Queues for GCR and SCR

tilarta · March 2022

I investigated the sources of Gold Champions Recognition and could find no sources readily available as a means of casual play.
The purpose of this investigation was to find an efficient and quantifiable source of GCR for endgame gear.
According to my calculations, 1125 GCR in total is needed, 3x250, 3x125.

Since I could not find a source, I am proposing the introduction of queues specifically for the purpose of providing GCR.
Star Trek Online already has an equivalent system, their Reputation mark rewards for endgame related queues.
Each endgame queue provides a base value of 30 marks, which would be an suitable reward for the GCR queues I am suggesting.
SCR would also be needed as a second prize and questionite as a third prize, since the endgame gear also requires these ingame resources.

Since I do not approve of Cosmics, I will not use them as a source of GCR.

Telios Ascendent is the only other known source I could find, but I am uncertain if I want to spend the next 70 days doing it once per day.
I do it for fun, not to grind daily.

heartstringsk3 · March 2022

I'd at least like some kind of SCR currency trade option. Like say 5 Silver Champion tokens for 1 Gold Champion. That'd still take a good, long time to get the 100-250 you need per item/unlock.

jaazaniah1 · March 2022

I guess you will NEVER get your endgame gear. The devs have purposefully put that stuff in content that requires groups and some level of coordination. They simply don't want you to have access to that gear through casual play.

pantagruel01 · March 2022

I would note that there isn't much point to endgame gear if you reject doing endgame content.

tilarta · March 2022

Mostly it's for better survivability in story missions, since they upgraded the enemy damage there.
I think the open missions also got a damage upgrade.
And for the occasional Telios Ascended run I do.
There's probably some other stuff I haven't noticed yet.
So I had a theory that getting the gear would restore the balance and get my character back to equal gameplay with those enemies.

But since there are no alternative sources of GCR I could find, looks like the gear is inaccessible to me.

Games are built on casual players, I know the CO playerbase is very low in population because all the casuals left.
Someone even said so the other day "everybody knows everybody else in this game".

spookyspectre · March 2022

tilarta wrote: »

Mostly it's for better survivability in story missions, since they upgraded the enemy damage there.
I think the open missions also got a damage upgrade.
And for the occasional Telios Ascended run I do.
There's probably some other stuff I haven't noticed yet.
So I had a theory that getting the gear would restore the balance and get my character back to equal gameplay with those enemies.

But since there are no alternative sources of GCR I could find, looks like the gear is inaccessible to me.

Games are built on casual players, I know the CO playerbase is very low in population because all the casuals left.
Someone even said so the other day "everybody knows everybody else in this game".

Cosmics are really your best and fastest way to get GCR. If you can do TA runs, you should be fine to run Cosmics. If you prefer solo content, Legion gear from the Drifter store is the high tier alternative to GCR gear. Heroic gear is relatively good as well and can be purchased with SCR only. You can do casual, open missions and endgame content fine in Legion, Heroic gear and even blue gear for Cosmics. You may want to post your build to the forums to see if it can be optimized for current content. There have been a significant number of power changes over time and older optimized builds might benefit from a respec.

"Everybody knows everybody else in this game" only means the long term players recognize each other despite the suggestion there are no casual players in CO. I see new players and casual players all the time. If you're part of the main team chat channels and/or in a larger Super Group, you'll experience new and casual players as well.

warcanch · March 2022

pantagruel01 wrote: »

I would note that there isn't much point to endgame gear if you reject doing endgame content.

Except for the now over-tuned characters and NPCs that got buffed for various lairs/OMs/etc. These NPCs show up in casual content as over-tuned now, making them more difficult than they used to be.

tilarta · March 2022

Precisely, before the “overtuning”, I could stalemate OM Bludhound for 10 minutes, obliterate all 60 of the required OM Destroids solo and blitz through a instance without even making any effort.
After the change, I could do none of these things.
One of my longterm player friends (who could tank harder then I could) decided to test the OMs and after discovering the difficulty spike, left as fast as they returned.

The Telios Ascended bosses are nowhere in the same performance league as the Cosmics, a boss designed to fight 5 players is not even remotely as powerful as a boss who is designed to fight 30 players with juiced builds.
It’s like comparing a barracuda to a megalodon.
Which is why I stopped going, the frustration factor of getting one shotted through a Rank3 Block on a Tank got aggravating fast. Imagine how much worse it was when I tried to use my much less durable DPS.
Also, I don’t like having to wait around 4 hours for a Cosmic to activate.

