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Former NCSoft employee sheds light on CoH's (and Wildstar, but who cares) demise
(from the article: https://kotaku.com/wildstar-developer-carbine-studios-shuts-down-1828862729)
TL;DR CoH was bad and had bad devs, making game dead for the past 6 years RIP
Happy 9th Anniversary to the good superhero MMO that is not dead, aka CO
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I am so mad at Paragon and NcSoft right now. Seems both sides are just a shower of b@&#*%£s
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Uh, just because you didn't like CoH doesn't mean it wasn't a "good superhero MMO". The game wasn't perfect by any means, but as somebody who was part of the community for 8 years, every update made the game a little better. Oh yeah, and at the time it also set a Guinness world record for most number of free updates for an MMO. The devs were receptive to our ideas too; despite how loudly certain people said we'd never be able to choose weapon skins, they eventually made it happen. Powersets were also made into realities. For years we requested a more punchy style of martial arts, eventually we got Street Justice (which I loved) and there was a new one set to be released called Savage Melee. (sadly, the game shut down before we got a chance to see it)
Shields, staff fighting, water powers..they swore there'd never be "pistol scrapping" but we did eventually get a dual pistol powerset (though to be honest, CO did dual pistols much better than CoH did in terms of visuals). Even when it went free to play, it was still making a profit despite being almost a decade old by that point. I'm sure our biggest complaint regarding NCSoft is that they refused to sell the IP to the game and also rejected the idea of reviving it. With the number of superhero movies being released in the USA, they honestly shot themselves in the foot by shutting it down when they did, they could have capitalized on the craze and kept the game going to reel in more money.
But the real truth of it is, CoH's community was probably the best that i've seen in any game. There were griefers and spam accounts flooding the chat with scam offers for currency, but there were also players who were dedicated "taxi bots" who would teleport you across the gigantic zones like Perez Park and Independence Port just because. Level 50 players would follow newbies in the sewer trial and provide buffs/heals just to help them reach a higher level sooner, costume contests rewarded people with millions in Influence.. you could always easily find a team willing to join you for missions and task force trials and band together to fight giant monsters like Lusca/Babbage/Jack In Irons/Ghost of Scrapyard.
So yes, those of us who grew up with the game miss it and still pine for a possibility it could be released again. Even if it didn't receive any more updates or polishing, just having the latest issue to play would be nice. There are a lot of people in the game we haven't seen or spoken to since it shut down. (Like Frozone saying "I don't see anybody from the old days Bob, just you.") It's sad that NCSoft refused to sell the game, the devs were in negotiations right up to the night before shutdown. The game isn't quite dead but forever in limbo, since they added Statesman and Ghost Widow to Master X Master.
Well anyway my point is the game was fun while it lasted. I've found a handful of displaced CoX vets in CO, and while I love my CO heroes very much, I still miss my CoX characters. I try my best to think of new ideas to make CO better for us all, even if devs aren't receptive to them.
They're probably waiting until all the fangame attempts die down to do anything about it though. Or more likely for a competent developer to show up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Cityofheroes/comments/9b4iaz/wildstar_dev_comments_on_closing_of_city_of_heroes/
I’ll be diplomatic and hold my tongue on what else I’d like to say right now.
They're not there in the beginning, but when your story ends / Gonna last with you longer than your friends
lol that is some powerful powerful denial.
like hot damn you people just really want a scapegoat don't you?
I swear there were other sources mentioning that the Paragon Studios team was really tired of doing superhero stuff.
Not that I can find it but I did read this in an old article
https://gamasutra.com/view/feature/189896/behind_the_scenes_of_the_paragon_.php?page=3 hopefully with NCSoft's express backing on those.
Well, it’s clear that diplomacy has failed, especially when “you people” came from a Community Moderator.
This community cannot stand the fact that City of Heroes is still venerated, that Champions Online was rejected as an alternative, both before and after NCSoft shut everything down, and that people would rather go build some other game to re-capture what they miss.
And what comes of that?
The hypocrisy of CO vets wallowing in bitterness and resentment by claiming that CoH vets are wallowing in bitterness and resentment. The lack of self-awareness to recognize that CO’s joke status in the industry is the direct result of the same chronic mis-management by Cryptic that allowed CO to exist in the first place. (Something NCSoft, to their credit, recognized and corrected by splitting up Cryptic and kicking Jack Emmert and the “Marvel Universe” team to the curb.) Deliberate misinformation campaigns against the Plan Z projects, especially Valiance Online and City of Titans, that went unchallenged for years.
If you want to stand up for Cryptic, PWE, and Champions Online, fine. But if you insist on p***ing on graves and undermining start-ups, then maybe everybody is exactly where they belong.
They're not there in the beginning, but when your story ends / Gonna last with you longer than your friends
and like yes, coh was good, I liked coh. I said earlier in the thread how much I'd actually like to believe that NCSoft still likes/wants a CoH2 and am conjecturing up if they'd humor the possibility even after Paragon Studios (possibly) fudged it up because they were getting tired of maintaining the game.
But when it's gotten to the point of rejecting evidence, that's just silly. True, it's shaky to call 'unsourced, "insider" leak about conduct at Paragon Studios/Wildstar/Whatever' evidence, but consider what motive the speaker would have to state this? Wanting to absolve NCSoft, clearly, but why? Because they really like Guild Wars 2 or something?
