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How to make a Dodge-tank build?

ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
in Builds and Roles
Hello,
asking the geniuses that hang out here about building a Dodge-Tank,
(Not really trying to get myself into Dodge tanking a cosmic, still learning how to tank with a standard tank) ;P

Thinking about building a 'can't touch me' hero. Along the lines of Spiderman or NIghtcrawler.

So the 'basic' dodge tank builds needs what?
Lightning reflexes, Masterful Dodge (r3), Fluidity w/ lingering adv, Con pri and Dex stacked? BCR/RR, What else?

For powerset/attacks, Thinking maybe SB w/ Reapers Caress/Cleaving strikes, Reapers Embrace & Crimson Bloom,
OR DB w/ Blade Tempest, Dragons Wrath, & Sword Cyclone w/ Chaotic Movements (to boost Dodge/Avoidance while maintaining)

Both of these lines should work with FotT & Steadfast,

So, Am I on the right track? Or am I missing something very important for dodgy-tanky builds?

Thanks in advance,
~Ragadolf

Comments

  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,859 Arc User
    Well, if you just want a general dodge tank, then it can be as simple as just getting R3 LR and pairing it with BCR/RR. Other bonuses like Lithe (from TKicks) are also nice, but not needed for general content. You could tack such a backbone onto any powerset, so it'll also just depend on what other attacks you want to take. For example, using DB:

    (Unnamed Build) - Freeform (Tank)
    v3.45:38

    Super Stats
    Level 6: Constitution (Primary)
    Level 10: Dexterity (Secondary)
    Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)

    Talents
    Level 1: The Chiller (Dex: 10, Con: 10, Rec: 8, End: 10)
    Level 6: Amazing Stamina (Rec: 5, End: 5)
    Level 9: Impresario (Dex: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 12: Quick Recovery (Con: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 15: Acrobat (Dex: 5, Con: 5)
    Level 18: Accurate (Dex: 5, End: 5)
    Level 21: Boundless Reserves (Con: 5, End: 5)

    Powers
    Level 1: Reaper's Touch
    Level 1: Blade Tempest (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 6: Form of the Tempest
    Level 8: Lightning Reflexes (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 11: Steadfast
    Level 14: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Resurgent Reiki, Gifts of the Storm)
    Level 17: Thundering Kicks (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 20: Sword Cyclone (Blender, Chaotic Movements)
    Level 23: Dragon's Wrath (Tiger's Courage, Dragon Rush)
    Level 26: Resurgence (Rank 2)
    Level 29: Parry (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 32:
    Level 35:
    Level 38:
    Adv. Points: 32/36

    Travel Powers
    Level 6:
    Level 35:

    Specializations
    Constitution: Fuel My Fire (3/3)
    Constitution: Resilient (2/2)
    Constitution: Deflection (3/3)
    Constitution: Adrenaline Rush (2/2)
    Vindicator: Aggressive Stance (2/2)
    Vindicator: Merciless (3/3)
    Vindicator: Focused Strikes (3/3)
    Vindicator: Mass Destruction (2/3)
    Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
    Warden: Ruthless (2/2)
    Warden: Elusive (2/2)
    Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
    Mastery: Constitution Mastery (1/1)

    The open power slots can be w/e. It's a pretty standard DB build, but you can also add TK for Lithe's extra dodge, if desired. Gears mostly for Con, w/ some Dex (and cost discount on gear).
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
    Thx Flow, This is the kind of thing I was looking for,
    Question(s), you advise parry over Fluidity for the block? And I notice you didn't put in MD, isn't that 'required' to get up to/over 100% dodge?

    Thanks much!
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,859 Arc User
    edited February 2023
    Normally, Fluidity is a bad idea as it replaces the usual large dmgRes bonus of a standard block w/ RNG mitigation. If you can guarantee that Fluidity will bring you over 100% dodge while you use it, though, then it can be a fine pick.

    You could get MD if you want to temporarily boost to over 100% dodge passively. Resurgence is still quite good, though, so it's choosing between a good mitigation + heal combo in MD + BCR/RR or a larger heal/regen effect in Resurgence + BCR. I'll leave that choice up to you.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
    yeah, It seems the big drawback to a dodge tank is if you MISS a dodge, then you kinda hosed. ;)

    Any advice on how to get to 100% dodge? without MD?
    Just stack the heck out of DEX is all I can think of.