To be direct, I lost interest in build advice because it was all variations on “make your Tank with only clicky buffs and minimal combat powers”.
My current build was optimized to be fun to play, because if I have to spend hours using it, I want to enjoy it, not be bored.

jaazaniah1 · March 2022

If you are having trouble surviving at cosmics with a dps (assuming there are some heals around) it's likely because you need to work on your block timing (same can be said for tanks, though there higher endgame gear is a solid help). Dps with some degree of familiarity can pretty regularly survive all the cosmics once they have the blocking down and have a R3 block. I see other people besides myself regularly surviving even with about 6K HP. Endgame gear does help with survival, but knowing the mechanics and how to deal with them is even more important. Even a tank with the best gear can die to dino on a missed block.

Just as an fyi, it is possible to get a complete set of heroic gear in a week, if you are willing to do the 2 sets of Ladyhawke missions, the QWZ, alerts and some Cosmics, and various pieces can also often be found in the Auction House. OSV secondaries are absurdly easy to acquire, just time consuming (remember that CO really stands for Collusion Online). Probably the most casual end game gear you can buy.

There was a time, before they were revamped, when individuals could solo Ape. No longer. Things change and players have to adapt.

pantagruel01 · March 2022

jaazaniah1 wrote: »

There was a time, before they were revamped, when individuals could solo Ape. No longer. Things change and players have to adapt.

Pre-revamp, you could solo any of the cosmics with sniper rifle -- except they were permanently camped so you couldn't find them.

tilarta · March 2022

It looks like an error of assumption has been made, I already knew most of what was stated above, I just don't find it interesting to play.

The major reason I avoid Cosmics is this, only the juiced players who score the highest get prizes and the high concentration of players in a confined area causes Server Lag to make a special appearance, throwing off the timing of my block by up to 2 seconds after I press the key when I see the tells.
In my personal experience, healers don't bother supporting DPS, they go stand around the tanks instead.
FYI, pre-revamp, my tanky friend punched Cosmics in the ankles until he broke their legs. It's not below the belt if that's as high as you can reach.

I'm currently doing the Ladyhawke mission chain, but it's an inconsistent experience.
The worst one is Talisbane, who does something that saps my health through a R3 block and R3 Regeneration.
I have to call for help each time her mission comes up.
Second worst one is the one involving the Lemurian open mission, the NPC enemies obliterate the group you have to protect instantly, so that's another one that can not be done alone.
Also, the missions are being given to me out of sequence, can't make sense of that. For example, I've played the final one and then had to play all the others!
Then came the most incomprehensible one, it asked me to play a Rampage that isn't even in the rotation! Someone told me it will be active this weekend. I don't think I've seen it in a month of gameplay, so it's foolish to use it as a mission goal.

I did do Onslaught for a while to earn Nuclear Shockwave, but by the time I'd earned it, I was screaming in my mind: makeitstopmakeitstopMAKEITSTOP!!! That's probably the specific event that caused me to abhor CO grinds.
And there were always players looking to ruin the experience, some tried to lure me to the turrets for an instant kill, other used some kind of invulnerability exploit to not be damaged.
I had to insist the players who came to me did so away from the turrets, of course the ones who wanted a cheapshot objected.
2 days ago, I saw another player get annoyed because someone using Medusa was spamming stuns, making it difficult for the players to fight back.

spookyspectre · March 2022

tilarta wrote: »

It looks like an error of assumption has been made, I already knew most of what was stated above, I just don't find it interesting to play.

The major reason I avoid Cosmics is this, only the juiced players who score the highest get prizes and the high concentration of players in a confined area causes Server Lag to make a special appearance, throwing off the timing of my block by up to 2 seconds after I press the key when I see the tells.
In my personal experience, healers don't bother supporting DPS, they go stand around the tanks instead.
FYI, pre-revamp, my tanky friend punched Cosmics in the ankles until he broke their legs. It's not below the belt if that's as high as you can reach.

Any missions that prioritized high score for rewards was changed several years ago. If you achieve the minimum score for an Open Mission, you have the same chances as everyone else to receive rewards. It's pretty easy to meet the minimum score these days to get those rewards.

There are settings options you can try if you're experiencing lag in team content. I suspect your video card may be having trouble keeping up vs server lag. I can see if I can find some forum article on those settings if you'd like. One I remember is to remove the comic style outline effect.

