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Is TT fun?

I was running TT quite a bit when it first came out. But, I've noticed that the folks I play with aren't keen to run it anymore. I kinda think it's a bit long, and just not very fun. Fights tend to be unforgiving and feel kinda sloggy. Any mistakes mean an auto restart without much (if any) chance of recovery.

Therakiel himself is a kinda fun fight... but the rest aren't fun for me really. And there is a bit too much pointless filler. Stretching out the slog.

I dunno if anyone else feels this way.
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Comments

  • ealford1985ealford1985 Posts: 3,582 Arc User
    Well some of the die hard elitist have said people are running it because it’s boring.

    So you probably have it right.
  • subjustsubjust Posts: 48 Arc User
    TT is a little too punishing and way to unrewarding IMO.

    I got burnt out on bringing my dodge tank after Baron would curse me and I had to pray for RNG that i wouldn’t get 1 shot when parry would drop off.

    I got burnt out on running it at all after 40ish clears and all i have to show is 1 aura, some mods i will never use and some recog. (You can only get GCR once a day from it, unlike TA’s 3 times a day). In fact the most useful thing I got from TT was was the healing potions.
  • avianosavianos Posts: 5,716 Arc User
    edited September 2020
    I only run it once and I have extremely mixed feelings and gameplay mechanics I complety despise and oppose!
    I can't say that I didn't enjoy it but there are a lot of things that bother me about it
    Keep in mind I went to the Lair fully prepared thanks to the Guides and 3 members who were experienced
    • It's extremely unforgiving as mentioned, No space for mistakes
    • I absolutely hate the game design of making bosses spawning endlessly mobs (one reason i hate Save the Earth too)
    • Baron Cimetiere absolutely Killed it for me! Endless waves of Zombies and Voodoo guys while having to keep in mind 3-4 different Boss Mechanics! All bosses have Spawn mob mechanics but Baron's are the WORST
      Dear DEVs, please STOP doing that! Find more creative ways to make Epic boss fights than endlessly spawn mobs and Knock+Hold Spam lock

      and while you are it, fix the god damn Save the Earth endless loop of mobs when a player agros them and move back to the hall-room
    • The rewards are not that good! I have a lot of the unlocks already before the On Alert removed then and the new costume unlocks are not really attractive! I don't find myself ever using those mods neither
      As for the DOOMSDAY CLOCK perk (Complete TT in under 1 hour with no defeats) not my thing! I use Perk-Titles for characters' Theme not for Novelty of Bragging rights
      Therakiel Sword is something I wanted for years but i'm not going down this Rabbit Hole

    Final Thoughts: I would GLADLY Sacrifice the Therakiel Temple Redux for 2 powerframe revamps, updates and more powers!

    Something of more meaningful update than this!
    People who begged for more Endgame content already abandomed it or haven't logged in the game since the Patriot Event and Vehicle NUCLEAR NERF (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻​​
    POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point
    Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies
    Playing since 1 February 2011 90+ Characters (7 ATs, 83 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
  • panthrax77panthrax77 Posts: 309 Arc User
    The problem I have with TT is, while it is very challenging and the fights are certainly engaging, it isn't really rewarding enough to want to run multiple times. The fact that drops are so RNG based makes it all the more draining when you strain so hard to complete it, only to get basically nothing useful. It's fun the first few times, but after you consistently get almost nothing rewarding for all that effort and all that time spent, the novelty wears off quickly.

    I found the alerts and rampage to be far more fun and worthwhile. They cut most of the fat from the lair, are far less time consuming, are still engaging enough to be fun and challenging, and are short enough to be run enough times that you get rewards that feel worth the effort.

    The lair either needs better base rewards for the amount of time and effort spent in a single sitting, or it needs to be adjusted to remove the things that drag it out to be the slog that it is.
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    So fun!
    [NbK]XStorm
  • guza22guza22 Posts: 2 Arc User
    TT became 2 ez
  • vonqballvonqball Posts: 875 Arc User
    guza22 wrote: »
    TT became 2 ez

    Wut?! It's the hardest piece of content we have. So, if you playing CO at all... then being EZ can't be the reason you aren't running TT. Are you trolling or just coolguy posturing? I iz confused.
  • qawsadaqawsada Posts: 727 Arc User
    It was pretty passable in the first couple weeks of release. However, the dev decided to keep buffing the Lair and "bug fix" some powers and devices to make it hard for the 3 groups that kept running it everyday. A combination of burn out (its uncommon that the players that were running the lair at the start of the release were running at +300 runs on average), "power fixes" (there were many powers and devices change or fix in the past couple of month due to TT itself), certain rewards not being release (TT was suppose to have their own shop and an armor set), buffing the bosses to make them harder (just because you figure out a boss doesn't mean the dev would do something to make it worse just to make you relearn the fight), and the vehicle nerf (not related to TT but it sure as hell piss off some of the TT runners to take a vacation or quit CO because they invested their resource to make their vehicle, and then watch them become worthless).

