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Celestial/HW dual passive build (2019 update)

wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
edited October 2019 in Builds and Roles
I'm down to my last character slot, so I'm making another dual passive character to make the best of it. This one is a tank/healer hybrid, and for that combination of roles I'm not sure how to fit all the needed powers plus assign all the proper advantages. Assume an end goal of Alerts/Rampages because I don't think I'll be ready for Cosmics gear- or time-wise for a long while yet.

Here is the build.


EDIT: For the healer passive especially, I'm not sure if I should use Hearth or Aura of <whatever>.
Post edited by wtbcreativity on

Comments

  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    Since its not for high-end, it doesn't matter as much what passives you settle on, and you can pick more based on personal pref.

    I'm not sure I'd normally do a tank + support dual-passive build, just cause its harder to mix them w/o taking away from key powers for either role (whereas mixing w/ dps is easier cause dps tends to be more straight-forward and streamlined). In this case, for ex, you got a mostly complete basic healer setup, but you lack any ADs, and have to use a toggle and specs that are not as ideal for tanking. And when playing as a healer, you'll ideally have to be up in melee. You also don't have as many options to heal yourself directly (Absorb Heat is a good AoE heal, but it does have its stipulations).

    Regardless, I'd prob consider taking STR PSS, 3/3 Juggernaut, 2/2 Brutality, and 1pt in Quick Recovery to help proc Compassion. Can also move R2 from Eruption to ranking the ally res.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    Yeah, I noticed there wasn't nearly enough room in the build to include everything I needed for both roles. Let's scale back then and make a primary healer who can tank casual content (like an Alert or whatever) if need be.

    Is this more realistic/workable? I'm thinking AoRP would give me a little more margin for error, but I'd take any support passive really.
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    Well, that build lacks an energy unlock now, and a spammable non-Challenge attack to use when not tanking (Cleave was alright enough for that, and can put up CF instead of Eruption anyways). You'll have to consolidate abilities as best you can and be efficient w/ your adv points. Here's some tweaking of it:

    https://aesica.net/co/herocreator.htm?v=29&n=&d=16310WOADPYE0600102000H1092D00MC03K503K800H90i2H03K403HE0L2C01ER00H4002J010mTO1Dlt03Et

    Super Stats
    Level 6: Presence (Primary)
    Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
    Level 15: Strength (Secondary)

    Talents
    Level 1: The Devastator (Str: 10, Con: 10, Rec: 10, End: 8)
    Level 6: Shrug It Off (Con: 5, Pre: 5)
    Level 9: Physical Conditioning (Str: 5, Con: 5)
    Level 12: Impressive Physique (Str: 5, Pre: 5)
    Level 15: Quick Recovery (Con: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 18: Lasting Impression (Pre: 5, Rec: 5)
    Level 21: Relentless (Str: 5, Rec: 5)

    Powers
    Level 1: Throw Fire (advantages)
    Level 1: Cleave (Rank 2, Rampant)
    Level 6: Thermal Reverberation
    Level 8: Aura of Radiant Protection (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 11: Conviction (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 14: Compassion (advantages)
    Level 17: Arc of Ruin (No Quarter, Wildfire, Challenge!)
    Level 20: Absorb Heat (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 23: Iniquity (Rank 2, Rank 3)
    Level 26: Annihilate (Rank 2, Scorching Blade, Challenge!)
    Level 29: Fire Shield (Rank 2)
    Level 32: Masterful Dodge (advantages)
    Level 35: Defiance (advantages)
    Level 38: Rise From the Ashes (Rank 2)
    Adv. Points: 34/36

    Travel Powers
    Level 6: Athletics (advantages)
    Level 35: Flight (advantages)

    Specializations
    Presence: Repurpose (3/3)
    Presence: Selfless Ally (2/2)
    Presence: Moment of Glory (3/3)
    Presence: Force of Will (2/2)
    Sentinel: Caregiver (3/3)
    Sentinel: Sentinel Aura (3/3)
    Sentinel: Moment of Need (3/3)
    Sentinel: Genesis (1/2)
    Sentry: Fortified Gear (2/3)
    Sentry: Precise (3/3)
    Sentry: Sentry Aura (3/3)
    Sentry: Fortify (2/2)
    Mastery: Presence Mastery (1/1)

    I'm unsure if you'll have enough energy for Annihilate here, but I suppose Defiance energy will help. Cleave is cheap enough when not tanking as is. I kept 2 adv points left over for ranking one or both of your travel powers.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Thanks, that's looking much better. I wasn't sure about Thermal Reverb because I didn't have End or Rec SSed. Would Compassion be enough for energy management even when tanking? I still have Sentinel Aura + Absorb Heat to keep it rolling, I would think.
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    Its still nice to have an EU for the extra energy for doing things you already were doing, even if you aren't SSing its scalar stat. Perhaps you may not need it for Defiance, but it does depend quite a bit on gear as well.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Sorry to come back to this one, but I did some digging around on old threads to see your other tank recommendations because I really want to see how far the idea can be pushed without losing anything essential. Here is the newest version, which is really more Celestial/HW than Fire/HW at this point (or will be close enough once I'm done coloring powers).

