caliburn Questions

Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
I have been thinking about Caliburn and he seems like a pretty cool character. Can anyone give me some info about the character and how the gems from the game fit with the rpg. The gems seem a little like the Infinity Gems from Marvel but maybe not complete copies.
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  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Well going by things Caliburn has said, he's probably in his 60s, though he seems to have aged well. He went to Nam, from the sounds of it. He's a gun toting magician, and the elemental gems are what allowed him to transcend and become the arch-mage.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Caliburn is the CU's version of Constantine. His pistol has been consecrated by the touch of Azrael and his uzi was blessed by Shiva. In the CU in order to be considered for the, currently vacant, Archmage postion you must receive gifts of power from a major power in each of the four Quanternion Planes. In the pnp he's received 2 of the needed 4 gifts.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    From the Vibora Bay Sourcebook:

    In 1971 Robert Coble was a young soldier on patrol in Vietnam. A VC attack separated him from the rest of his unit, and he quickly became lost. Confused he penetrated further and further into VC territory eliminating any scouts he encountered along the way. Despite his eventual realization that he was going the wrong way, something seemed to be pulling him onwards, calling to him.....

    He soon found out what is was as he stumbled into a secluded jungle valley and discovered a hidden temple......
    .....He found the temple doors wide open, and cautiously made his way inside. He came to a large central chamber where he saw black-robed monks chanting around a black flame....
    ....Set on a small pedestal in front of the flame was a smooth, oval red gem that somehow pulsed with a healthy light that held back - barely - the black light of the accursed flame. ....
    .... In his mind, Coble thought he heard the gem speaking to him, urging him to fulfil the first part of his destiny and rescue it. Well Robert didn't need any urging to eliminate the evil VC cultists. While they were distracted by their chanting, he cut loose with his assault rifle, mowing most of them down and creating such a distraction, that he was able to run up, snatch the gem, and flee the temple.

    That was the last time anyone ever saw Robert Coble for the next 30 years.....he journeyed to India where he studied with Hindu Mystics.....where he learned about his gem.....then to a group of Gnostic mages in the Middle East.....then to a kibbutz of kabbalists in Israel....then to the house of Master Graubergen in Germany....the to one of the last surviving circle of druids in the British Isles....then to a deli in New York for more kabbalism and Hermetic lore...then to the homes of Mexican shamans....After a third of a century of study and training in which he seems to have aged only a few years, he found himself drawn back to his hometown of Vibora Bay.......

    First, he seems to be the object of some great prophecy (what we now know as Revelation).

    Second, he claims to have received gifts from both Azrael (a resident of Elysium) and Shiva (a resident of Faerie......The Archmage has to receive gifts of power from the major residents of each of the four Quaternion Planes......

    Third, he clearly possesses great power. While his Hermetic theurgy often requires lengthy rituals or pre-enchanted talismans, he seems to know how to work spells that affect and improve guns - something that almost no other mage can even do,.....that's why they call him the Magnum Mage.


    As for the gems......(again from the VB sourcebook)

    ....they're not associated with the 4 Aristotlean elements but the 4 elements of Mankind:
    the Earth from which he was made
    the Soul that God gave him
    the Flame of his intellect and creativity
    and the Chaos that so often resides within his heart

    ....the gems are attuned to each other (especially its opposite (Fire-Earth, Soul-Chaos))

    At the time this was written The Earth Gem was held by Bloodstone. The other two owners were unknown.

    I too have a question concerning Caliburn. There was a Caliburn during the Reality Storm. Any relation?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Well, BLoodstone apparently lost the gem since you defeated him in Millennium City at his Qliphotic Portal. The Earth Gem was being guarded by an Earth Guardian in the Qliphotic Realm when we went after him. As far as Caliburn receiving more gifts since then? I am certain he's received further gifts that aren't detailed in the now out of date sourcebook.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Silverspar wrote:
    Well, BLoodstone apparently lost the gem since you defeated him in Millennium City at his Qliphotic Portal. The Earth Gem was being guarded by an Earth Guardian in the Qliphotic Realm when we went after him. As far as Caliburn receiving more gifts since then? I am certain he's received further gifts that aren't detailed in the now out of date sourcebook.

