FC.31.20151210a.18 - Cherub Wings Subscriber Piece & Bug Fixes

ladygadfly · January 2016

Release Notes for FC.31.20151210a.18
This build is available on PTS as of 1/26/2016

February Subscriber Piece
- Added Cherub Wings costume piece to the PTS store.

Teleios Ascendant
- Changed text on entrance to note that it requires 5 players.
- Fixed a bug to prevent re-queuing on for completed instances.
- Tweaked the volume leading into Grond's chamber try reduce chance of it resetting accidentally.
- Added additional info line for Major Paul Mason.
- Changed door at Teleios Tower to allow direct entry without queuing. Updated info on daily mission to reflect changes to TT door.
- Added reward drops to Teleios Ascendant Lair. Each sub boss will drop 2 SCR and 1 GCR and Teleios will drop 5SCR and 3 GCR. Each boss can also drop additional rewards.

Recognition Vendors
- Adjusted some temporary devices to have 3 charges.
- Removed Tangleweb Mixture, Mini Manimal, and Manil Transformation as they were not working properly. They may return in the future.
- Set action figures in the Gold Champion Recognition vendor to bind on pickup.

Additional Changes
- Added some pieces of Aurum gear to Drifter and Questionite Store.
- Beneficent Construct's heal was healing for an incorrect amount and has been adjusted.
- Demonflame, Serpent Lantern, Resistance, Aftershock and Whiteout adventure packs now grant Recognition based on your level range.
- Questionite has been increased for several of adventure packs.
- Adventure pack rewards have been removed from the Questionite store.
- Dreadlocks Long hair has been added as a rare drop to Viperia in Serpent Lantern.
- Many rare costumes from adventure packs have been added to the rare costume tab (previously the alert costume tab) in the Silver Champion Recognition vendor.
- Players who have leftover UNTIL tokens can now convert them at recognition stores.
- SCR permanent Devices now level with you and can be traded.
- Items priced at 1000 tokens have been reduced to 975 to prevent players from accidentally losing tokens.

Please format any bugs you find in the following format:
Bug
Where it happens
What happens

Please stay on topic in this PTS thread. We use bug reports from this thread to decide whether a PTS build is ready to go live, and so we need to make sure we're seeing everything in it. Please do discuss the changes, but if you find yourself writing about something that isn't specific to what's on PTS, then that should probably go here: http://forum.arcgames.com/championsonline/categories/gameplay-bugs1.

These player & moderator maintained threads are checked weekly by the development team.
- http://forum.arcgames.com/championsonline/discussion/1203590/costume-bug-list
- http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/championsonline/#/discussion/1203148/onslaught-bugs-and-balance-qol-concerns
- http://forum.arcgames.com/championsonline/discussion/1198089/known-power-bugs
- http://forum.arcgames.com/championsonline/discussion/1194284/champions-online-alerts-issues
- http://forum.arcgames.com/championsonline/discussion/1198119/compiled-list-of-bugs-issues-and-qol-concerns-version-2-0

xrazamax · January 2016

-Can we get a list of "additional rewards" that the bosses in TT Epic Lair are supposed to drop to make sure they are dropping properly?
-The Booster Pill - Recovery woefully unperforms especially for its cost. It is so underwhelming I think it is unintentional. It gives +11% health and +11% energy. This is a very low amount for a device with only 1 charge and cost a precious SCR. A medium or high power healing patch will out perform this (as long as the hero isn't doing 20k plus HP :P ) and only cost a single Primus token. Also the energy given is not a very big bonus in the scheme of things. It would be more enticing if the Booster Pills included perhaps some of the following:
> Had 3 charges
> Gave a larger amount of health and energy and gave it over time
> Increased max health and energy for a short amount of time.
-The Servitor Serum still has not returned to the Silver Recognition Vendor. Is this because of the animation bug it could cause? If so, perhaps swap it out for Triumphant Recovery which works just fine. I am sure players would prefer this item anyways over Servitor Serum as it would behave oddly at times. Currently there are no items available for heroes to revive themselves which is especially harsh for solo players.

aiqa · January 2016

Sorry, but I can't see anything possitive about the SCR costs of heroic gear and the rate in which you gain that. The only explanation I can think of for the pricing is that the consequences are not fully thought through.