    All these changes will make it harder for new comers to come in since the players that usually train new players are gone, and if there is such a training run, it usually take 3-6 hours and they're not usually successful. The rewards are there, but its not enough for any new players to come in and get it. All these updated change make the run much longer and more annoying than it should be.

    It doesn't help that during this time, FF14 release a large QoL update that cause many of these TT players to play that, instead. At the same time, Sega got their heads out of their butts and release Steam PSO2, a game with a great character customization.
  • guza22guza22 Posts: 2 Arc User
    vonqball wrote: »
    guza22 wrote: »
    TT became 2 ez

    Wut?! It's the hardest piece of content we have. So, if you playing CO at all... then being EZ can't be the reason you aren't running TT. Are you trolling or just coolguy posturing? I iz confused.

    Who said i am not running TT i was in first team that got Deathless under 1 hour perk . It got ez becaus we started using troll builds we had people run pet dps builds , have tank in hybrid role whit dps passive , we were trolling each other in runs becaus it became too boring. " Any mistakes mean an auto restart without much (if any) chance of recovery." and whit what team u were running that u cant recover if tank or healer dies we had tank or healer die many times cuz they stopped paying attention like chating or simply alt tabed on You Tube chosing what music to listen and we would recover. Pick better team mates
  • vonqballvonqball Posts: 875 Arc User
    Coolguy posturing... thanks for clearing that up for me XD
  • themightyzeniththemightyzenith Posts: 4,599 Arc User
    edited September 2020
    "we were trolling each other in runs becaus it became too boring...they stopped paying attention like chating or simply alt tabed on You Tube chosing what music to listen"

    WaXbcGN.gif
    zrdRBy8.png
    Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,147 Arc User
    Huh. I can't really tell if more than a handful of people are running it now? I remember seeing a few call outs for players when it first went live, and I could see that people were running it, but the times I am on I am not seeing either of those now. The lack of rewards doesn't make it sound appetizing. At least the Alert versions are reasonably fun. I've only done the Rampage twice, but I found the color scheme hard on my eyes. Will give it another try when it comes around again.

    Speaking of which, is there a calendar somewhere that shows when the TT Alerts and Rampage will next be up? They aren't on the in game calendar.
    JwLmWoa.png
    Perseus, Captain Arcane, Tectonic Knight, Pankration, Siberiad, Sekhmet, Black Seraph, Clockwork
    Project Attalus: Saving the world so you don't have to!
  • ealford1985ealford1985 Posts: 3,582 Arc User
    I run it with no gear using Energy Builders....I’m that hardcore!
  • squirrelloidsquirrelloid Posts: 869 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    Huh. I can't really tell if more than a handful of people are running it now? I remember seeing a few call outs for players when it first went live, and I could see that people were running it, but the times I am on I am not seeing either of those now. The lack of rewards doesn't make it sound appetizing. At least the Alert versions are reasonably fun. I've only done the Rampage twice, but I found the color scheme hard on my eyes. Will give it another try when it comes around again.

    Speaking of which, is there a calendar somewhere that shows when the TT Alerts and Rampage will next be up? They aren't on the in game calendar.

    No one ever publicly looks for groups anymore.

    The few people who are still running it are doing it in small private groups. (I happen to have been invited to one, so i've run it recently). I occasionally see a few people gathered in front of Therakiel's church.

    Best guess, it gets run 1 to 3 times per day (total among all players) at best. I would not call this a success. Fundamentally, the problem is that most players can't do it at all, and one player who can't do it wrecks it for the whole team, so the players who can need to figure out who can do it and only run with those players. Which leads to small elitist cliques who privately do it.

    I did see @kamokami (i think) hosting some training runs at one point, but it was generally only through VS. Baron seems to be the hardest one, so many of the ones who successfully get through VS still won't be able to complete TT.

    And drop rewards are really sad. I haven't gotten a glowy drop yet. Considering its about an hour for a reasonable run, it's a lot of effort for what's mostly GCR/SCR on characters who probably have finished gearing.
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,147 Arc User
    Well, I guess if a few people are spending a lot of money on the game (or using lots of in game resources to buy lots of Zen from the players who sell Zen) it might be a success from the company's point of view?
    Best guess, it gets run 1 to 3 times per day (total among all players) at best. I would not call this a success. Fundamentally, the problem is that most players can't do it at all, and one player who can't do it wrecks it for the whole team, so the players who can need to figure out who can do it and only run with those players. Which leads to small elitist cliques who privately do it.
    JwLmWoa.png
    Perseus, Captain Arcane, Tectonic Knight, Pankration, Siberiad, Sekhmet, Black Seraph, Clockwork
    Project Attalus: Saving the world so you don't have to!
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    Fun? the thing is I got on this game to avoid this sort of content, but yet it came back to find me, yet again... think about it like this if you enjoy 2hours dinasaurs and kiga-T with his buggy Shenanigans, this whole lair run can be fun. otherwise, not so much.
  • ansemthedarkansemthedark Posts: 652 Arc User
    I still not get why we needed such change, this is still a story instance for lore, yet it needed this elite hardcore change, i only know the old one and upset i never will be able to run it again now, making it even harder to get anything in this game anymore, gold recongition and such need a daily options like Unity for solo players since such content is way to fast dead if not privat groups and running it each day.