That's not a lack of self-awareness, I know this game is hated/unknown to the MMO community in the wider picture, I've been with this silly backburner game for 9 years but I still enjoy it so who cares really. I just find it laughable that, at this piece of potentially exonerating evidence that says "hey, NCSoft actually had your back guys" is rejected in favor of a stance of "paragon studios literally can do no wrong and NCSoft deserves to rot in hell for canceling MMOs."
As for the reboot projects, my opinions on it are purely based on what I've seen so far from promo material they've released. I haven't seen anything that's impressed me. Simple as that.
Bottom line, I'm not bitter about anything surrounding this situation or realizing the implications this leak could have, and I do apologize if it seems like I was. I just realize that this means there's probably more pathways to some neat new superhero game that could exist - which I just find amusing in comparison to some of the comments/discussion in those links you posted, when diehard fans of the game can't see that possibility.
If CoH made money NcSoft should have never shut it and Paragon are d***s for funnelling funds meant for CoH2 into some other game no one asked for. That is all there is to it.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
That is very true the original CoH still might have shut even if CoH2 was completed like NcSoft wanted but CoH fans would still have a City of Heroes game to play.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Kzrn please make me mod, I already have the uniform
"This is not true, we actually pitched CoH2 at one point and they didn’t seem interested. We went into pre-production 3 times I think, CoH2, another superhero game but in the future (1st zone was London), and then finally some kind of survival game.
NCSoft was constantly pulling the rug out from under us and wanting something more “MMOEy” We finally asked them to explain, my favorite part of the slide show they sent us was:
Q: Is FarmVille a MMO? A: No, but if you could burn down other peoples farms it would be a lot closer. The wanted Lineage level griefing, but never seemed to understand that would not fly in the US"
So you basically have one anonymous person saying something happened, and another replies with "nu-uh".
"I can accept that reason for NCsoft shutting down CoH, but in that case why not come clean about? Lots of people, myself included, are still mad at NCsoft about how they handled the CoH shutdown. I've had other games/MMO's shutdown on me but CoH is the only one I've really gotten upset about because from our perspective it looked like they did it just to force us to play another game.
I can understand them wanting to send a message to the devs over something like that, but the way it was handled burned some serious bridges with the fans. As I said, they could have at least gave an announcement explaining why such a drastic shutdown was happening. Even better they could have sold the source code and assets to the fans who made serious offers to buy CoH from them so that fans could run their own servers. Devs still would be without a job (teaching them a lesson), fans would be able to play a game they loved, and NCsoft would have gotten a little bit of money from a game/IP that's been sitting around doing absolutely nothing for them besides earn them the continued boycott by people like myself who are still mad about it."
This comment makes sense, but a business would rather make no money than less money. Superheroes were never a big genre in Korea, unlike here in the US what with all the Marvel movies being released every month. This whole thing is moot anyway, there's no point to anybody getting their blood pressure up over a game what has been dead for 6 years. We knew the truth of what happened in the days leading up to the shutdown: Korea didn't want a CoH2, they abruptly pulled the plug two weeks before the newest issue would have been released, rejected offers to sell the game and won't revive it (but will add Statesman and Ghost Widow to another one of their games because middle finger).
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
A game that was created almost fifteen years ago and was shutdown seven years ago, still manages to be relevant enough to talk about.
Not that's an accomplishment.
> *wakes up* Gee, I wonder how that CoH topic I created last night is do--
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> frankly I'm shocked that I'm still a moderator considering how much I voice my opinions.
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> Kzrn please make me mod, I already have the uniform
Yeah like you weren't hoping for a single heated response, at all. Please drop the facade.
Even if whatever is being said in the article is true, it doesn't prove that CoX was objectively bad as a product, just the management behind it. NCsoft also has a notorious reputation of shutting down MMOs abruptly without consideration for its long time supporters of said MMOs. Only the Guild War games are immune.
You're really just using the article to fit your own narrative sticking it to ex-CoX players in the CO community and telling them "HA! I told you CoX sucks!". That's really all what it is.
Heated response? Yeah, I was expecting those. Ignoring the topic and shooting the messenger? Not really.
I was expecting people to focus on the topic rather than on who posted it.
Didn't realise I was so important in so many people's life
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
> I was expecting people to focus on the topic rather than on who posted it.
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> Didn't realise I was so important in so many people's life
K, I'll address what's being claimed in the statement rather than your trollbait.
The fact of the matter is that the claim is made by someone using an alias. It sounds convincing but it remains unverified until that person reveals who they really are as an ex-dev, and it shouldn't be taken as hard evidence of what really happened that led to CoX's closure, especially when supposed ex-devs from other social media sources are disputing the claim's truthfulness...
...unless a certain confirmation bias is involved because someone has just hates everything associated with CoX I guess.
Replace the hunters in this guy's video with CO forums users and you have this thread. You all need to chill BK is hardly Xeno.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Cool vid doe
I typo'd your initials you numpty I meant KB, I always meant to ask why Behemoths? Iron Giants are where its at
All this talk is making want to play some Type 0 @_@"
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
My characters
Iron Giants are copyrighted
Behemoths aren't o3o
That is exactly why I like them. They not only in X games they are in most Final Fantasy games. They never really drop anything good but they do normally give decent XP. Never farmed them in X2 seems like I dodged a bullet there
Yeah Behemoth is a middle eastern myth. Its like how Marvel can't copyright Thor. They can only copyright their character the alien dude called The Mighty Thor. Behemoths in all works of fiction look pretty much the same so its nigh on impossible for anyone to try and copyright them.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods