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Forums > Home› Champions Online Discussion

The day the Questionite economy crashed

spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
edited November 2019 in Champions Online Discussion
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It's been trending towards this for a long time, and now we've finally arrived. The potential bad news here is that because there seems to be no plan to raise the value of questionite by releasing highly desirable items that cost questionite only, and instead focus on cosmic key sales, this trend is going to continue in this direction. So yes the exchange will recover and offers will reappear, but it also means this will happen again, and that it will likely happen more and more frequently with the passage of time. What happens when F2P players see their ability to convert questionite into zen reduced more and more?
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Comments

  • pantagruel01pantagruel01 Posts: 7,091 Arc User
    The easiest thing for them to do would be changing the cap on Q per Z to something like 1,000.
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  • kallethenkallethen Posts: 1,576 Arc User
    Oh god please no, we don't need that. That would make the problem worse, not better.​​
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    pantagruel01 wrote: »
    The easiest thing for them to do would be changing the cap on Q per Z to something like 1,000.

    now taking bets on how fast the price would hit 1000
    at which point the problem would resume, but in a worse state.

    The real solution is to make it so you can convert Questionite to Zen even if there aren't any offers up. Make it cost 600q per point of zen if there aren't any offers, first offer put up goes to 500. That way no matter what, the ability to convert never goes away.
    Squishy DPS builds that can solo QWZ w/videos.
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  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    Will all the F2Pers just leave, or will they start to kick some money in? I guess time will tell.

    I highly doubt that the devs are going to give free zen away.
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  • pantagruel01pantagruel01 Posts: 7,091 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    now taking bets on how fast the price would hit 1000
    at which point the problem would resume, but in a worse state.
    That would be a clear indication that there's not enough in the q store, as opposed to q just getting slowly devalued as new sources are made available, which is relatively normal mudflation (the reason it hasn't happened to globals is because there's actually been more removal of G sources than addition of new sources).
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  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    There's just not that much that I want to buy from the Q store on a regular basis, so the Q builds up, and then the only thing to do with it is to buy Zen. Not sure the devs through through what would happen to the economy when they made Q so plentiful. Unless they make stuff in the Q store more worth having (thus depleting the Q reserves out there) I don't know what can be done.
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  • cashrecashre Posts: 3 Arc User
    Do you guys know how long the exchange will be down for? I am new to the game, and I don't want to have a lifetime subscription and I like to grind for questionite to get enough zen to open up another character slot and be able to play any class I want
  • themightyzeniththemightyzenith Posts: 4,599 Arc User
    It's not down
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    cashre wrote: »
    Do you guys know how long the exchange will be down for? I am new to the game, and I don't want to have a lifetime subscription and I like to grind for questionite to get enough zen to open up another character slot and be able to play any class I want

    It's not down, it's just that any time someone puts up Zen for sale it gets bought out within a very short period of time and then there's no Zen up for sale until players put more up. They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
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  • wingedkagoutiwingedkagouti Posts: 565 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    spinnytop wrote: »
    They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
    Except those 7 items (3 Travel Power Devices and 4 Travel powers) will only be available for this weekend, so they will not cause any kind of long term change. Especially since their price is so far beyond what the vast majority would consider paying, heck the 6 "cheap" ones equate to 4000 Zen at the best exchange rate if you have Zen. The expensive one is equivalent to 12000 Zen.
  • cashrecashre Posts: 3 Arc User
    whats the best price to sell my questionite for if I want to make some good zen? what best exchange rate to get it sold
  • themightyzeniththemightyzenith Posts: 4,599 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    cashre wrote: »
    whats the best price to sell my questionite for if I want to make some good zen? what best exchange rate to get it sold



    You look at the offers of people Selling Zen in the exchange and base it on that...

    bv4fkxz.png



    Or you put in a more favourable exchange rate for yourself and wait and see if any Zen shows up at that rate, like the following offers...

    UyWQPIj.png



    These images are the Q Exchange a few minutes ago.


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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
    Except those 7 items (3 Travel Power Devices and 4 Travel powers) will only be available for this weekend, so they will not cause any kind of long term change. Especially since their price is so far beyond what the vast majority would consider paying, heck the 6 "cheap" ones equate to 4000 Zen at the best exchange rate if you have Zen. The expensive one is equivalent to 12000 Zen.