    Didn't we had the difficult slider for those instances also? Why this rework at all? We getting a rework liek this finally and it is crap, good ot knwo all the money and effort flows still in STO and NWO and CO once again left behind. At least our money is worth it, right Cryptic/PWE? Greedy scumbacks, all i can call them today by now.
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    I still not get why we needed such change, this is still a story instance for lore, yet it needed this elite hardcore change, i only know the old one and upset i never will be able to run it again now, making it even harder to get anything in this game anymore, gold recongition and such need a daily options like Unity for solo players since such content is way to fast dead if not privat groups and running it each day.

    Didn't we had the difficult slider for those instances also? Why this rework at all? We getting a rework liek this finally and it is crap, good ot knwo all the money and effort flows still in STO and NWO and CO once again left behind. At least our money is worth it, right Cryptic/PWE? Greedy scumbacks, all i can call them today by now.

    they mostly were trying to please a crowd but really the WRONG Crowd since these are the same people who want this game be elitist heaven don't care if it makes it into a casual hell...
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    It's really not that bad. We managed to get another flawless <1hour attempt a couple days back.

    1. Everyone needs to be on the same page, and know what to do.
    2. DPS needs to be top-tier w/heavy focus on aoe.
    3. Make sure you're max-geared, w/full mods. 7s at the very least.
    4. Make sure you know your build, and know when to be where.
    5. Use voice chat to get everything to where you can manage it - this will make it infinitely easier to learn the routine.
    [NbK]XStorm
  • leuchadegoutiereleuchadegoutiere Posts: 136 Arc User
    Improve.
    @Leucha - Cascade, Praise, Gluh, Sanglots, Chernozem, Saadhaka, Ralsershei, La Lice, Cardinale and so on
  • aluze21aluze21 Posts: 8 Arc User
    Fun? the thing is I got on this game to avoid this sort of content, but yet it came back to find me, yet again... think about it like this if you enjoy 2hours dinasaurs and kiga-T with his buggy Shenanigans, this whole lair run can be fun. otherwise, not so much.

    Both of the issues you mentioned here are user caused, ie. players having bad builds and not knowing how to play them

    they mostly were trying to please a crowd but really the WRONG Crowd since these are the same people who want this game be elitist heaven don't care if it makes it into a casual hell...

    "I don't like this cause it makes me feel bad, therefore it's WRONG!"
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    \
    aluze21 wrote: »
    Fun? the thing is I got on this game to avoid this sort of content, but yet it came back to find me, yet again... think about it like this if you enjoy 2hours dinasaurs and kiga-T with his buggy Shenanigans, this whole lair run can be fun. otherwise, not so much.

    Both of the issues you mentioned here are user caused, ie. players having bad builds and not knowing how to play them

    they mostly were trying to please a crowd but really the WRONG Crowd since these are the same people who want this game be elitist heaven don't care if it makes it into a casual hell...

    "I don't like this cause it makes me feel bad, therefore it's WRONG!"

    Look at like this if we have a large group of people Who don't want to make good builds, Then what? are we going to report them? like there are guides on how to make OP Build meanwhile, this rarely being looked at, not like it a rule or thing that have to be done.

    another thing kiga being as buggy as he is isn't NOT something to say as a "user Caused", Last time I check he wasn't like this in 2018 or 2017 or way back then...

    ALSO for the information you presented, Wouldnt that mean Team base content isn't suitable for this game? don't you agree? as of now a lot of content is LOCKED due to it being Player Gated and need to GitGud.

    BTW if you want to play a serious game then go play a serious game [LOTS out There}, Just don't do something so selfish as to turn to fit your own desires at the cost of someone else's.
  • squirrelloidsquirrelloid Posts: 869 Arc User
    edited October 2020
    Baron still feels really overtuned. Bad lag the last couple days caused a fail on a TT run because we couldn't get through Baron. One half second lag spike and you can't move in time for a baron call out, one person dies and the team wipes. And half a second of lag is nowhere close to as bad as the lag can get in the game. Not being able to rez makes this fight a disaster if the servers get laggy.

    The rest of the fights seem manageable even with laggy servers, assuming over-tuned top builds and minimum R7 mods + gcr gear.

    (It's not my machine. My machine is less than a year old and pretty high end - should be able to run 8 CO instances simultaneously with no issue, much less one.)
  • subjustsubjust Posts: 48 Arc User
    There was a lot of chatter a few months back about new endgame gear being added via a currency from TT.