For the time spend on an AP and the increased cost of the stuff from the SCR vendor, 10 SCR is waaaay to small a reward for running an AP. Assuming an AP will take 1.5 hour all in all (which I think is reasonable), that would take 30 hours of running AP's to get 1 piece of heroic gear. Or 200 Gravitar runs to get 1 full set of Heroic gear.

With those prices and rates of gaining SCR, I would suggest just removing heroic gear from the game. Getting justice gear takes less time than that.

spinnytop · January 2016

Aftershock and Whiteout are unavailable on PTS

aiqa said:

With those prices and rates of gaining SCR, I would suggest just removing heroic gear from the game. Getting justice gear takes less time than that.

I'm glad we're not submitting to fatalism and hyperbole, cause that generally causes communication to break down.

xrazamax · January 2016

spinnytop said:
Aftershock and Whiteout are unavailable on PTS

aiqa said:

With those prices and rates of gaining SCR, I would suggest just removing heroic gear from the game. Getting justice gear takes less time than that.
I'm glad we're not submitting to fatalism and hyperbole, cause that generally causes communication to break down.

I think in @aqia 's case this isn't a "hmph!" as much as "There isn't a point to heroic if time investment in getting it is equal or greater than that of Justice and yet it preforms worse."

draogn · January 2016

The costs are still absurd.

- Items priced at 1000 tokens have been reduced to 975 to prevent players from accidentally losing tokens.

This is bad comedy. Bat Flight is barely worth what it's currently set at on the live servers.

kallethen · January 2016

I can't agree with the idea that Heroics will take more effort than Justice gear. Justice has RNG-tokens and the need to purchase keys for the Drifter Salvage. Which means Q farming for the Zen if you don't want to spend money (or use your stipend I guess).

EDIT cuz I didn't mean to submit yet:

I will agree that the prices for costumes and travel powers are waaaaaaaay too high. Like... halve it at least.

jonsills · January 2016

Yeah, the Justice gear comparison isn't really valid - you can run Rampages for hours and not get the item drops you need, while each run that gives you Recognition does so every time. Yes, the price is ludicrous, but the hours comparison just can't be worked out.

williamkony · January 2016

Gonna be a positive voice here and say that I greatly appreciate the addition of so many different sources of Silver Champions Recognition, even if it takes a lot of it to get things. Means being able to do the content you want to do rather than being forced into the same stuff over and over.

bringmeaslab · January 2016

Bug: Seraphim passive is still interfering with travel powers while slotted.

aiqa · January 2016

xrazamax said:

spinnytop said:
Aftershock and Whiteout are unavailable on PTS

aiqa said:

With those prices and rates of gaining SCR, I would suggest just removing heroic gear from the game. Getting justice gear takes less time than that.
I'm glad we're not submitting to fatalism and hyperbole, cause that generally causes communication to break down.
I think in @aqia 's case this isn't a "hmph!" as much as "There isn't a point to heroic if time investment in getting it is equal or greater than that of Justice and yet it preforms worse."

Yup, in the current setup you'll spend well over 20 hours (probably more than 30 hours), for 1 set of heroics gear. That is just not worth the time, that you can far better spend on getting justice gear. So since heroic gear will be completely invalidated, even if it is not removed from the SCR vendors in effect it will still be removed from the game as a realistic option.

jonsills said:
Yeah, the Justice gear comparison isn't really valid - you can run Rampages for hours and not get the item drops you need, while each run that gives you Recognition does so every time. Yes, the price is ludicrous, but the hours comparison just can't be worked out.

Of course it can, just not in an exact way. But there is an average time you need to spend getting rampage tokens. If you need to spend close to the same time or even longer getting heroics (or any significant portion really), it would not be smart spending that time getting heroic gear at all. So anyone that actually cares to spend a significant amount of time gearing up, would be far better of skipping heroic and just get justice gear.

lunnylunny · January 2016

So, avoiding repeating what has most likely already been said and read, with what gear are we supposed to grind for Heroic? Before, any character could work on it's own to get it, but if we're meant to play with teams, it means any build that requires proper gearing to work is going to hold back the other players. I'd have nerfed heroics to fit what it currently is: Base end level gear rather than make it so much harder to obtain.