    Or he could have been working on getting the gifts while you were helping him with the gems.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    That's a big stretch. As much as I hate off camera work, even to say that the gifts were being off camera, considering how higher beings are portrayed at being stingy of bequeathing gifts I find it highly unlikely that Caliburn was able to get the other two he needed off screen.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    In re: Caliburn becoming the Archmage... he doesn't. He's one of the big contenders, but never quite gets there. Witchcraft, of the Champions, becomes Archmage of Earth. As per the Galactic Champions sourcebook, she ends up sacrificing her life to save the planet from Tyrannon the Conquerer in the year 2020, after which Earth's magic levels are too low for any spellcaster to actually make magic work. These magical levels are not renewed until almost the year 3000.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    In re: Caliburn becoming the Archmage... he doesn't. He's one of the big contenders, but never quite gets there. Witchcraft, of the Champions, becomes Archmage of Earth. As per the Galactic Champions sourcebook, she ends up sacrificing her life to save the planet from Tyrannon the Conquerer in the year 2020, after which Earth's magic levels are too low for any spellcaster to actually make magic work. These magical levels are not renewed until almost the year 3000.

    Champions Online trumps sourcebooks. Caliburn became the Archmage leading up to taking down Therakiel.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Funny, I thought this was the forum for the PnP game.

    Let me check...

    Oh, will you look at that! These are the threads for discussing the PnP Champions Universe, in which Robert Caliburn never became Archmage, and Witchcraft sacrificed herself to take down Tyrannon.

    Wow... look at that... turns out we aren't talking about the Online game at all. Wow...

    So yeah...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    Funny, I thought this was the forum for the PnP game.

    Let me check...

    Oh, will you look at that! These are the threads for discussing the PnP Champions Universe, in which Robert Caliburn never became Archmage, and Witchcraft sacrificed herself to take down Tyrannon.

    Wow... look at that... turns out we aren't talking about the Online game at all. Wow...

    So yeah...

    Yes, but canon now is that he becomes the Archmage because he became Archmage in the game, so it is now impossible for Witchcraft to become Archmage.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Dardove wrote:
    Yes, but canon now is that he becomes the Archmage because he became Archmage in the game, so it is now impossible for Witchcraft to become Archmage.

    Yeah, most old-school players of Champions are aware of how Cryptic has totally farked up the Champions Universe because of this game. Very few of us are happy about it.

    As for it being impossible, not necessarily. It is entirely possible for Caliburn to be Archmage *now*, and Witchcraft to be Archmage by 2020 when Tyrannon attacks. Especially given Caliburn's lifestyle.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Are the gems a viable way to become archmage? What are the powers of the gems?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Are the gems a viable way to become archmage? What are the powers of the gems?

    The way you become Archmage is simple to describe and hard to actually do. First, you have to be a mystic of great skill and power with knowledge of a broad range of magic. As the book says, "specialists and dabblers need not apply". You have to learn and be able to cast the Quaternion Banishment, but only after receiving gifts of power from the gods of Faerie, Babylon, Elysium, and the Netherworld. And you have to not be bound into the service of any single god or spirit. And the last requirement is sort of hazy... you have to be the right person at the right place and the right time, basically.

    The problem is, no one can ever tell what the right time and right place are going to be.

    Before Cryptic farked up the CU, the leading contenders were Witchcraft of the Champions, Robert Caliburn, the Demonologist (leader of the Devil's Advocates), the Irish super-wizard Dweomer, the Indian super-wizard Rashindar, and the Atlantean sorceress Stingray.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    Yeah, most old-school players of Champions are aware of how Cryptic has totally farked up the Champions Universe because of this game. Very few of us are happy about it.

    As for it being impossible, not necessarily. It is entirely possible for Caliburn to be Archmage *now*, and Witchcraft to be Archmage by 2020 when Tyrannon attacks. Especially given Caliburn's lifestyle.

    Actually HeroSteve has stated as Cryptic owns the Champions IP what happens in game is canon. Plain and simple. Alternate timeliens and all that non-sense. Since Therakiel forced events to coccur that caused the Apocalypse that timeline no longer exists. Caliburn is the new Arch-Mage.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    What are the powers of the gems?