    Thanks for the advice!
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,859 Arc User
    edited February 2023
    Well, you'll need strong gear, TKick's Lithe, and prob another dodge buff like from Parry's EM adv. Problem is, even if you can get past 100% dodge w/o using MD or Fluidity, you can pretty easily lose some dodge if you don't upkeep all the buffs (esp w/ how short Parry's adv lasts), and you'll naturally have less effective health compared to other tanks if you fail to dodge at any point. It's doable, but not really advisable for harder content.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
    I see,
    LOL, good thing I didn't plan on trying to MT with this toon! :P

    I decided to try and see what I could do using unarmed powerset various buffs/advantages.
    As noted, I will probably never use aggro buffs for this toon, just going to try running in tank mode for the best HP, etc.
    Take a look, any thoughts welcome, Thank you for your opinions as always. :)

    from the BETA version of the builder:
    Spider Monkey, (dodge off-tank) - Freeform (Any / Multiple)
    v3.45:38

    Super Stats
    Level 6: Constitution (Primary)
    Level 10: Dexterity (Secondary)
    Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)

    Talents
    Level 1: The Chiller (Dex: 10, Con: 10, Rec: 8, End: 10)
    Level 6: Quick Recovery (Con: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 9: Acrobat (Dex: 5, Con: 5)
    Level 12: Amazing Stamina (Rec: 5, End: 5)
    Level 15: Impresario (Dex: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 18: Accurate (Dex: 5, End: 5)
    Level 21: Boundless Reserves (Con: 5, End: 5)

    Powers
    Level 1: Righteous Fists
    Level 1: Thundering Kicks (Rank 2, Floating Lotus Blossom)
    Level 6: Lightning Reflexes (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 8: Parry (Rank 2, The Elusive Monk)
    Level 11: Steadfast
    Level 14: Dragon Kick (Lashing Dragon Tail, Dragon Rush)
    Level 17: Form of the Tempest
    Level 20: Burning Chi Fist
    Level 23: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Rank 2, Resurgent Reiki)
    Level 26: Smoke Bomb Lunge (Nailed to the Ground)
    Level 29: Dragon Uppercut (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 32: Masterful Dodge (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 35: Entangling Mesh
    Level 38: Shuriken Storm (Floating Butterfly)
    Adv. Points: 34/36

    Travel Powers
    Level 6: Swinging
    Level 35: Ninja Vanish

    Specializations
    Constitution: Fuel My Fire (2/3)
    Constitution: Tough (3/3)
    Constitution: Deflection (3/3)
    Constitution: Adrenaline Rush (2/2)
    Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
    Warden: Ruthless (2/2)
    Warden: Elusive (2/2)
    Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
    Vindicator: Aggressive Stance (2/2)
    Vindicator: Merciless (3/3)
    Vindicator: Focused Strikes (2/3)
    Vindicator: Mass Destruction (3/3)
    Mastery: Constitution Mastery (1/1)

    Devices

    Entangling Mesh is there for the theme, I can easily swap it out for SMoke bomb w/ concussive adv, or trip wire, or any other various useful powers. (I dont mind running two AD's, I just use whichever is more advantageous for the moment. I do it on a few toons. SO I could have both MD & Resurge, but Im low on points to rank them up)
    I chose Shuriken Storm for it's adv, and I like having a ranged att. Although I would prefer Ricochet Throw, but again, I'm running low on points, and prefer that pwr to be fully ranked. :)

    Everyone have a Happy Mardi Gras! (if you are anywhere near the south US!) ;)
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,859 Arc User
    edited February 2023
    Again, if you're not trying to tank high-end content, then any build w/ LR can be fine for a 'dodge tank', and you don't have to restrict it to dodge-based powers (ie. mostly Unarmed) if you don't want to. Regardless, ranking MD is a waste here since R1 should already put you past 100% dodge w/ R3 LR (+ some extra dodge from gear/specs). You could use that and/or dropping NttG on the lunge for more free adv points. R1 BCF also seems like a waste of a power slot here. The build also doesn't have any Challenge advs, which makes it less of a tank and more of a hybrid-dps (and not a great dps unit, at that), so I'm not quite sure what the goals for the build are here (skipping Challenge could work for a tank build that only does solo content, but not so much otherwise).
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
    LOL, I must have been doing this while very asleep, BCF should NOT be in there. :P
    Now I have to recall what WAS supposed to be there,... >_<
    (Seriously, cannot recall what I wanted, I was choosing between BCF & Dragon uppercut, chose uppercut for the knock/control)

    Other than LR being a def passive, does Tank mode help this to dodge/avoid at all? (I'm not seeing where it helps, except for HP and Aggro) If not I may just run him in hybrid.

    I'm playing with him now, just made lvl 15, if R1 MD puts me past 100% dodge, that is where I get my points for challenges :)

    Thx again!
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,859 Arc User
    edited February 2023
    Yea, the Tank role boosts your health, defense, and threat gen. It doesn't boost dodge/avoid. Hybrid role will instead boost dmg and healing, so if you want to solo and/or be a hybrid-dps then I'd just use that role. Con PSS is also less dps than taking something like Dex or Str PSS (and not taking the dodge/avoid options in Dex PSS- rather Deadly Aim and Expose Weakness), so you could change the SS setup, depending on your priorities.

    BCF could still have some use here, but mainly if you want its RF adv as an option to pull enemies into you. That said, you don't strictly need that functionality, and esp if keeping Shuriken Storm for wide AoE anyways. I may also consider just getting TKicks to R3, but that's up to you. A source for a Crushing debuff (Demolish, AP, or No Quarter) could also help here, and you'd have many options to pick from there.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • ragadolfragadolf Posts: 98 Arc User
    Gotcha,
    Thx again for the input Flow!
    happy Mardi Gras!
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