That aside, I'm happy with the AP/CS changes, even though I'd double most of the SCR rewards you currently have. But that may or not be because I absolutely hate grinding: I personally do not see how doing something over and over and over again would be rewarding.

An idea, though, perhaps the AP/CS rewards with extra Recognition each instance completed on higher difficulties, or perhaps just on Elite difficulty.

jaazaniah1 · January 2016

Maybe the goal is to make the grind to get heroics close enough to the grind to get JG that people will forego the former of the latter. After all, in order to get JG someone has to buy drifter salvage and so the company makes money. Heroics don't make the company a dime.

chaelk · January 2016

aiqa wrote: »

Aftershock and Whiteout are unavailable on PTS

With those prices and rates of gaining SCR, I would suggest just removing heroic gear from the game. Getting justice gear takes less time than that.

I'm glad we're not submitting to fatalism and hyperbole, cause that generally causes communication to break down.
I think in @aqia 's case this isn't a "hmph!" as much as "There isn't a point to heroic if time investment in getting it is equal or greater than that of Justice and yet it preforms worse."

Yup, in the current setup you'll spend well over 20 hours (probably more than 30 hours), for 1 set of heroics gear. That is just not worth the time, that you can far better spend on getting justice gear. So since heroic gear will be completely invalidated, even if it is not removed from the SCR vendors in effect it will still be removed from the game as a realistic option.

Yeah, the Justice gear comparison isn't really valid - you can run Rampages for hours and not get the item drops you need, while each run that gives you Recognition does so every time. Yes, the price is ludicrous, but the hours comparison just can't be worked out.

Of course it can, just not in an exact way. But there is an average time you need to spend getting rampage tokens. If you need to spend close to the same time or even longer getting heroics (or any significant portion really), it would not be smart spending that time getting heroic gear at all. So anyone that actually cares to spend a significant amount of time gearing up, would be far better of skipping heroic and just get justice gear.

so , could you please tell me what the average time/ amount of runs you need to do to get Rampage gear is?
and for those people who aren't lucky enough to get the tokens drops?

quasimojo1 · January 2016

I'd probably be more concerned about the new gear costs if I planned to gear up more alts, which I don't. But the costs do seem excessive. The only rationale I can think of for setting the prices so high initially is if maybe they plan to run promotional events (i.e. sales) where you can gain at a higher rate.

I can understand the design decisons for more grind. My main problem with it is that the implementation discourages "alt-ing". For years, due to the lack of updates to CO, the end game was "ok, now let's make another toon and run through everything again". This was probably what kept the game afloat and was encouraged by the developers. More recently, it seems like those alt-heavy supporters of the game for so long are getting the short end of the stick by more-and-more additions to the game being character-bound as opposed to account-bound. More grind AND toon-bound currencies is not a successful combination, in my opinion.

Look at your more successful competitor, Marvel Superheroes. Yes, they have a ton of grind and a hundred currencies but they're all, to my recollection, account bound. They understand that the interesting-ness (sorry I haven't had coffee yet and am making up words) and replayability comes from the variety of toons and/or builds, and that's something that should be encouraged.

TLDR; More grind, fine, but make currencies account-bound.

Unknown · January 2016

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aiqa · January 2016

chaelk said:
so , could you please tell me what the average time/ amount of runs you need to do to get Rampage gear is?

and for those people who aren't lucky enough to get the tokens drops???

When playing smart and alting after getting 600q per rampage, usually it takes between 5 and 10 runs to get 1 token. Then when counting about 15 minutes per rampage, that would take between 75 an 150 minutes per token, and for 18 tokens that is 2700 minutes or 45 hours.
And while this is a very significant time investment, with the SCR cost on PTS doing AP's to get heroics is going to take much longer than that.

notyuu · January 2016

>Batflight still prevents players from being able to attack while using it, consdering the cost increase that should be at least fixed

> Heavy axe from resistance is not under the rare costumes tab in the SCR vendor

> Sepherim on the become celestial device now deals 2 ticks of 1 slashing damage per second to the user and most friendly NPCS in range of the user.

quasimojo1 · January 2016

aiqa said:

chaelk said:
so , could you please tell me what the average time/ amount of runs you need to do to get Rampage gear is?

and for those people who aren't lucky enough to get the tokens drops???
When playing smart and alting after getting 600q per rampage, usually it takes between 5 and 10 runs to get 1 token. Then when counting about 15 minutes per rampage, that would take between 75 an 150 minutes per token, and for 18 tokens that is 2700 minutes or 45 hours.
And while this is a very significant time investment, with the SCR cost on PTS doing AP's to get heroics is going to take much longer than that.