    Did anything like that ever happen or is it still just cosmetics and the defensive core?
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    subjust wrote: »
    There was a lot of chatter a few months back about new endgame gear being added via a currency from TT.

    Did anything like that ever happen or is it still just cosmetics and the defensive core?

    that was a long time ago and nothing happened so far and the alert versions of this lair are gone now unknown when it ever returns.
  • aluze21aluze21 Posts: 8 Arc User
    New TT gear was promised via official Discord chat in the same vein Personal Magnifiers were promised in the official Discord.

    That was 2 years ago, there should be a topic somewhere around with the timer unless the artist censored it
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,147 Arc User
    I just hope that the dozen of so people running it are putting a lot of money into the game in order to justify the dev time that went in to it.
    JwLmWoa.png
    Perseus, Captain Arcane, Tectonic Knight, Pankration, Siberiad, Sekhmet, Black Seraph, Clockwork
    Project Attalus: Saving the world so you don't have to!
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    I just hope that the dozen of so people running it are putting a lot of money into the game in order to justify the dev time that went in to it.

    You're not the only one, really I hope for this in general...
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    0$ so far, and pretty sure the others are 0$ also for the most part.
    [NbK]XStorm
  • panthrax77panthrax77 Posts: 309 Arc User
    So having done it over 20 times now, I can update my previous thoughts on this.

    I feel like it's a fun lair, and has some of the best gameplay available in parts. But it's definitely overtuned in one regard, and that's mobs. The bosses, for the most part, are manageable and not that scary. The scariest part is when you're suddenly swimming in mobs and have to deal with them quickly.

    To be fair, it's nice that AoEs finally have a purpose somewhere in endgame content, but it's way too much imo. You don't need 30 werewolves to pop out of Black Fang's poopshoot in the last second, or Baron to suddenly gain 40 backup dancers. The worst examples are Baron and Vladic. While Vladic doesn't have a lot of dangerous mobs, the bats he summons very frequently heal enormously (and for some reason aren't affected by pestilence's healing reduction). So you're forced to not only get big AoEs, but charged nukes.

    The result is that you're forced to bring big DPS, specifically ones with lots of nuking ability, and that means having 3 people in a party with force cascade and night warrior. Which is sadly pretty limiting, but usually what happens. It's possible to do it without that, of course, but it makes it a heck of a lot harder.

    The worst part though is the healer gets absolutely screwed. The sheer volume of mobs make it impossible to bring anything but the most polished healer in your arsenal, fully kitted with devices and endgame gear. No other role has to be nearly as well-equipped.

    All of these issues could be easily resolved by knocking down the mobs a bit and maybe increasing the timer a tad. It would still keep it challenging while making it possible to diversify a team more, with things like an OT or CCer.

    But despite the flaws, on a tank or DPS, it's still fun to do, and Therakiel is still the most fun boss battle in the game imo. It could definitely be polished though, and it wouldn't take much to really improve it.
  • lunnylunnylunnylunny Posts: 186 Arc User
    edited October 2020
    panthrax77 wrote: »


    I'll double what he's said. Therakiel Lair is fun, one of the most interesting mechanics and fights in the game by a landslide.

    Issue right now is how hard mobs hit/how many mobs there are, as in every boss fight(except Vlad and technically Therakiel) the healer gets swarmed and, if not way prepared to be super defensive, they get absolutely destroyed within less than a second. Having to do it with AoRP and an Active Defense, plus a lot of devices and defensive modding seems overkill for healer difficulty.

    It's also not very rewarding right now. I understand that some of the promised rewards couldn't be put in just yet, and I'm fine with that. I'm also fine with it not rewarding SCR/GCR too much, as the lair is meant to be end of endgame kind of difficulty, but right now it feels as if you didn't get a shiny, you just wasted 30~1h for nothing- which on itself is fine, but not when it happens 20 times in a row with no shiny.

    Edit: Admitedly, while most people doing TT wont care about this, the resource income from it is actually pretty nice though.
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    I agree, at least you come out w/~50 gold for your effort.
    [NbK]XStorm
  • diggotdiggot Posts: 309 Arc User
    All PVE dungeon-content in CO outright SUCKS because they have no real loot as reward,
    there are no gear that drops which is an improvement for what you could have.
    There is no reason AT ALL to play any dungeons in CO.
  • lunnylunnylunnylunny Posts: 186 Arc User
    diggot wrote: »
    All PVE dungeon-content in CO outright SUCKS because they have no real loot as reward,
    there are no gear that drops which is an improvement for what you could have.
    There is no reason AT ALL to play any dungeons in CO.

    ...actually most of them do have some gear loot to get. TT is the only one, since it was planned to be added in release but had to be delayed considering how much was added in the release, and that is not surprising considering that it's the hardest lair in the game, the gear drops need to be good, but also can't be outrageously better than anything else ever. Balancing is more complicated than one would think.

    Also that is a silly way of thinking, because people can do whatever they want for their own enjoyment. Many of us were here pre-mechanon release and all we really had to do was Nemcon for Questionite, and we stuck around for like two years of nothing new to do.