    I said "that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see" so I don't know why you're trying to argue with me as if I said it would help.
    Post edited by spinnytop on
    Squishy DPS builds that can solo QWZ w/videos.
    My super cool CC build and how to use it.
  • wingedkagoutiwingedkagouti Posts: 565 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
    Except those 7 items (3 Travel Power Devices and 4 Travel powers) will only be available for this weekend, so they will not cause any kind of long term change. Especially since their price is so far beyond what the vast majority would consider paying, heck the 6 "cheap" ones equate to 4000 Zen at the best exchange rate if you have Zen. The expensive one is equivalent to 12000 Zen.

    I said "that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see" so I don't know why you're trying to argue with me as if I said it would help.
    It almost certainly won't help. The extremely limited period of time these purchases are available combined with the cost and the timing of the announcement means that no one had any realistic chance to prepare to stockpile Questionite in a way that would make purchasing a bit more Zen to convert an "option" unless you're already in the habit of dropping ~$40 at a moment's notice.

    Heck, they're already advertising the next limited time key bundle (arriving tomorrow and staying for 24 hours) making it unlikely that this will have any kind of impact beyond the very short term.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,915 Arc User
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
    Except those 7 items (3 Travel Power Devices and 4 Travel powers) will only be available for this weekend, so they will not cause any kind of long term change. Especially since their price is so far beyond what the vast majority would consider paying, heck the 6 "cheap" ones equate to 4000 Zen at the best exchange rate if you have Zen. The expensive one is equivalent to 12000 Zen.
    I said "that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see" so I don't know why you're trying to argue with me as if I said it would help.
    It almost certainly won't help. The extremely limited period of time these purchases are available combined with the cost and the timing of the announcement means that no one had any realistic chance to prepare to stockpile Questionite in a way that would make purchasing a bit more Zen to convert an "option" unless you're already in the habit of dropping ~$40 at a moment's notice.

    Heck, they're already advertising the next limited time key bundle (arriving tomorrow and staying for 24 hours) making it unlikely that this will have any kind of impact beyond the very short term.
    That's kinda the point, encourage people to spend zen buying from those people who DO have a stockpile of Q.
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  • wingedkagoutiwingedkagouti Posts: 565 Arc User
    markhawkman wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    They just recently added a really expensive item for Questionite, so that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see.
    Except those 7 items (3 Travel Power Devices and 4 Travel powers) will only be available for this weekend, so they will not cause any kind of long term change. Especially since their price is so far beyond what the vast majority would consider paying, heck the 6 "cheap" ones equate to 4000 Zen at the best exchange rate if you have Zen. The expensive one is equivalent to 12000 Zen.
    I said "that might help with the issue, we'll just have to wait and see" so I don't know why you're trying to argue with me as if I said it would help.
    It almost certainly won't help. The extremely limited period of time these purchases are available combined with the cost and the timing of the announcement means that no one had any realistic chance to prepare to stockpile Questionite in a way that would make purchasing a bit more Zen to convert an "option" unless you're already in the habit of dropping ~$40 at a moment's notice.

    Heck, they're already advertising the next limited time key bundle (arriving tomorrow and staying for 24 hours) making it unlikely that this will have any kind of impact beyond the very short term.
    That's kinda the point, encourage people to spend zen buying from those people who DO have a stockpile of Q.
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.
  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.

    One word: Whales.
    3b1907d9caa4491a88f9a8660e3c8c7e60218799559e36584e50a5da21e246c8u63510.jpeg
    Squishy DPS builds that can solo QWZ w/videos.
    My super cool CC build and how to use it.
  • darqaura2darqaura2 Posts: 932 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.

    One word: Whales.
    3b1907d9caa4491a88f9a8660e3c8c7e60218799559e36584e50a5da21e246c8u63510.jpeg

    Even the whales probably won't have enough time to purchase this with how short the window is. If they made it limited for 3 weeks maybe.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,915 Arc User
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.
    One word: Whales.
    3b1907d9caa4491a88f9a8660e3c8c7e60218799559e36584e50a5da21e246c8u63510.jpeg
    Even the whales probably won't have enough time to purchase this with how short the window is. If they made it limited for 3 weeks maybe.
    that's why it encourages trading. :p
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  • wingedkagoutiwingedkagouti Posts: 565 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.

    One word: Whales.
    Whale is a term invented by marketing people to distance themselves from the real world effect their tactics have on actual humans.