Yes, and for those who think @aiqa's estimations are black magic or "can't be done", it's simple Bayesian math. Granted, the variance is higher for Justice Gear vs Heroic Gear, but you can still make comparisons on the averages.

avianos · January 2016

notyuu wrote: »

>Batflight still prevents players from being able to attack while using it, consdering the cost increase that should be at least fixed

Oh Hey this power still exists
Oh Hey this Travel Power is still Trash and Self-harming
Oh Hey this Travel Power is only useful Underwater

roughbearmattach · January 2016

notyuu said:

> Sepherim on the become celestial device now deals 2 ticks of 1 slashing damage per second to the user and most friendly NPCS in range of the user.

Wait--Seraphim deals slashing damage? Not dimensional?

I never checked that with the latest changes. If that is the case, it needs to be fixed.

riverocean · January 2016

Subjective feedback here - but I just don't see the incentive to grind for the heroics at these prices.

It makes more sense to use Mercenary Gear (of high level Blue Gear) to wear while you grind for Justice Gear. Or just use the leveling gear you can easily buy from Q or Onslaught vendors.

For that much effort - it just makes more sense to go for the J-gear. Which of course means doing things that generate $$ for the game. Like Buying keys or selling Q to get drifter salvage. I get that's not a scientific/mathematical analysis but it's my opinion as a long-time player.

draogn · January 2016

lunnylunny said:
So, avoiding repeating what has most likely already been said and read, with what gear are we supposed to grind for Heroic? Before, any character could work on it's own to get it, but if we're meant to play with teams, it means any build that requires proper gearing to work is going to hold back the other players. I'd have nerfed heroics to fit what it currently is: Base end level gear rather than make it so much harder to obtain.

That aside, I'm happy with the AP/CS changes, even though I'd double most of the SCR rewards you currently have. But that may or not be because I absolutely hate grinding: I personally do not see how doing something over and over and over again would be rewarding.

An idea, though, perhaps the AP/CS rewards with extra Recognition each instance completed on higher difficulties, or perhaps just on Elite difficulty.

I'm guessing they are trying to push people towards buying Q to buy Merc gear. Wallet warriors need loving too I guess.

notyuu · January 2016

roughbearmattach said:

notyuu said:

> Sepherim on the become celestial device now deals 2 ticks of 1 slashing damage per second to the user and most friendly NPCS in range of the user.
Wait--Seraphim deals slashing damage? Not dimensional?

I never checked that with the latest changes. If that is the case, it needs to be fixed.

the one on the become celestial device yeah, it does slashing damage to the device user, nearby friendly NPCs and to players that are on the same team as the user, the normal one does dimentional damage to hostiles.

jaazaniah1 · January 2016

This is about my experience as well; about 1 token on average for 8 runs. At the moment SC and LI seem to me to be a bit more generous per run that F&I and G. I've got 20+ sets now, so this is based on a not tiny data set.

"When playing smart and alting after getting 600q per rampage, usually it takes between 5 and 10 runs to get 1 token. Then when counting about 15 minutes per rampage, that would take between 75 an 150 minutes per token, and for 18 tokens that is 2700 minutes or 45 hours.
And while this is a very significant time investment, with the SCR cost on PTS doing AP's to get heroics is going to take much longer than that.

Yes, and for those who think @aiqa's estimations are black magic or "can't be done", it's simple Bayesian math. Granted, the variance is higher for Justice Gear vs Heroic Gear, but you can still make comparisons on the averages."

Unknown · January 2016

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amyjia · January 2016

I am very happy to see such an open and willing to listen Dev team here. You can see it in the updates that come out. Please people don't ignore that they are trying to listen to suggestions while also meeting the goals that they have to/want to meet for this game. It is very nice that we are getting this type of attention, but if you all would like to keep getting this type of attention, it would probably be smart to think before berating the Devs/changes they are making.

Anyways, I will mention this (though the environment there is particularly toxic and inappropriate thanks to 1 SG that is led by someone who thinks threatening and harassing other players is A-OK. An example of this can be found in the Hero Games section in this thread. Also in this thread there is admittance of spawn killing which is something that could discourage new people from wanting to queue up again.

