Looking for good Power Armor build

prettycelt · July 2015

I have been trying out PA's set, and just can't make it work all that well. Concussor Beam and Eye Beam apparently shut themselves off if you're not facing the target the whole time (and the damage on Eye Beam is kinda pathetic), and Plasma Beam doesn't even target at all. Chest Beam seems nice, but if it is in fact actually debuffing, it doesn't seem to be all that much, and because it is a charge instead of a toggle, it won't proc Overdrive. I'm only level 14 so far but energy seems to be an issue (I SS'd Con/Int).

I'd really hoped for a Particle damage build with all three toggle spots filled so that later I can take Fire All Weapons (and I bought the Cyber Augmented Questionite secondaries for the +25% non-physical damage boost). I'd taken Invulnerability but am not necessarily looking to tank, just wanted a damage dealer who can take some hits. This is a Freeform build so I'm not deadset on all PA powers, but I'd like to keep it somewhat pure for the sake of theme.

Open to suggestions on a leveling and end-run build.

flowcyto · July 2015

If ur soloing and can guarantee you getting hit, then Defiance could help a good deal. If not, then try AoPM for a good balance that also has the potential for good dps.
If ya wanna go full dps mode in the Ranged role, then Quarry (w/ an Int focus) or Elec Form are the best bets for Particle PA (still prob have more energy issues than the other two options).

For the facing part: I think there's options in the game menu to help ur camera auto-face w/e ya target w/ attacks. Its not an option I normally turn on, but it couldn't hurt to try. Plasma Beam itself is manually aimed, so ya just gotta get used to that if ur planning on using it (its nice if ya can get the hang of it). Chest Beam itself is good, but its also a bit of an energy hog, so I would mostly rely on Concussor and Eye beams for single target- throwing in Chest Beams if ya have extra energy for em.

Some AOs can also help w/ energy: LnL, Elec Sheath, or Immolation. CoAP is also an option, though its immobile and requires casting.

The dps-oriented Q sets aren't really worth it, imo, cause the dmg bonuses are in the earliest/passive layer. Armadillo (for more tankyness via the 3-set), or Nem gear (higher stat totals), and/or just normal gear w/ the right stats (Rec_End_Int, Con for Defiance, cost discount on utility pieces) can work just fine.

Don't expect to solve ur energy issues w/ PA at lower levels- just to alleviate them a bit. Getting the 3rd SS helps, but then again so does leveling to get better gear and stats in general.

raighn · July 2015

Power Armor builds are challenging to run for leveling... I'm currently running 2 of them and both encounter their fair share of energy issues... at lvl 40 though with proper gear energy becomes far less of a concern for them.

A few tips:

Plasma Beam: best to use without a target selected as you can adjust where it aims by rotating your character. It's arguably the stongest particle based PA ability available as well.

Concussor Beam: Most PA builds skip this power if they take Plasma Beam... it's good for keeping enemies at a distance, but when it comes to damage, Plasma Beam will perform far better most of the time.

Chest Beam: The "debuff" it applies is actually fairly significant. It may not be a toggle, but you'll be able to keep Overdrive rolling fairly easily with just a hand & shoulder slot toggle/maintain.

Eye Beams: The only reason to take this power is if you absolutly must keep to particle damage for your shoulder slot, or just like the theme of eye beams... However, if you take it you must take the advantage 20/20 Fission.

Reconstruction Circuits: Chest slot toggle & heal... enough said...

While leveling, you'll likely have to energy build a bit. You certainly wont be able to maintain more than 1 or 2 toggles at a time until atleast lvl 30...

Something you could do while levelinng that would aid with energy management is open with chest beam, maintain eye beams, and full charge power gauntlet, with the occasional switch to plasma beam. This should allow you to maintain a constant 1 or 2 stacks of Overdrive with minimal energy building.... most PA builds won't use power gauntlet, but while leveling it can help with energy management until you can get proper gear and stats to counter PAs high energy costs.

helbjorn · July 2015

In most high-damage rotations I've tested, working Chest Beam in for the debuff is actually a loss, and not an insignificant one.