    No decent person would use that term unironically about other people.
    markhawkman wrote: »
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    If you didn't have a stockpile of Questionite already you would need to spend $40 worth of Zen to get a Travel Power with a slightly different fx from one that costs 1/8th of that. I can only see this working on two groups: 1) Compulsive spenders with poor impulse control and 2) People with excess money and a need to stand out in any way possible.

    Most other people most likely won't find $40 to drop on a single cosmetic item (much less the $120 for the Overseer Flight). And as I also said, the launcher is already pushing the next limited time Zen purchase, so people affected by limited time deals are just as likely to not want to spend their Zen to get Questionite.
    One word: Whales.
    3b1907d9caa4491a88f9a8660e3c8c7e60218799559e36584e50a5da21e246c8u63510.jpeg
    Even the whales probably won't have enough time to purchase this with how short the window is. If they made it limited for 3 weeks maybe.
    that's why it encourages trading. :p
    Even a compulsive spender would have to monitor the game on the third day after dropping their $40+ worth of Zen onto the exchange. And they just have to hope there were enough people looking for Zen at the worst possible rates and no real competition for the Questionite in the exchange. Because if they guessed wrong or there weren't enough Z hungry players or too many Q hungry people they would not have been able to grab enough Q to buy a single item before the items were gone.
  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    No decent person would use that term unironically about other people.

    TIL almost nobody on these forums is "a decent person" according to count chocula.
    wingedkagouti wrote: »
    Even a compulsive spender would have to monitor the game on the third day after dropping their $40+ worth of Zen onto the exchange. And they just have to hope there were enough people looking for Zen at the worst possible rates and no real competition for the Questionite in the exchange. Because if they guessed wrong or there weren't enough Z hungry players or too many Q hungry people they would not have been able to grab enough Q to buy a single item before the items were gone.

    All your theories seem to fall apart when you consider what's actually happening in the real world.

    Also, despite being "mr anti-marketing" you don't even seem to understand how this actually works. It's not about this limited time offer, it's about the next one. Nobody knows what the next limited time thing will be, so people are going to start stock-piling in preparation for the next thing. People who can spend money will stockpile Zen, while F2P players will stockpile Questionite - result, game both makes money, and player activity goes up. The small percentage of players who know they can drop enough bucks day-of won't bother stockpiling... or they might decide to anyway.

    I know I suddenly gained a renewed interest in hitting my daily refinement caps ;)
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  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers. I doubt there is anything they could offer that would entice me to spend 2,000,000 Q. If the price had been 500,000 (i.e. double the price of the existing powers then I'd have bought at least 1. No idea how many other players feel this way. IOW, I think the devs need to rethink their pricing strategy. I.e. do they want to get a lot of Q from just a few players or moderate amounts from probably more players?
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  • darqaura2darqaura2 Posts: 932 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers. I doubt there is anything they could offer that would entice me to spend 2,000,000 Q. If the price had been 500,000 (i.e. double the price of the existing powers then I'd have bought at least 1. No idea how many other players feel this way. IOW, I think the devs need to rethink their pricing strategy. I.e. do they want to get a lot of Q from just a few players or moderate amounts from probably more players?

    Pretty much agreed.
  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers.
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    Pretty much agreed.

    Well we'll see if we're in the majority if this sort of thing pops up again :)

    Gotta tell you tho, I don't have a good track record of being part of the majority, so if you're in the same group as me, things are lookin' bad ;)

    Squishy DPS builds that can solo QWZ w/videos.
    My super cool CC build and how to use it.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,915 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers.
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    Pretty much agreed.
    Well we'll see if we're in the majority if this sort of thing pops up again :)

    Gotta tell you tho, I don't have a good track record of being part of the majority, so if you're in the same group as me, things are lookin' bad ;)
    This promotion doesn't really seem aimed at the majority though.
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  • nephtnepht Posts: 6,883 Arc User
    spinnytop wrote: »
    adAVkpx.jpg
    It's been trending towards this for a long time, and now we've finally arrived. The potential bad news here is that because there seems to be no plan to raise the value of questionite by releasing highly desirable items that cost questionite only, and instead focus on cosmic key sales, this trend is going to continue in this direction. So yes the exchange will recover and offers will reappear, but it also means this will happen again, and that it will likely happen more and more frequently with the passage of time. What happens when F2P players see their ability to convert questionite into zen reduced more and more?