But I digress, I wanted to mention the Hero Games. Heroic Gear can now be obtained from them (woo hoo). Could they also be made a source of recognition? The Hero Games are already tiered, but hopefully there could be a way to reward the recognition based on the players individual lvl (like will be the case for the alert daily recognition reward). Also, you guys seem to have made strides in regards to the queuing systems you use. Could the Hero Games queues also be updated/corrected so they don't kick people from teams?

Once again, Thanks soo much for all of your Efforts Devs

soulforger · January 2016

First: Love the Cherub Wings, they are cute.
Second: Prices in the recog vendors are still to high.
Third: If we keep the prices high, might want things that reward recog to reward the 10 packs instead of only one recog.
Fourth: Can we finally get C-Store Costumes on the Debugger along with purchasable Costume Slots? Just a small QoL improvement.
Fifth: Can we also get all the c-store travel powers in the debugger.

deadman20 · January 2016

Yeah, even though more SCR Rewards are arriving, (I'm thankful for that, by the way.) The increase in price for Heroics is rather much considering how little SCR is actually rewarded from its various new sources. I get that you want to extend the time it takes for rather good equipment, and I respect that. To me though, these new sources are incredibly intensive on time. Time is important and not many people have a lot of it, so why gate us on playtime? Dailies, long instances, lairs, all of these things take quite a bit of time to play through, or wait for to cooldown once completed. Since we can't focus on the former, why don't we do something about the latter?

Instead of limiting our SCR gains by forcing us to wait for daily missions to cool down, perhaps some missions don't need to have the cooldown period at all? Let's take UNITY into account. Each normal UNITY Mission rewards 1 SCR on completion, correct? Why not allow us to grind out these missions infinitely for the days that they are available? I.e. - Removing the requirement to have the Overwatch Mission to pick them up and removing the daily restriction. It's only one SCR a mission, which isn't much, but for a person who can put enough crunch-time into it, say they have 30 minutes of playtime, they could do the entire UNITY set twice whereas they wouldn't have been able to run an AP in that time. It gives them an opportunity to keep up.

This wouldn't become "The absolute best way" to farm SCR either since it's only 1 SCR a mission. Players who can afford the time can still chase after larger sources of SCR such as the Alerts, Rampages, and Adventures for that larger score of SCR. This is just a suggestion, but it would definitely be nice to have ways to get SCR that aren't gating our time. The only reason we didn't complain about the time-gate of the old method is because we got so much SCR that it was irrelevant. If we plan on increasing prices and reducing the rewards at the same time though, we should have a reliable method to collect SCR from, even if only a little SCR. I suggested the UNITY 1 regular missions because they are short, simple, and don't reward so much that it would render other SCR sources useless.

Aside from that, I would very much appreciate it if Heroics didn't cost us 200 SCR for one piece. Part of Heroics' charm was that it was something we could work up and collect at any time rather than something we had to grind our souls out like nails on a chalkboard to build up for.

sigmaseven0 · January 2016

amyjia said:
Heroic Gear can now be obtained from them (woo hoo). Could they also be made a source of recognition? The Hero Games are already tiered, but hopefully there could be a way to reward the recognition based on the players individual lvl (like will be the case for the alert daily recognition reward). Also, you guys seem to have made strides in regards to the queuing systems you use. Could the Hero Games queues also be updated/corrected so they don't kick people from teams?

YES!
PVP is a form of end game and being able to get level appropriate recognition form some kind of pvp daily would be much appreciated. This along updating the PVP queue system would would be a nice step toward bringing PVP back to the contrition it was in before "On Alert".

Hero Games vendor updates and the addition of Onslaught are the most love PVP has seen in years. This fills me with hope.

draogn · January 2016

Making the vendor prices absurd isn't going to encourage a community built around solo play to suddenly want to become a team play oriented community. That's just going to alienate the portion of players who are here because they can get everything in a reasonable time solo.

ealford1985 · January 2016

Posted in the reward section but I don't like the BoP for action figures, makes zero sense

thatcursedwolf · January 2016

draogn said:
Making the vendor prices absurd isn't going to encourage a community built around solo play to suddenly want to become a team play oriented community. That's just going to alienate the portion of players who are here because they can get everything in a reasonable time solo.