The highest PA DPS you'll get is unfortunately physical, with Mini Gun, Micro Munitions, and Tactical Missiles. Like particle builds, it's also a real energy hog, but DEX/INT/REC with some END geared/stat'd in is the most ideal combo I've found. Physical PA DPS is not only dependent on crit levels, but on how long you can run both toggles and full charges of TM before hitting your EB. For example, in Gravitar runs I can stay at 100' range and never have to use my EB, relying on AO's and Overdrive alone.

My physical build with easy-to-acquire purple and heroic gear puts out 5k+ DPS; with Justice gear it can deliver 7k+.

helbjorn · July 2015

Wow, awesome new forums.

flowcyto · July 2015

I'd prob still keep Concussor in a build using OD here, since Power Gauntlet can't work w/ OD, and Plasma Beam, though good, is much more of an energy commitment if used w/ other slotted attacks.

In most high-damage rotations I've tested, working Chest Beam in for the debuff is actually a loss, and not an insignificant one.

In these rotations, though, are you using the same attacks that prettycelt is (Eye and Concussor Beams)? I think ur referring to not using Micro Muni to take time out to use Chest Beam for its debuff? And for that scenario, yeah I can see that potentially not being a dps gain, since ur trading one attack for another, but that's not really applicable if ya can't use Micro Muni anyways due to the concept- ur options then are either use a heal (circuits) or no chest slot powers at all.

And yea from a practical standpoint, Physical dmg PA is def better, but that's not really relevant here.. unless the OP wants to make some concessions on the theme.

helbjorn · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

And yea from a practical standpoint, Physical dmg PA is def better, but that's not really relevant here..

I believe the relevance of other posters' contributions should be determined by the OP, or has this actually become the Flowcyto subforum?

prettycelt · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

I'd prob still keep Concussor in a build using OD here, since Power Gauntlet can't work w/ OD, and Plasma Beam, though good, is much more of an energy commitment if used w/ other slotted attacks.

In most high-damage rotations I've tested, working Chest Beam in for the debuff is actually a loss, and not an insignificant one.

In these rotations, though, are you using the same attacks that prettycelt is (Eye and Concussor Beams)? I think ur referring to not using Micro Muni to take time out to use Chest Beam for its debuff? And for that scenario, yeah I can see that potentially not being a dps gain, since ur trading one attack for another, but that's not really applicable if ya can't use Micro Muni anyways due to the concept- ur options then are either use a heal (circuits) or no chest slot powers at all.

And yea from a practical standpoint, Physical dmg PA is def better, but that's not really relevant here.. unless the OP wants to make some concessions on the theme.

I'm not deadset on keeping it all Particle damage as much as I was deadset on keeping it in Power Armor theme. In the little bit of experimentation I've done since first posting this, I am loving Minigun (I have it at R2 with the armor-piercing and infrared sensor advantages), it just chews things up. I currently have Power Gauntlet to toss in with it or just to take out stragglers. I was never much impressed with Eye Beams to begin with, so I think I'll just keep Minigun as my Shoulder slot.

I was also not really thrilled with how Plasma Beam won't target...yeah, I can see an advantage to it being able to just fire wherever I face but it doesn't fit my playstyle. So the Hand slot may as well go to Tactical Missile, in which case I'm 2/3 of the way all physical damage and should just as well use Micro Munitions for Chest (I like the radius explosion anyway). Then I'd have a Chest and Shoulder toggle with a Charge-up Hand so OD ought to proc often.

Oh and btw, Defiance seems to be working better than Invulnerability on the energy end of things, thanks for that suggestion.

Was there a particular reason most PA builds I've seen all use Wrist Bolter instead of the other EB (I forget the name)?

flowcyto · July 2015

I believe the relevance of other posters' contributions should be determined by the OP, or has this actually become the Flowcyto subforum?

I have every right to make and voice my own judgement about topics such as relevancy when talking about builds, as does anyone here. Yes, ultimately its up to the OP, but I wasn't saying that it wasn't- so no argument there.

Edit: and it seems the OP made up their mind as far as being able to go outside the Particle dmg concept, which I'm fine with.

flowcyto · July 2015

Was there a particular reason most PA builds I've seen all use Wrist Bolter instead of the other EB (I forget the name)?