    Similarly, MOBAs, including Battle Royales, do not have 'gear drops' and people still play them, so your arguement is invalid even if it was true, as people can still do TT if there are other rewards to take from it, or simply the joy of playing something tougher.

    After all, this is all just a game, the end result is to keep us enjoyed in some shape or form.
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    diggot wrote: »
    Quote

    sadly, you go into any lair [Mostly the revamps] there really isn't that much of a reward, none that account for Globals, or having "USEFUL" items to sell.

    lunnylunny wrote: »
    diggot wrote: »
    All PVE dungeon-content in CO outright SUCKS because they have no real loot as reward,
    there are no gear that drops which is an improvement for what you could have.
    There is no reason AT ALL to play any dungeons in CO.

    ...actually most of them do have some gear loot to get. TT is the only one, since it was planned to be added in release but had to be delayed considering how much was added in the release, and that is not surprising considering that it's the hardest lair in the game, the gear drops need to be good, but also can't be outrageously better than anything else ever. Balancing is more complicated than one would think.

    Also that is a silly way of thinking, because people can do whatever they want for their own enjoyment. Many of us were here pre-mechanon release and all we really had to do was Nemcon for Questionite, and we stuck around for like two years of nothing new to do.

    Similarly, MOBAs, including Battle Royales, do not have 'gear drops' and people still play them, so your arguement is invalid even if it was true, as people can still do TT if there are other rewards to take from it, or simply the joy of playing something tougher.

    After all, this is all just a game, the end result is to keep us enjoyed in some shape or form.

    But your argument is even more invalid.

    Yall never cease to amaze how selfish you guys are, I'm always LMAO on people going "there Isn't anything to do within this game", "why are you playing this boring game?" Meanwhile, I'm trying to grind Globals, finding items to sell on the market, Exploring the Content within this game, looking for lore with friends, trying to get perks unlocked, trying to get all the items that I can, and go on a killing spree On NPC's...

    LOL if you find the game boring back then should have GTFO, Play another GAME, Stop trying to turn this game into something that only YOU will Enjoy if not very few, I'm pretty sure they're like 20 who like the TT Vs 100+ who don't care if it goes back where was in 2017.

    Battle royal... ALOT of People hate battle royals it a reason why people hate Fortnite, LULZ and people hate MOBAS, I DONT WANT THIS GAME TO BE AN BATTLE ROYAL [unless I can turn it off] OR MOBA, if want these things I will just install them and play them. They are Free to Play, After all, I played HOTS, I play PALA, the last thing I want is for this game to Be one of those games.

    And one more thing... This Isn't a lair that has an ALTERNATIVE of being done, unlike Teleios Ascendant, with its EPIC and NONE EPIC lair option THAT is part of a mission Chain quest, this is technically being forced down our Throats...

    and one more, maybe they working on it [Or they should be working on it], but I TRULY HOPE they get it done before, April the 1st.

    [we should have been this option way before the alert Version TT went off...]
  • ansemthedarkansemthedark Posts: 652 Arc User
    diggot wrote: »
    Quote

    sadly, you go into any lair [Mostly the revamps] there really isn't that much of a reward, none that account for Globals, or having "USEFUL" items to sell.

    lunnylunny wrote: »
    diggot wrote: »
    All PVE dungeon-content in CO outright SUCKS because they have no real loot as reward,
    there are no gear that drops which is an improvement for what you could have.
    There is no reason AT ALL to play any dungeons in CO.

    ...actually most of them do have some gear loot to get. TT is the only one, since it was planned to be added in release but had to be delayed considering how much was added in the release, and that is not surprising considering that it's the hardest lair in the game, the gear drops need to be good, but also can't be outrageously better than anything else ever. Balancing is more complicated than one would think.

    Also that is a silly way of thinking, because people can do whatever they want for their own enjoyment. Many of us were here pre-mechanon release and all we really had to do was Nemcon for Questionite, and we stuck around for like two years of nothing new to do.

    Similarly, MOBAs, including Battle Royales, do not have 'gear drops' and people still play them, so your arguement is invalid even if it was true, as people can still do TT if there are other rewards to take from it, or simply the joy of playing something tougher.

    After all, this is all just a game, the end result is to keep us enjoyed in some shape or form.

    But your argument is even more invalid.

    Yall never cease to amaze how selfish you guys are, I'm always LMAO on people going "there Isn't anything to do within this game", "why are you playing this boring game?" Meanwhile, I'm trying to grind Globals, finding items to sell on the market, Exploring the Content within this game, looking for lore with friends, trying to get perks unlocked, trying to get all the items that I can, and go on a killing spree On NPC's...

    LOL if you find the game boring back then should have GTFO, Play another GAME, Stop trying to turn this game into something that only YOU will Enjoy if not very few, I'm pretty sure they're like 20 who like the TT Vs 100+ who don't care if it goes back where was in 2017.