I think the devs missed the very heavily implied sarcasm tags on all the "Players love it!" posts about the grind fest that was Delta Rising.

Or we got one of the CoH devs who thought the punitive rates of Dark Astoria were actually a viable means of progressing in the Incarnate system for the evil no good baddity bad bads who didn't want to play their Censoredcraft wannabe raids.

draogn · January 2016

thatcursedwolf said:

draogn said:
Making the vendor prices absurd isn't going to encourage a community built around solo play to suddenly want to become a team play oriented community. That's just going to alienate the portion of players who are here because they can get everything in a reasonable time solo.
I think the devs missed the very heavily implied sarcasm tags on all the "Players love it!" posts about the grind fest that was Delta Rising.

Or we got one of the CoH devs who thought the punitive rates of Dark Astoria were actually a viable means of progressing in the Incarnate system for the evil no good baddity bad bads who didn't want to play their Censoredcraft wannabe raids.

Possibly, they seemed hellbent on changing the game from the casual solo/alt friendly game to an extra grindy team centric Korean grindfest.

chaelk · January 2016

quasimojo1 wrote: »

so , could you please tell me what the average time/ amount of runs you need to do to get Rampage gear is?

and for those people who aren't lucky enough to get the tokens drops???

When playing smart and alting after getting 600q per rampage, usually it takes between 5 and 10 runs to get 1 token. Then when counting about 15 minutes per rampage, that would take between 75 an 150 minutes per token, and for 18 tokens that is 2700 minutes or 45 hours.
And while this is a very significant time investment, with the SCR cost on PTS doing AP's to get heroics is going to take much longer than that.

Yes, and for those who think @aiqa's estimations are black magic or "can't be done", it's simple Bayesian math. Granted, the variance is higher for Justice Gear vs Heroic Gear, but you can still make comparisons on the averages.

as one of the people at the bad,small end of that curve. 5-10runs/token sounds miraculously good.At least with the SCR tokens, I KNOW that I will get them.

Please make tokens account bound.

shiningdarkness · January 2016

Hmmm, but fixed but none that I've mentioned were fixed... Interesting. Well, lets assume they've missed my post on the first page of devices thread and repost it here.

shiningdarkness#2717 said:
Thanks for fixes but you forgot about about those abuses:

Tractor Beam - Ignores Knock Resistance
Shockwave - Old Travel Power Removing Mechanics (perma tp removal)
Sentinel Mastery - 5% of max hp heal per second, scales up to 25% hp per second on 5 targets. Not reducible by heal debuffs.
Ice Grenades - Removes All Flying Travel Powers

Added:
Experimental Blaster (gadgets) 1% transform proc works on players, which is pretty much the same as insta gibbing 1% advantage vs a player which was fixed.
2 Smoke Grenade debuffs on 1 player from 2 other players make it perma stealth disable, which is equal to crybaby nade that was nerfed.

And a new bug i noticed:

MAGICIANS DUST - old device that is pretty much a crybaby grenade equivalent + it removes all travel powers from enemy.
Spark Shield states it should reflect 15%, but it reflects much less.
Eruption doesn't root, it only applies root resistance.
Regeneration Cores don't scale with rank,
Teleios Lightning Rod device version doesn't move to target.
Foxbat's Painball Gun device can't be used at all.
Teleious Invention core mod seems to be doing nothing.
Neutralizer Grenades do nothing.

And teh suggestion:

Speaking of Omicron/Psionic surge... Can we completely remove this tiny knock chance from them? They honestly serve no purpose except for giving your enemies free knock resistance... Honestly, we have plenty of RNG in this game already, so why do we need those tiny useless procs that increase an amount of RNG even more?

Please think about it, honestly those kinds of procs add no depth to game whatsoever and only add annoyance.

If the patch will go live and nothing of this will be fixed I will stop posting on this forum forever + remove all information I've already provided and good luck fixing this game all by yourself then.

sterga · January 2016

"Items priced at 1000 tokens have been reduced to 975 to prevent players from accidentally losing tokens."

Lol. Really?