Healers should prioritize the main tank at Cosmics. If the main tank dies, everyone else usually does shortly after. Healers will help DPS as well, given there are enough healers in the teamup. Having some experience with healing at Cosmics, folks blocking during Kiga's storms helps greatly when there isn't an overabundance of healers. Low health/Defense folks that don't block can cause a healer to have to focus a lot of effort on one or two people at the expense of others. Folks can easily achieve the score needed for rewards so there's no good reason to not block during storms if they have low HP/Defense and no self heals.

Juiced players would be the ones that are filling essential roles at Cosmics (main tank, crowd controller, healers and high DPS for Dino). The essential roles do require making build and gear choices to be successful. There's usually plenty of room for non-optimized folks to participate and they do all the time. For a non-optimized tank at Kiga, switching to hybrid role and swapping out any gear with threat mods should allow you to score without pulling threat from the main tank. For Ape and Dino, a non-optimized tank can often help as a soak tank or baby Dino tank. For a non-optimized DPS it usually means they need to block at the right time. Having a Rank 3 block may be the single best way to increase someone's chances for success.

I'm currently doing the Ladyhawke mission chain, but it's an inconsistent experience.
The worst one is Talisbane, who does something that saps my health through a R3 block and R3 Regeneration.
I have to call for help each time her mission comes up.

She is tougher than bosses in older, un-revamped content. Try to move out of her AoE as quickly as possible when she casts it. She gets easier with practice and I have died/respawned multiple times in some fights. She can be annoying. Pets and/or friends can help.

Second worst one is the one involving the Lemurian open mission, the NPC enemies obliterate the group you have to protect instantly, so that's another one that can not be done alone.

This one is only meant to be team content and not solo-able. I've run it with 5 players in teamup. Folks will usually advertise in zone chat and/or a chat channel to get a group together.

Also, the missions are being given to me out of sequence, can't make sense of that. For example, I've played the final one and then had to play all the others!

The missions are repeatable and categorized in 3 mission arcs. Once you complete an arc, a new mission will become available that gives you additional rewards for running through that story arc again, as well as making the story arc missions and rewards available again. Confusing, yes, but great for farming SCR. I think the WCOC mission might pop up prematurely.

Then came the most incomprehensible one, it asked me to play a Rampage that isn't even in the rotation! Someone told me it will be active this weekend. I don't think I've seen it in a month of gameplay, so it's foolish to use it as a mission goal.

Yeah, doing the shark rampage is the final mission in the series and you need to wait until the rampage rolls around to do it. Other folks have been annoyed by that as well.

I did do Onslaught for a while to earn Nuclear Shockwave, but by the time I'd earned it, I was screaming in my mind: makeitstopmakeitstopMAKEITSTOP!!! That's probably the specific event that caused me to abhor CO grinds.
And there were always players looking to ruin the experience, some tried to lure me to the turrets for an instant kill, other used some kind of invulnerability exploit to not be damaged.
I had to insist the players who came to me did so away from the turrets, of course the ones who wanted a cheapshot objected.
2 days ago, I saw another player get annoyed because someone using Medusa was spamming stuns, making it difficult for the players to fight back.

Onslaught is a grind. It does give you great rewards with minimal effort other than patience. These days, folks will usually take out enough Until targets to complete the daily mission rather than engage players for kills. If they do, they often call out in zone that they are looking for kills, so players know what they are getting into if they engage. If you see someone say there's a POV in zone chat, it's a Passive Onslaught Villain that won't attack players and let them get their Guardian Tokens. I'll usually satisfy the daily Villain mission and they go passive in Ren Center for folks to get GTs for their daily mission. Using an Onslaught device only gives you 15 minutes before it expires. If the device expires, players get no extra GTs. If I dive on a turret before it expires, they get 30 extra GTs when the OV is killed.

jaazaniah1 · March 2022

The easiest way to take on Talisman is with a sidekick (or Friend) to help with the damage. If you are dps you have to block her Ebon Rift (the purple cloud) or you can die and you have to be savy about timing how you use your heals. Talisman can be soloed , but it does take some thinking about what you are doing. I was getting through the Serene Abyss chain of missions in about 20 minutes with a healer.

Really, you only want to do the first 2 Ladyhawke missions chains. As you have learned, the last one is a waste of time.

OSV is really easy if you have a friend who is also doing it. Knock out the 3 guardian things and then stand on the awning at Mercy Hospital (keeps you way from the turrets). Have your friend stand below and just keep killing your friend until done. Why Mercy? Because the respawn point is right there. I usually read news articles between friend kills; it's that brain dead simple. Then repeat for your freind to get tokens. Is it fun? No. Is it absurdly casual easy? Yes!