    Battle royal... ALOT of People hate battle royals it a reason why people hate Fortnite, LULZ and people hate MOBAS, I DONT WANT THIS GAME TO BE AN BATTLE ROYAL [unless I can turn it off] OR MOBA, if want these things I will just install them and play them. They are Free to Play, After all, I played HOTS, I play PALA, the last thing I want is for this game to Be one of those games.

    And one more thing... This Isn't a lair that has an ALTERNATIVE of being done, unlike Teleios Ascendant, with its EPIC and NONE EPIC lair option THAT is part of a mission Chain quest, this is technically being forced down our Throats...

    and one more, maybe they working on it [Or they should be working on it], but I TRULY HOPE they get it done before, April the 1st.

    [we should have been this option way before the alert Version TT went off...]

    Could had been worder better but i can only fully agree, the worst for me is i play the game for like 11 years now, yet never managed to get Gold Recognitionsm simply due how hard it is to get to such with people aksing for specific builds for such, even outside in the Open World stuff, i wish there would be a simple Solo or atleast 2 man option for those lairs by now, i would like ot get some costumes and powers for once considering how much they cost.

    This whole elitism not fits here, and for god sake isn't that what we had the Difficult setting for lairs? Why not simply added another step there for those instead. I am tired of such games personally that try to satisfy the elites so much, people play games to relax, casuals are the norm as much people not want to hear this and saying those take the fun of games if all gets casualized, but no one has so much time today anymore for an hour dungeon and such, on top of real life.

    I not want all handed on a plate of course but with so much variety in this game i should not need to be a try hard elite to beat some old or revently new or reworked content, this is what hard modes are for like we normally ahd with difficult setting. Not this elite lair rework crap we getting lately just because people abuse all and manage to get so much power out a build that it trivializes all. Mods made it worse going up to rank 9 which is way to much, considering everything else is ok with rank 5 in my eyes, nothing against getting stronger but this would need new content with higher level, not reworking old stuff into such, add elite modes sure but not force it down our troaths*
  • pantagruel01pantagruel01 Posts: 7,091 Arc User
    edited October 2020

    Could had been worder better but i can only fully agree, the worst for me is i play the game for like 11 years now, yet never managed to get Gold Recognitionsm simply due how hard it is to get to such with people aksing for specific builds for such, even outside in the Open World stuff
    Requirements to get GCR:
    1. Show up at a Cosmic.
    2. Be minimally competent.
    The threshold for getting rewards in cosmics is very low.
  • ansemthedarkansemthedark Posts: 652 Arc User

    Could had been worder better but i can only fully agree, the worst for me is i play the game for like 11 years now, yet never managed to get Gold Recognitionsm simply due how hard it is to get to such with people aksing for specific builds for such, even outside in the Open World stuff
    Requirements to get GCR:
    1. Show up at a Cosmic.
    2. Be minimally competent.
    The threshold for getting rewards in cosmics is very low.

    Considering how often i see people argue and trolls making it fail on purpose, no, it is not, not relyable, i would simply prefer a simple UNITY mission, the end mission should give some simply.
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    Those are way, way WAY too easy to give this kind of rec, if you want decent stuff, you're going to have to work for it.
    [NbK]XStorm
  • ansemthedarkansemthedark Posts: 652 Arc User
    edited October 2020
    nbkxs wrote: »
    Those are way, way WAY too easy to give this kind of rec, if you want decent stuff, you're going to have to work for it.

    The typical answerto "i had it hard so no one sohuld had it easier" even if it is old by now and natural to lower prices or make it easier. I not say handing it off, if i do UNITY and take the same amount of time as a Lair i should get the same things right?

    I also worked for it there then, Lairs can sitll ahve additional drops after all right? Stop beeing so elite and let people have fun at there own pace, guess while we at it let put rewards in PvP more, also working for it or so is it?

    People react like i asked for handing it free, i still work for it trough missions after all and invest time. Stop being so selfish.

    Consdier this also, Bloodmoon also has simple dailies and harder grind with the crypts in a way also, yet both give same tokens after all. Just different ways you can eather do both or stay with a way like PvP as example. I not see why we can't have this for Gold Recognitions as well besides Lairs that are made elite for the sake of it desptie us having a difficult setting for exactly this and World bosses people often screw up on purpose.

    If people want it harder, be my guest, unequip all your fance hig end gear and mods and do the stuff and feel challange,d but not force it on others who simply want to unlock things becauses they have fun creating characters and cotumes and not try to be a elite who is full of himself because they can hit something harder then others because of some abusing copy build every second player uses for such by now.
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,147 Arc User
    Cosmics are VERY, VERY easy to get rewards for. Anyone can do them (which some see as a problem). In the thousands of cosmics I've done I've personally only had real troll problems on a handful of attempts. Arguments or anger over undergeared, underperforming characters are not at all common. Have you even given cosmics a decent try? Everyday I'd wager that 20+ cosmics get completed by all manner of builds. I am by no means an elite player, and if I can contribute meaningfully, then just about any one can, who at least gives them an earnest try.