Grind can be made fun, but this isn't the way to do it. When you practice a song until perfection in Rock Band, that's grinding. But it's fun because you're trying to learn the song (engaging) and it's probably a song you like. Diablo 3 and Path of Exile are loot grind games, but are fun because they have a lot of variety. Path of Exile encourages re-rolling. I can share gear between characters easily. There are plenty of build enabling uniques that encourage making new builds. I can run a Tropical Island map 20 times and every one of those times will be different because of map mods and various other random things that can occur.

CO has alerts as pretty much the only variety in the game and that's in the form of your team composition, not the maps or mobs. Sure, the new lair is probably fun and exciting the first few times it's played, but it's never going to change. Welcome to the reasons I don't like raids. Once you know how it's scripted, it instantly becomes boring. The only reason to do the new lair becomes to grind for tokens, which isn't fun anymore. I don't understand the point of making content that is essentially do and dump. Isn't the treadmill of having to eternally make new content that's going to be ignored in a few weeks tiring? Does adding in grind in such a tedious way help with that? Or does it just drive players to other games?

orangeitis · January 2016

Anyone have pics of the subscriber reward? Sounds interesting.

thatcursedwolf said:

draogn said:
Making the vendor prices absurd isn't going to encourage a community built around solo play to suddenly want to become a team play oriented community. That's just going to alienate the portion of players who are here because they can get everything in a reasonable time solo.
I think the devs missed the very heavily implied sarcasm tags on all the "Players love it!" posts about the grind fest that was Delta Rising.

They didn't miss those posts. They just knew those players were wrong.

xrazamax · January 2016

*Don't mind me just waiting on that new pts thread*

soulforger · January 2016

sterga said:
"Items priced at 1000 tokens have been reduced to 975 to prevent players from accidentally losing tokens."

Lol. Really?

Grind can be made fun, but this isn't the way to do it. When you practice a song until perfection in Rock Band, that's grinding. But it's fun because you're trying to learn the song (engaging) and it's probably a song you like. Diablo 3 and Path of Exile are loot grind games, but are fun because they have a lot of variety. Path of Exile encourages re-rolling. I can share gear between characters easily. There are plenty of build enabling uniques that encourage making new builds. I can run a Tropical Island map 20 times and every one of those times will be different because of map mods and various other random things that can occur.

CO has alerts as pretty much the only variety in the game and that's in the form of your team composition, not the maps or mobs. Sure, the new lair is probably fun and exciting the first few times it's played, but it's never going to change. Welcome to the reasons I don't like raids. Once you know how it's scripted, it instantly becomes boring. The only reason to do the new lair becomes to grind for tokens, which isn't fun anymore. I don't understand the point of making content that is essentially do and dump. Isn't the treadmill of having to eternally make new content that's going to be ignored in a few weeks tiring? Does adding in grind in such a tedious way help with that? Or does it just drive players to other games?

Random maps in this game...

Unknown · January 2016

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roughbearmattach · January 2016

sterga said:
Sure, the new lair is probably fun and exciting the first few times it's played, but it's never going to change. Welcome to the reasons I don't like raids. Once you know how it's scripted, it instantly becomes boring. The only reason to do the new lair becomes to grind for tokens, which isn't fun anymore.

Alas, this may be true.
What is the alternative, though? Give out the rewards quickly, and burn through the replay value of the new content even faster?

soulforger · January 2016

roughbearmattach said:

sterga said:
Sure, the new lair is probably fun and exciting the first few times it's played, but it's never going to change. Welcome to the reasons I don't like raids. Once you know how it's scripted, it instantly becomes boring. The only reason to do the new lair becomes to grind for tokens, which isn't fun anymore.
Alas, this may be true.
What is the alternative, though? Give out the rewards quickly, and burn through the replay value of the new content even faster?

Nope, its making things random, like in diablo 3 and other games that feature random dungeons.

amyjia · January 2016

shiningdarkness#2717 said:

If the patch will go live and nothing of this will be fixed I will stop posting on this forum forever + remove all information I've already provided and good luck fixing this game all by yourself then.

Do you seriously think this is appropriate? Threatening? Some people would be tempted to ignore you just based on this statement.
Also a few of the things you mentioned are things the Devs themselves have said they wanted to do in the patch notes, so IF they aren't correct they will fix them sooner or later. They are things identified by them. Just let them know they are still not working as they intend them to work and let them work their magic.

Now, I am going to ask you about the Sentinel Mastery. You say it is healing 5% instead of 2%. Are you sure about this? Have you experienced it? Is the healing only coming from sentinel mastery? Also when you say the healing scales up to 25% in a team of 5, are you saying each member is healed for 25% of their hp by sentinel mastery per tick, or that each member is healed for 5% of their max hp times 5 members would equal 25% of their hp healed?

spinnytop · January 2016

shiningdarkness#2717 said:

If the patch will go live and nothing of this will be fixed I will stop posting on this forum forever + remove all information I've already provided and good luck fixing this game all by yourself then.

Well, bye Snake, or whoever you are. The best way to make devs deaf to your posts is to treat them like you're entitled to boss them around and cuss them out. You're not as important as you think you are.

pantagruel01 · January 2016

amyjia said:
Now, I am going to ask you about the Sentinel Mastery. You say it is healing 5% instead of 2%. Are you sure about this? Have you experienced it? Is the healing only coming from sentinel mastery? Also when you say the healing scales up to 25% in a team of 5, are you saying each member is healed for 25% of their hp by sentinel mastery per tick, or that each member is healed for 5% of their max hp times 5 members would equal 25% of their hp healed?

Okay, I have certainly experienced it. The way it works is:

Sentinel mastery heals by 5% per tic (not 2%)
Sentinel mastery has a maximum tic rate of 1 per second per target.
If you hit 5 targets with, say, mental storm, it will proc sentinel master on each target, then hit each target once per second, and heal the user by 5% of health once per second per target -- so 25% per second.

spinnytop · January 2016

So personally, I feel like for an "average casual player" ( 10-20 hours actively played per week ), getting 1 piece of gear a week seems reasonable. This is kind of the gear rate I've gotten used to in other MMOs over the years and it's worked well. If I get 1 piece of gear for a week of 'work', then I feel satisfied.

amyjia · January 2016

pantagruel01 said:

amyjia said:
Now, I am going to ask you about the Sentinel Mastery. You say it is healing 5% instead of 2%. Are you sure about this? Have you experienced it? Is the healing only coming from sentinel mastery? Also when you say the healing scales up to 25% in a team of 5, are you saying each member is healed for 25% of their hp by sentinel mastery per tick, or that each member is healed for 5% of their max hp times 5 members would equal 25% of their hp healed?
Okay, I have certainly experienced it. The way it works is:
Sentinel mastery heals by 5% per tic (not 2%)
Sentinel mastery has a maximum tic rate of 1 per second per target.
If you hit 5 targets with, say, mental storm, it will proc sentinel master on each target, then hit each target once per second, and heal the user by 5% of health once per second per target -- so 25% per second.

OIC. So to correct this they could either change the tooltip to say 5% (not 2%), or lower the actual healing sentinel mastery is doing by 3%.

If it is lowered, a person hitting five targets at once that have each had sentinel mastery activated will each heal the attacker 2% of their max hp(the attacker's hp) per hit per sec, so 10% per sec.

The part about the mastery working per target seems to be as intended since it is actually in the description of the specialization tree skill.

sigmaseven0 · January 2016

shiningdarkness#2717 said:

If the patch will go live and nothing of this will be fixed I will stop posting on this forum forever + remove all information I've already provided and good luck fixing this game all by yourself then.

In the last few months we got more pvp love (onslaught and pvp vendor update) than in recent memory. Every thing we want may not be in this patch, but the patch is already getting too big. This new dev team is more sympathetic to PVP than most or our previous ones so maybe we can nurture this momentum into some positive PVP change in 2016.

Since this dev team is new, I would suggest giving them a year to make their mark before passing judgement on them and rage quitting.

If you do decide to quit then....Can i have your stuff? No sarcasm, I'm sincerely asking. If you don't give it to me, give it so somebody in your SG. If you are who I think you are then I should be in your friends list, just shoot me a mail with some G in it.
Real talk.

xrazamax · January 2016

Sentinel Mastery's issues have already been posted in the bugs thread.

ladygadfly · January 2016

New build is up: http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/championsonline/#/discussion/1204130/fc-31-20151210a-19-bug-fixes

FC.31.20151210a.18 - Cherub Wings Subscriber Piece &amp; Bug Fixes

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FC.31.20151210a.18 - Cherub Wings Subscriber Piece & Bug Fixes