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Are you happy with the new Max 35 Cap ?
diggot
Posts: 309 Arc User
Today we were pretty much smacked in the face by this new change that reduced maxplayer cap from 50 to 35 per zone, what this means is that it is significantly harder to get the correct people for cosmic bosses, and for players to get the Destroid mission in Ren Cen completed.
Not every player watches chat or even has chat up, so taking for granted that we can ask EVERYONE who isn't fighting cosmics to leave the zone.. is stupid to begin with. Plenty of players who are doing Cosmics are also RL programmers, and their opinion is that this change and absolutely nothing to do with the performance and the no-hit big.
I myself has never ever had issues with lag at cosmics, my only issue has been the memorycrashes.
And the worst is that this change was NEVER taken up with the players and discussed before implemented, so now there is alot of really disappointed cosmic adventurers out there.
What are your thoughts on this matter?. Personally i'm not surprised we get shafted once again... but i'm disappointed.
Not every player watches chat or even has chat up, so taking for granted that we can ask EVERYONE who isn't fighting cosmics to leave the zone.. is stupid to begin with. Plenty of players who are doing Cosmics are also RL programmers, and their opinion is that this change and absolutely nothing to do with the performance and the no-hit big.
I myself has never ever had issues with lag at cosmics, my only issue has been the memorycrashes.
And the worst is that this change was NEVER taken up with the players and discussed before implemented, so now there is alot of really disappointed cosmic adventurers out there.
What are your thoughts on this matter?. Personally i'm not surprised we get shafted once again... but i'm disappointed.
Are you happy with the new Max 35 Cap ? 63 votes
Yes , i don't really mind.
46%
29 votes
No, i see no reason for it and want the 50 Cap back.
41%
26 votes
I don't do Cosmics so i don't really care.
12%
8 votes
0
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I think it's generally for the good.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
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It would be the equivalent of me complaining that Vanity devices were turned off inside Caprice when I never go to Caprice and the vanity devices annoyed people RPing.
The zone cap reduction is a temp fix to the very frequent "Hits not registering" issue that caused Kiga to last forever (if people died you couldn't outdps the heal with half the hits not registering) and Dino checks to fail despite having more than enough DPS.
Also, this topic was not discussed with the playerbase. It was THE PLAYERBASE that brought this topic up to the devs in multiple threads, the most recent one started by me
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/championsonline#/discussion/1210854/current-state-of-cosmics-a-rant-thread-the-13th
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I take it this is your first Monster Week event? The fails aren't cause of the new zone limit.
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>
> Cosmic week increases the number of people at cosmics, and thus increases the rate of problems. If a fix is needed, cosmic week is exactly when it's needed.
I would think you’d want to test a fairly significant change in normal conditions first, instead of letting people try to get used to something new in the most stressful circumstances possible (cosmic week). Giving it a few weeks before doing a monster week would probably reduce some screeching and confusion.
Also, I'm sure it's easy to play armchair developer and say it should be an easy fix. Until you've got a person whose job it is to code sitting there looking at the actual code, I wouldn't make any assumptions. If it's a band-aid fix, it's because that's what they can do for now, not because they're being willfully negligent.
I didn't experienced more than 2 zones with the lowered cap, hence, not increased opportunities to do cosmics. It's even worse, because with the lowered cap, it decreased this chance. (70 places instead of 100)
While with the 50 cap I was able to do 6 cosmics during evening euro time (which correspond to morning in West Coast and we are usually able to open 2 zones at those times), I was unable to do so with the lowered cap. And there was still *only* 6 opportunities.
Even if we were able to open more zones, it would face off some problems we already have with only 1 or 2 zones : a lowered cap doesn't mean raids are easier and faster (I'm putting aside that during cosmic event, newcomers are most likely all around, and I consider the situation of this change would stay), which means it would take even longer to reach your cosmic cap if you don't manage to get in the next zone. And last but not least, I'm (we are ?) experiencing a depletion of (competent ?) key roles. I've never been forced to play a key role more than ever since the past 2-3 weeks to help a raid happen.
As such, I, for my part, don't experience *any* improvement in my gaming experience with this change, and I'm avoiding cosmics as much as possible since yerterday
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Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
Everyday I get my cap on the character I am focused on gearing. After that I help out with other roles. I tried CCing and just din't enjoy that style of play, so I help with heals, tanks and AoAC/AoED when I can.
With a 50 person zone cap, the second zone often never forms, or doesn't generate the interest to get a run.
Cosmics Week changes how the runs work, as other posters have noted. Wait until after the week, and then see how things are working.
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I thought the lvl cap was 40.
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Shouldn't be too big an issue if we're getting multiple zones now. There's usually another zone ready to be taken by either party if the current one becomes too crowded.