    1. I notice you recommended Circle of Primal Dominion in some tank builds and it has increased powers for both Support/Tank roles, so I made room for it. Will it be able to pull double duty in Support role, or should I still expect to keep moving/not have the prep time to summon it?

    2. I swapped Arc of Ruin for Expulse + Daybreaker. It has a larger range (15' sphere vs 10' cone) and drops a healing rune for me to stand on, but I lose the damage debuff. Is that a fair trade? I'm also hoping that sticking Challenge! on it won't be a problem when I'm healing because I can stand more than 15' away from the tank, and the AoRP Healer in the Healer Builds thread has "Pillar of Poz -> Arcane Vitality ×3 || Iniquity as needed" as its healing rotation.

    3. Minor point, but I forgot how much I disliked the whole "windmill arms" animation of Radiance. Does the choice of energy builder basically not matter at level 40, or can I get away with Bludgeon/Eldritch Bolts (and should I have a strong preference for ranged over melee)?
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    Moving vs not for stuff like CoPD really just depends on the fight. Sometimes its convenient and easy- other times it simply won't be. It'll be harder (though not necc impossible) for Supports to stay still overall, esp if using 50ft heals in larger groups that can cause you to have to run around more to keep allies in heal range. For tanks, its more common to be able to plant yourself in one place.

    Arc is now a pbAoE (doesn't even require a target to use), and not a frontal cone. Expulse is alright for the healing rune and tagging stuff w/ Challenge, though Arc doesn't have a cd (so it can also be used as a normal AoE) and has the No Quarter debuff for better dps/tps (and can refresh the dbeuff and CF on tap w/ both special advs). Regardless, if there's a real tank in the group, I wouldn't worry too much about your own infrequent Challenge and lower threat gen stealing boss aggro from them, but that will be dependent on your allies more than you.

    Radiance can lightly heal allies, but imo its not really worth taking for that alone, as you have quite more potent heals (and the energy to use for them) instead. For combat, energy builder choice doesn't overall matter too much, imo, as you shouldn't be using it much (or at all) at the high levels. The choice more matters when trying to unlock a specific power in a specific set earlier than usual, and/or to skip having an early redundant power that you don't really need later on.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Awesome. Thanks again for all the help.

    By the way, I noticed the pyre patch from Daybreaker triggered Thermal Reverb even without any enemies around. Didn't know it worked it that way, but it's been really helpful for energy management. Even so, do you think I should still gear a little Rec/End for my healer set?
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    Yea, TReverb can proc when any pyre patch is around, even if no enemies are in it.

    You'd generally only want to get more energy stats if you still find yourself saddled w/ energy issues sometimes when in combat. Since that's somewhat gear dependent, it'll mostly come down to your own gameplay experience.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Hey again. I'm revisiting this because I'm sitting on a free respec and I'm wondering if it might not be worth it to swap out a few powers. Per the above discussion from last year, it's supposed to be a dual passive healer/casual tank build.

    Celestial/HW Hybrid - Freeform (Any / Multiple)
    v3.41:33

    I remember it being fine to leave Defiance unranked before the Might rework, but now I'm wondering if it might not be better to swap it for Invulnerability so I don't have to wait for stacks to build. (I'm noticing that's a little bit more of a problem now than when I last played this character.) I don't think I can pull adv points from anywhere to rank it, so either way I'm left with an unranked defensive passive.

    Not much else has been affected and I'm mostly pleased with how this character performs for the content I do (in my janky blues + Armadillos gear setup). I'm asking just in case there are more powers I should swap or if I should reassign any of my adv points.
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    The build can still do alright, but yeah if you're taking Defiance then you'd want to rank it now. I may still take Invuln instead if it's just off-tanking sometimes, though. If you want ranks for Invuln, you can remove one of the ranks from Cleave, R2 from Expulse, and/or R2 from the res for it. I also assume you are taking the same talents form before for it.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Yeah, same talents as before.

    I actually use Cleave for its damage (it's my main AoE/trash clear), but Expulse is more for the pyre patch so I'll pull R2 from there and the res. Hadn't really thought about it before. Should I have any preference for Defiance or Invulnerability? I don't know how well this build could scale into Cosmics/QZone with better gear and more practice on my part, so I'd prefer whichever works out better for me in the long term. If this really doesn't look like it could handle either, then yeah I'll switch out for Invulnerability.
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    Defiance gives the highest dmgRes of all the defensive passives, so it's best for main tanks that are taking large, bursty hits. Invuln is better for trash and small-medium hits, though it can still do fine as a passive for a main tank, assuming you can still block well. Defiance is good at what it does, but Invuln is more flexible since it's 'on' all the time. Ultimately it's just up to you. If you're unsure then you can leave it as the last 4 advs and power slot trained, so re-training the passive alone will be much cheaper.
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
  • wtbcreativitywtbcreativity Posts: 43 Arc User
    Good point. I'll do that.

    Thanks again for all the help. =)
  • flowcytoflowcyto Posts: 12,852 Arc User
    no problem. Have fun out there 8)
    <CO stuff> .: Petco :. // A basic FF building guide (see 1st reply) // PSA on Power Activation Delay // Ayonachan's Gift Horse (misc stat data)
    - Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
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