    From the VB sourcebook (yes we know it doesn't deal with the online game this information is for pnp players):
    The Flame Gem(as when used by Caliburn):
    Powers:
    VPP (Fire Magic),+20 base++10 control cost;
    OIF(-1/2),only for fire magics (-1/2)
    Maneuver:
    Energy Damage Reduction,50% resistant; OIF (-1/2)
    only versus limited type of attack (fire; -1/2)
    Skills:
    +2 with Fire Magic; OIF (-1/2)
    Disads:
    vulnerability: 2x stun from Earth Gem attacks
    vulnerability: 1 1/2 x stun from Chaos and Soul Gem attacks

    The other gems abilities were not mentioned. Thats the beauty of the pnp make it up as you see fit. I would think that they would be similar. It also states that no one should ever have all four gems. That would be incredibly bad thing. Caliburn knows this, but he would like to know where they are so he can keep tabs on them. Its a great sourcebook and I highly recommend getting it if you pnp or even if you don't its a great read.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Well they can apply, if players were actually able to get ahold of the gems, but they can't. So they will remain Caliburns toys for quite sometime.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    As for it being impossible, not necessarily. It is entirely possible for Caliburn to be Archmage *now*, and Witchcraft to be Archmage by 2020 when Tyrannon attacks. Especially given Caliburn's lifestyle.

    My sense (FWIW) is that Caliburn would really rather not be Archmage in the first place; I think it's likely that one way or another Witchcraft will have the job by 2020.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Lucid wrote:
    My sense (FWIW) is that Caliburn would really rather not be Archmage in the first place; I think it's likely that one way or another Witchcraft will have the job by 2020.

    Like I said, he lives a dangerous lifestyle, drinks heavily, smokes heavily, and is generally not the most responsible human on the globe. He might give it up, or he might lose it the hard way. Anything is possible.


    Actually HeroSteve has stated as Cryptic owns the Champions IP what happens in game is canon.

    I am aware. I am also aware that Cryptic's canon sucks large, hairy, sweat-covered ********s.

    So I await the day when Champions Online goes the way of all underpopulated MMOs, and the IP contractually reverts to Hero Games so Hero can go back to publishing the good stuff.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Yes, because if the Champs Online closes down means that Cryptic still won't retain the IP and have any say, what-so-ever on the future of the Champions game, correct? BTW, just because the direction it went doesn't favor your ideology doesn't mean it's bad. I actually quite enjoy the lore that's been coming out.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Silverspar wrote:
    Yes, because if the Champs Online closes down means that Cryptic still won't retain the IP and have any say, what-so-ever on the future of the Champions game, correct? BTW, just because the direction it went doesn't favor your ideology doesn't mean it's bad. I actually quite enjoy the lore that's been coming out.


    My not liking it automatically means I think its bad. Sort of fits together that way. You are allowed to disagree, of course, but just remember that your right to disagree in no way guarantees that a) you are right, or that b) I don't have the right to say that I think you are wrong.

    Let me give you a f'rinstance... they took Menton, who originally was a cool, suave, sexy, jetsetting villain with style, and they turned him into a moustache-twirling Poindexter-style geek. Wrong move. Totally wrong.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    My not liking it automatically means I think its bad. Sort of fits together that way. You are allowed to disagree, of course, but just remember that your right to disagree in no way guarantees that a) you are right, or that b) I don't have the right to say that I think you are wrong.

    Let me give you a f'rinstance... they took Menton, who originally was a cool, suave, sexy, jetsetting villain with style, and they turned him into a moustache-twirling Poindexter-style geek. Wrong move. Totally wrong.

    Not from my perspective. BTW, you not liking what's done doesn't make you right at all, especially considering the fact that Cryptic owns the IP and what they say is what goes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    I never said I was right, I said I think I am right. Note the difference before you deign it appropriate to lecture.

    Secondly, Cryptic owning the IP in no way, shape, or form means that their decisions and changes are correct... it just makes those changes official.

    Just ask the people who came up with Crystal Pepsi and New Coke if you don't believe me.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Ask George Lucas about Star Wars.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Another good example, yes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Ive always considered the Pen and Paper a seperate Universe compared to the Online game. None of our characters are canon(online) in the P&P game. Makes it easier to deal with Cryptic changes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Ive always considered the Pen and Paper a seperate Universe compared to the Online game. None of our characters are canon(online) in the P&P game. Makes it easier to deal with Cryptic changes.

    That's sort of a catch-22. Your characters aren't canon but what happens in the Champions Online game universe story wise is canon. As Cryptic is the holder of the IP of Champions Universe whatever happens is considered canon.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Silverspar wrote:
    That's sort of a catch-22. Your characters aren't canon but what happens in the Champions Online game universe story wise is canon. As Cryptic is the holder of the IP of Champions Universe whatever happens is considered canon.

    They are the holder for now. As I said, when Champions Online collapses, as it will eventually (as most non-Warcraft MMOs do eventually, especially when they have a business model like the one Cryptic and its corporate owners are using), the IP will revert to Hero Games, where it belongs, and all the idiot changes Cryptic has made will be reversed to a sane Champions universe.

    And as no one is holding a gun to my head, any campaign I run will be run as I like it, and if I don't like the needless, idiotic changes that Cryptic has made (honestly... it seems some changes were made just to change things, which is never a good enough reason), then I don't have to use them.

    To me, Cryptic's storylines aren't any more canon than R. Talsorian's changes made back when they held the IP. As with R. Talsorian, Cryptic too will pass eventually, and the better Champions Universe will come back.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    They are the holder for now. As I said, when Champions Online collapses, as it will eventually (as most non-Warcraft MMOs do eventually, especially when they have a business model like the one Cryptic and its corporate owners are using), the IP will revert to Hero Games, where it belongs, and all the idiot changes Cryptic has made will be reversed to a sane Champions universe.

    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
    to me, Cryptic's storylines aren't any more canon than R. Talsorian's changes made back when they held the IP. As with R. Talsorian, Cryptic too will pass eventually, and the better Champions Universe will come back.

    Well, doesn't really matter since HeroSteve evidently supports in full effect what Cryptic is doing witht he IP. So you can like it or hate it, but it's still canon.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which disagrees with Cryptic's corporate cheerleaderism. ~Terramak

    As for Steve Long being "supporting" the changes Cryptic has made, he's in compliance with the changes, being contractually obligated as such. But that's far different from enjoying it. But I cannot see him liking his own creative work changed willy-nilly anymore than I would.

    EDIT:

    Apparently Cryptic doesn't like its dirty laundry aired in public. The fact remains: they are a company out to make money, and when CO becomes unprofitable it will be dropped like a hot rock, just like every other unprofitable MMO.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak

    The reversion of the IP to Hero Games was made public on the Hero Games forums.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    I'm a little hazy on why 'canon' is a big deal in this context. Most of the PnP 4th-5th books offered plot hooks for characters that required changing up the baseline presented in the main text. Medusa went from an ugly old crone to a sexy psionic cougar between editions. Psimon used to be Sebastian Poe's son, then wasn't, and all long before Cryptic got involved. Why does anyone care about canon? Its all just a springboard for the individual GM's ideas anyway.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak

    Anyway, I made the same point you did, three posts ago.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Worldmaker wrote:
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak

    Anyway, I made the same point you did, three posts ago.

    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Terramak
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    I am curious,

    Worldmaker... Do you use any of the Champions material released since Steve Long "took over ?"

    Much of it has only a passing resemblance to the Previous incarnations of the CU (and even the system is pretty significantly different in many ways from the original)

    Is my group playing the only real Champions because we use an older version of the setting ?

    BTW I see that a higher percentage of the 6th ed books will be in color than has ever been the case in the past. Hero Games, and its players, are benefitting greatly from this MMO.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited May 2010
    Hero System material, yes. But I haven't purchased a single Champions-branded product since before Steve Long and DOJ took over a decade ago. I am aware of those products, and own quite a few (gifts from friends), but as I am the owner/operator of a superhero world with as much depth and history behind it as the "official" CU, I never saw the need to buy them. I buy rulebooks, but not sourcebooks.

    Is your group playing 'real Champions"? That's entirely up to your own opinion. As I have pointed out multiple times, what I say is my opinion and you may feel free to disagree (with the proviso that merely disagreeing does not make you right, or me wrong, and vice versa).

    As for color in the books, yes, that does make them more attractive. However, the presence of color illustrations in the current books has no bearing on the quality of the content of those books.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited June 2010
    I have to agree. color illustrations are nice but really sorta pointless when you buy the book for its rules and setting... which end up being printed in black and white regardless.
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