And I will always be @DZPlayer122.
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I'm sure it'll be fine, as long as everyone remembers you don't always get a choice of which zone you return to when leaving an instanced mission.
Now we just need people to adjust to the new reality and have some of those dpsers roll tanks and support toons so that new zone can get started rather than waiting for the other zone to finish.
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This is meant to be beneficial for players so that there's not so much going on during the fight, as others have pointed out.
I think the last time I attended a Cosmic fight must have been late last year or early January at best. Unfortunately they can bring out the worst in people and I don't want to always deal with that personally.
If people really want to continue running Cosmics under this new zone cap, they'll definitely find away. If players of that content are determined, they'll find a way to manage. I have no doubt about that.
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I finally saw Double Instances during european hours after so long
How about just private queued instances for up to 35 players?? that way you can pick and choose who you want in it!
That way you can also control the amount of "I dont know what im doing!" people to a safe amount for those still learning
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
If somehow their coding is entangled the proper fix would be to use the Test Server version of the code to rewrite the functions properly so they are not effect each other's variables. As this change seems to have caught everyone by surprise clearly it was never tested, defeating the purpose of having a test server.
But the more i think on this the more i not only like but thought of a tweek for a queued version (leave the ones that are still open instance) but create a tutorial version instead with a reduced reward 1g 1s for finishing, but it has popup tips telling you where to stand and explanations of the boss tells so you know when to block, unblock, buff your dps, agro and pull baby, when to not stand in fire, etc
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
Courage is doing what is right even when it isn't popular or safe. Honor is retaining the dignity and virtue in one's self, so it can light the way for others in the darkest of times. Compassion is showing patience and mercy towards others, even when it isn't returned or deserved. A hero is defined by these 3 words, they set him apart from others as a beacon of hope and excellence.
In a perfect world...
CO's code is incredibly funky. If I remember right, Damage and Buffs/Debuffs all share the same category of "Effect" or something like that. There's a hard-set limit on these "effects" that is in place to prevent the game's engine from killing itself or causing the server to break down. CO's engine is old and likely cannot handle an increase of the effect limit. Not due to the hardware it's on, but just because of how the engine was originally made. If we REALLY wanted to see the issue go away, we would need a massive overhaul of the engine, and that just isn't in the budget both for time and resources.
For now, they're introducing a few bandaids to help reduce the issue, like they did with consolidating Bleed damage. This reduced player cap is also on trial since we discussed it in another thread and came to the conclusion that, well, it might not be such a bad idea. In truth, the new cap isn't as bad as people think. It's a lot easier to manage a group of 35 players than it is to manage a group of 50 when it comes to how Cosmic battles are. Cosmics DO scale to the amount of players around, and as we've seen, too many players causes a serious issue because of that pesky effect limit AND Cosmic scaling.
The team is doing their best to make sure the game is playable for everyone with what they've got available. It's not perfect, but it'll have to do for the time being.
And I will always be @DZPlayer122.
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The sheer number of effects is a function of the number of players present.
Lowering the zone cap lowers the number of players present.
Something something coding 101.
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While some of the things scale to player size, others do not (and this is my problem).
We are down to now ~1/3rd of the original 100 cap, and no adjustments have been made or announced to be considered. Worse changes (spazzy dogs are breaking holds more than ever) seems to have broken things more and I have doubts they will be recalled with the change if it stays mid to long term.
Without adjustments made to temper this low size (and no announcement other than 'this is the bad solution we don't even like but picked') a big no from me.
Even if this is temporary, even if they are working on a solution, i doubt it will be quick.
And even this is a planned test to metric out the 35 limit scaling .. still no.
For the record, i think a lot of the other suggested solutions are worse.
So this is no on a scale of no, NO and **** NO.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Yeah, it sucks when things get downsized, but I'd take that solution over the game's content becoming unplayable due to limitations being overmatched.
A lot has been added in these past few years. Powerframe reworks happened and we've got a bunch of new buffs and debuffs floating around whose sheer number is more than the engine can handle. It's not pretty, and I'd rather have large scale 100-player Cosmic fights too (I miss Firefall), but in CO's current situation that just isn't in the cards.
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None of this has been adjusted relative to party size, yet the probable number of available healers (buffs, auras, heals), and tanks (main, off, pull) does as party size reduces from 100 to 35.
Short: If 4 standard tanks with 4 standard healers were needed at dino V1, we should be scaled down relative to party size everywhere. If hearts were meant to be shared, this should be fixed even if this a temporary situation, even just if done slightly (Not literally 1/3rd damage)
No it's not "fine" that one person can do it, don't settle for "fine" insist on good. P2P/P2W is not the answer (Ultimate tanks, ultimate CC'ers using drifter items, cash shop items)