As spooky said, minimum score at cosmics to get the same prize as the top scorer is easy to achieve. Only 100K. The only people who don't usually make it are non lvl 40s and sometimes the baby tank, but that only on a very fast run. Even a slightly brain-damaged person playing with only one hand usually makes the minimum.

sergeantmahoff1 · March 2022

You can do anything in the game on mercenary gear.

warcanch · March 2022

sergeantmahoff1 wrote: »

You can do anything in the game on mercenary gear.

Nitpick: Any end-game content can be done with mercenary gear and r5 mods if you are a DPS. How effective you are depends more on you build: powers choices, ranks given, specializations, etc. And then how well you use them.

You won't be doing anyone any favors at the highest-end content if you show up as Tank or Healer with this gear, however.

I don't include the main trio of Cosmics as highest-end. I and plenty of others have successfully Main Tanked/Healed Dino, Ape, Kiga w/ just starting out level 40 basic blue gear.

But, for content where YOU are the only Tank or the only Healer, some of it really needs you to be better geared.

All that said, in general, Mahoff's point is valid.

jaazaniah1 · March 2022

Is there anything other than Therakiel's Temple and Eidolon (maybe?) where tanks and healers really need tip top gear and mods and maybe finely honed builds? Solo tanking dino in mercs with R5s can be done, but block timing has to be perfects and healers have to be on their toes. I'd say the main issue is if that tank can hold aggro. Gotta hope then that the high octane dps are sporting threat wipes and using them regularly,

But yes, the main point is that cosmics, TA, and lairs like Andrith are more casual friendly in terms of gear that what some might believe at first glance. Much can be achieved with a little practice and patience.

warcanch · March 2022

Another thing that helps is: knowledge.

Many of us have been here, doing these things, figuring out our builds & rotations for a long time. We have the experience/knowledge. And, of course, many are geared up.

But, we also play new characters with just basic gearing. The knowledge of what should/can/will work is a big factor in our success with low gearing.

pantagruel01 · March 2022

warcanch wrote: »

You won't be doing anyone any favors at the highest-end content if you show up as Tank or Healer with this gear, however.

A healer in blue primaries and generic purple secondaries would be totally adequate for cosmics or TA. For tanking, well, having enough toughness and threat to solo main tank a cosmic is gonna be quite difficult (I've tried it; it wasn't 100% fail but definitely high risk) but as long as overeager dps remember to use threat wipes it's sufficient for TA.

jaazaniah1 wrote: »

Is there anything other than Therakiel's Temple and Eidolon (maybe?) where tanks and healers really need tip top gear and mods and maybe finely honed builds?

In terms of raw numbers required, Eidolon isn't particularly harder than other cosmic, it just requires people to actually know what they're doing.

nbkxs · March 2022

How is this even a problem? These encounters are mostly effortless after a couple of times. It's easy enough to learn what's going on, and stay alive. Note that regen isn't a tanking passive really at all. You can get by with it, but you'll be much better off with soaks if you use that one, it doesn't provide the resist you need to endure bites from the dino specifically. Another alternative, even after the nerfs would be to get a sturdy vehicle like a tank, and put some guns on it. I think that you could probably still meet the minimum score with them in the time it takes for the ape, and dino to go down. And most certainly kiga. Talisman though? She's a face roll that lasts like 5 seconds at best if you hit her with a proper build. Sounds to me like it's your build, or refusal to adapt to current setups that's causing most of your problems.

spookyspectre · March 2022

For running into lag during Cosmics you can try adjusting some video settings. I posted a few below that may help. Hopefully, less lag will make Cosmics more enjoyable if you give them another try.

Options > Video > advanced settings > Troubleshooting > Video memory limit - 1024+

Options > Video > advanced settings > Effects > Comic-style outlining - Off
Options > Video > advanced settings > Effects > Screen-space ambient occlusion - Off

Options > Video > advanced settings > Performance > Antialiasing - 2x (medium quality)
Options > Video > advanced settings > Performance > Dynamic Lighting - Off
Options > Video > advanced settings > Performance > Shadows - Medium

Options > HUD > Show Team Damage Floaters - Off
Options > HUD > Show Player Damage Floaters - Off
Options > HUD > Show others' damage floaters - Off
Options > HUD > Show enemy healing floaters - Off
Options > HUD > Show created-entity floaters - Off
Options > HUD > Other Players > Show player name - Mouse Over, Targeted
Options > HUD > Other Players > Show player life - Mouse Over, Targeted

pantagruel01 · March 2022

Yeah, showing other player names is amazingly laggy for some reason.

Queues for GCR and SCR

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