    Note too that QWZ does give gcr. You can always solo those or find a buddy.

    Events are NOT a good comparison since they don't provide endgame gear.

    Could had been worder better but i can only fully agree, the worst for me is i play the game for like 11 years now, yet never managed to get Gold Recognitionsm simply due how hard it is to get to such with people aksing for specific builds for such, even outside in the Open World stuff
    Requirements to get GCR:
    1. Show up at a Cosmic.
    2. Be minimally competent.
    The threshold for getting rewards in cosmics is very low.

    Considering how often i see people argue and trolls making it fail on purpose, no, it is not, not relyable, i would simply prefer a simple UNITY mission, the end mission should give some simply.

    JwLmWoa.png
    Perseus, Captain Arcane, Tectonic Knight, Pankration, Siberiad, Sekhmet, Black Seraph, Clockwork
    Project Attalus: Saving the world so you don't have to!
  • vonqballvonqball Posts: 875 Arc User
    The only issue I see with making GCR available to farm solo ez mode, is that it would probably make it harder to find teams to do lairs, get people organized for cosmics, etc.

    Might still work if the solo method took alot longer, and therefore much less efficent. I'd like to see it, but I think there is a balance point there somewhere which should be respected.
  • squirrelloidsquirrelloid Posts: 869 Arc User
    vonqball wrote: »
    The only issue I see with making GCR available to farm solo ez mode, is that it would probably make it harder to find teams to do lairs, get people organized for cosmics, etc.

    Might still work if the solo method took alot longer, and therefore much less efficent. I'd like to see it, but I think there is a balance point there somewhere which should be respected.

    All these things are still a limited number of times per day. Cosmics would still get done cause they'd probably have the best reward and 3x per day. No one does TT for the GCR - it's about chance of rare drops. That just leaves TA, which seems to only get done because people run out of other ways to get GCR. (And the Long War, which i'm sure someone does, but i hate QWZ dailies, and the people who do it probably do it solo). I'm pretty sure that's it for sources of GCR right now, and adding a way to get a little GCR solo for casual players wouldn't really compete with any of those.
  • pantagruel01pantagruel01 Posts: 7,091 Arc User
    That just leaves TA, which seems to only get done because people run out of other ways to get GCR.
    With a team that knows what it's doing, TA is faster than cosmics.
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,147 Arc User
    I do the QWZ almost daily because endgame gear costs 2 scr per 1 gcr and QWZ is the quickest way to get enough scr. Getting the 5 gcr after getting 120 scr is really an afterthought. I actually like the missions well enough (and, yes, I try to solo them for the challenge, but do often invite people, but often no takers). I absolutely hate the look of the QWZ. It is hard on my eyes. What I personally would like to see is the Unity missions get revamped to have the same sort of difficulty as the QWZ with about the same amount of reward.
    (And the Long War, which i'm sure someone does, but i hate QWZ dailies, and the people who do it probably do it solo). I'm pretty sure that's it for sources of GCR right now, and adding a way to get a little GCR solo for casual players wouldn't really compete with any of those.

    Well, it depends on the team doing cosmics ;). I think we did all 3 this week one time in ca. 45 minutes.
    That just leaves TA, which seems to only get done because people run out of other ways to get GCR.
    With a team that knows what it's doing, TA is faster than cosmics.
    JwLmWoa.png
    Perseus, Captain Arcane, Tectonic Knight, Pankration, Siberiad, Sekhmet, Black Seraph, Clockwork
    Project Attalus: Saving the world so you don't have to!
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »

    Well, it depends on the team doing cosmics ;). I think we did all 3 this week one time in ca. 45 minutes.
    That just leaves TA, which seems to only get done because people run out of other ways to get GCR.
    With a team that knows what it's doing, TA is faster than cosmics.

    Well With the Right Team it should take NO more than 5 minutes to take down like any Individual cosmics, Kiga-T, Quijaboi ape, and dinaBSaurs take a total of 15 to 20 minutes, so I don't see how 45 minutes is a big deal or TA being any faster then Cosmics, Meanwhile TT is something may last longer than an hour. if not half of that.

    Far I ever have seen, people doing TA merely Due to having Diminishing Reward CoolDown on Cosmics instead of doing because it faster the said cosmics, Never once in my life heard of this or seen a case of this in my playtime, and I have done runs without any reset or Errors.