    I miss farming crafting mats on Monster Island and selling that S**t for maximum profit. Simpler times.
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    markhawkman wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers.
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    Pretty much agreed.
    Well we'll see if we're in the majority if this sort of thing pops up again :)

    Gotta tell you tho, I don't have a good track record of being part of the majority, so if you're in the same group as me, things are lookin' bad ;)
    This promotion doesn't really seem aimed at the majority though.

    Oof, things are looking even worse then. Expect more high ticket promotions.
    Squishy DPS builds that can solo QWZ w/videos.
    My super cool CC build and how to use it.
  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    I keep wondering how many players there are with a boatload of Q, who don't already have those powers from the old days, who check in on a daily basis (only way to catch a 1 day sale) and who don't use Q to exchange for Zen so they don't have to put any money into the game.
    markhawkman wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers.
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    Pretty much agreed.
    Well we'll see if we're in the majority if this sort of thing pops up again :)

    Gotta tell you tho, I don't have a good track record of being part of the majority, so if you're in the same group as me, things are lookin' bad ;)
    This promotion doesn't really seem aimed at the majority though.

    JwLmWoa.png
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  • flyingfinnflyingfinn Posts: 8,408 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    I got like 4mill Qs ( but that's not a boatload...), don't have those powers from the old days, i check in on daily basis and don't use Q to exchange for Zen.

    And no ragrets for not buying any of those Powers.
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,915 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    I keep wondering how many players there are with a boatload of Q, who don't already have those powers from the old days, who check in on a daily basis (only way to catch a 1 day sale) and who don't use Q to exchange for Zen so they don't have to put any money into the game.
    markhawkman wrote: »
    spinnytop wrote: »
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    All I know is that I wouldn't/didn't spend such absurd amounts of Q for these powers.
    darqaura2 wrote: »
    Pretty much agreed.
    Well we'll see if we're in the majority if this sort of thing pops up again :)

    Gotta tell you tho, I don't have a good track record of being part of the majority, so if you're in the same group as me, things are lookin' bad ;)
    This promotion doesn't really seem aimed at the majority though.
    Mmm... A better question is to look at what sort of player would want them,, and which of those players would have the coin to get them. Anyone who doesn't have it might want it. Which leaves only the question of how to raise the coin.
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    Farm Q long time in expectation of the next limited time thing being something you might want. That's how these things work. Asian games have been doing it for decades.
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  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    Except this is a brand new thing for CO. If the Devs came out and said there would be more of these big 1 day Q busting sales it would be worth stockpiling Q specifically for such events, but without some sort of guarantee, well ....
    JwLmWoa.png
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  • spinnytopspinnytop Posts: 16,450 Arc User
    jaazaniah1 wrote: »
    Except this is a brand new thing for CO. If the Devs came out and said there would be more of these big 1 day Q busting sales it would be worth stockpiling Q specifically for such events, but without some sort of guarantee, well ....

    "There are no guarantees in life!" - Sun Tzu

    The point is to keep people unsure. It's a long-term plan. Or heck maybe it really was a one-time thing... which would be weird. Why dangle something under the dog's nose once and then throw it in the trash? You're never gonna get it to do the trick that way! We'll just have to wait and see... me personally I'm gonna start stockpiling my Q instead of constantly spending it on unslotting mods o3o *stands up on hind legs and spins around while barking*
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  • jaazaniah1jaazaniah1 Posts: 5,428 Arc User
    Maybe that godawful looking Therakiel's sword will be available this Christmas for a mere 10,000,000 Q? I guess the point is that the CO devs do things for unfathomable reasons at times. I tend to go with the surer things in the game. That's why I don't have any extra OSV tokens on my characters, though there is no guarantee that the devs won't go back to developing that system.
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  • chaelkchaelk Posts: 7,732 Arc User
    edited December 2019
    The problem is and always has been. Everyone can get Q but it relies on people forking out for Zen, either 'free' with subs, which they removed because the other two games didn't need them or people buying it. How many people ares till saying, I'm not spending any money on this game until they do X, well ask them if they are buying zen on the exchange.
    Also I wiped out the zen on the exchange about 2 years ago. It wasn't hard there was only just over 10K on it.
    As opposed to STO which had a couple hundred thousand on the first five.
    And NW which had a 10 million backlog at 500
    Stuffing up Freeform builds since Mid 2011
    4e1f62c7-8ea7-4996-8f22-bae41fea063b_zpsu7p3urv1.jpg

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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Posts: 4,915 Arc User
    Yeah, realistically most players farm Q more than they spend it. :/
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