    Also to add one more thing into the fire, theses kind of content is not that needed, this game was doing Fine without them so I don't see how it would make an impact if there was none to less of them if you look at it really the game seems to be unable to handle the current Team content within this game as of now compare a few years back, and also for what I been seeing on the forums no one is happy with the current "Balance" *Cough* Nerfs *Cough* we have of now, some of these people who on the forums that I rarely see playing this game or doing said mention Content above wanted more of those "balance" changes could be problematic down the road if you think about it...
  • pantagruel01pantagruel01 Posts: 7,091 Arc User
    Well With the Right Team it should take NO more than 5 minutes to take down like any Individual cosmics
    There are a couple of major factors that increase the time requirement by a lot:
    • You have to wait around for them to spawn.
    • The 'right team' to do cosmics in 5m is around 20, which takes a while to gather. Gathering 5 is way easier.
    • Cosmics can easily slow down enormously because of negatively useful people (at Kiga, people who die, let pets hit dogs, pull adds up to harass the CC, etc; at Qwyjibo, people who hit hearts; at Teleiosaurus, anyone who can't pull their weight in a dps check)
  • nbkxsnbkxs Posts: 752 Arc User
    We need more of it actually. You could delete most everything else in the game, and no one would miss it. Because it's all garbo fodder.
    [NbK]XStorm
  • vonqballvonqball Posts: 875 Arc User
    edited October 2020
    TA can consistently get done pretty quickly. Cosmics can be very fast... or horrendously slow. TA also has a pretty decent drop rate on the secondary gear. If TT had a reasonable drop rate, I would probably feel more positive about it.
  • mastercontrol7mastercontrol7 Posts: 180 Arc User
    @pantagruel01

    Wrong, since you said
    With a team that knows what it's doing, TA is faster than cosmics.

    VS
    Well With the Right Team it should take NO more than 5 minutes to take down like any Individual cosmics.

    When I said the right Team I mean and saying the Right team for the job, the dream team you will choose for the job, that would include people that know what they are doing, I feel sad I have to explain that.

    There are a couple of major factors that increase the time requirement by a lot:
    [*]You have to wait around for them to spawn.

    how is this even relevant? when you can do cosmics 3-6 times a day within an hour time frame.

    This REASON Why you do KIGA> APE> DINO low Waiting time... *sigh*
    CCer> CCer> DPS> Repeat<
    [*]The 'right team' to do cosmics in 5m is around 20, which takes a while to gather. Gathering 5 is way easier.

    the reason why I throw in 20 and 15 minutes for the whole 3 cosmics run it can also be done with 10 people or less with the right team step up, AND ALSO This can be said for TA since I have seen people go on for 20 to 5 mins asking people to join for TA...that's time taken away.
    [*]Cosmics can easily slow down enormously because of negatively useful people (at Kiga, people who die, let pets hit dogs, pull adds up to harass the CC, etc; at Qwyjibo, people who hit hearts; at Teleiosaurus, anyone who can't pull their weight in a dps check)


    That is Very irrelevant, Soo TA is immune to human error you saying? meanwhile, you have Grond being Notorious of the hardest thing to tank, I see cases where Healers/Dps Dies over and over again due to them not block or trying to rez someone, or gravitar with people not be able moving away from the Death sphere [cute yellow spheres] on time, and people starting baby dino early all because of a misclick on the keyboard, Also but not least medusa because someone grabs too many bombs or they missed one, Granddaddy of problems, Teleios that's a nuffsed right there, I been on TA that last for hours, all because someone quit and we have to find a replacement for him/her.

    Also, I know you made the case of
    With a team that knows what it's doing, TA is faster than cosmics.
    but also said
    Well With the Right Team it should take NO more than 5 minutes to take down like any Individual cosmics.

    so the stuff you mentioned is kinda irrelevant, But the thing is you could say for cosmics is the same you could say for TA and other content like Therakel temple.
    nbkxs wrote: »
    We need more of it actually. You could delete most everything else in the game, and no one would miss it. Because it's all garbo fodder.

    I highly disagree, since with the case that @pantagruel01 brought up people would have to be "pull their weight", yet we can't control who can do cosmics or not, and nerfs are a thing, Trolling is EZ thing To do, and takes to long for anything to be done about it or if you can bring up proof to have something done about it or anything be done about it at all... Please don't think lairs are protected from this issue, is a reason why people do Secret runs, as mentioned before that people do on this Discussion. this kinda stuffs something that only a few would even do really, so I resume to Disagree even more. theses thing was never really That a big deal, it would have been good for like a year or lasting for every 3-5 months a year or an optional, but like these lairs are going to GET boring just like Cosmics are boring, revamping content don't entertain anyone, but the people who want to do them for bragging rights. And TT with the way it is and with player pop that within this game, why?. what is TT is for? not for me. not for anyone else who been dealing with the nerfs that had been hands down awful, not for people who play this game for fun... even if you say it FUN For You. how long would it be till you get sick of it? This is just one Lair we have gotten revamp this year, not two[thxgod], LOL this lair leads to even more problems, that I would love to see how would it get handled... So I can't see the point of these's content, at least get Priorities in order for once before having such content within the game... And I once defended the idea of how Cosmics and Team content are before but, never would have thought the devs would just keep relying on revamping content to please a small crowd Barely do much for this game as it is... :/
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