Cause the AA adv allows it to take the place of a PA Hand slot, so ya can also use ur EB as a normal PA attack. The problem w/ that adv, though, is that its pretty clunky in how it controls- the switching from 'EB mode' to 'PA attack' mode has some notable delay to it. The other problem is that Wrist Bolter itself doesn't do much dps as a Hand slot, so its not really ideal if ya can manage ur energy w/ any of the other Hand slot attacks. Its an option to consider, but I'd first test it out to see if ya like the 'feel' of it, similar to trying to handle Plasma Beam- its not for everyone.

And yea, the ideal PA dps setup is Tac Missiles, Micro Muni, and Minigun w/ adv. Avenger Mastery is technically the best w/ a blast like TM, though Guardicator is still a good choice for specs when using such a setup. Unfortunately, the Particle powers just aren't optimal in that respect.

Oh, and I almost forgot- Wrist Bolter itself requires facing, so in light of ur grievances w/ the other powers originally that may be an issue.

prettycelt · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

Was there a particular reason most PA builds I've seen all use Wrist Bolter instead of the other EB (I forget the name)?

Cause the AA adv allows it to take the place of a PA Hand slot, so ya can also use ur EB as a normal PA attack. The problem w/ that adv, though, is that its pretty clunky in how it controls- the switching from 'EB mode' to 'PA attack' mode has some notable delay to it. The other problem is that Wrist Bolter itself doesn't do much dps as a Hand slot, so its not really ideal if ya can manage ur energy w/ any of the other Hand slot attacks. Its an option to consider, but I'd first test it out to see if ya like the 'feel' of it, similar to trying to handle Plasma Beam- its not for everyone.

And yea, the ideal PA dps setup is Tac Missiles, Micro Muni, and Minigun w/ adv. Avenger Mastery is technically the best w/ a blast like TM, though Guardicator is still a good choice for specs when using such a setup. Unfortunately, the Particle powers just aren't optimal in that respect.

Oh, and I almost forgot- Wrist Bolter itself requires facing, so in light of ur grievances w/ the other powers originally that may be an issue.

I'm confused and obviously missing something here about Automated Assault...what's the advantage in having Wrist Bolter function as a normal PA attack?

flowcyto · July 2015

Imo not much of one, but it is easier on energy (the PA slot version of AA is energy neutral, iirc, unlike it obv costing energy to use any other hand slot power) and technically makes the EB slot also an attack slot, so in a way freeing up space in a build.

Its not to my taste, nor would I consider it optimal for PA, but some players have used AA and like it.

raighn · July 2015

The main advantage to Automated Assault is with End PSS builds using Kickback.

flowcyto · July 2015

I wouldn't consider having to use End PSS an advantage, though.

pantagruel01 · July 2015

Okay, I've got a high end PA build. Some points:

I would avoid using wrist bolter, particularly with automated assault; the mode switching is slow and glitchy so it's very slow to activate.
I disagree that physical PA is the best; I personally use chest beam/concussor/minigun. However, I also use MSA on a build with around 500 Int; if you're using Overdrive you probably can't afford to feed chest beam.
All of the PA maintains have facing issues. The targeting of plasma beam is... special... but only the charge powers don't cut out if you're not facing your target, and you can only use one charge at a time.

flowcyto · July 2015

pantagruel01 wrote: »

[*] I disagree that physical PA is the best; I personally use chest beam/concussor/minigun. However, I also use MSA on a build with around 500 Int; if you're using Overdrive you probably can't afford to feed chest beam.

Chest Beam is def higher base dps than Micro Muni, plus there's the debuff to consider. So ur right if there's enough energy, but 'enough energy' is def the hangup for the case of spamming Chest Beam.

Are ya using other tools or 'tricks' for that setup, such as using CoAP or taking AoPM as the passive, etc?

pantagruel01 · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

Are ya using other tools or 'tricks' for that setup, such as using CoAP or taking AoPM as the passive, etc?

Here, Tempus Fugit. Not totally maxed out (I have neither psionic storm nor strafing run).

flowcyto · July 2015

Hm, a dual passive build. Judging by Initiative being taken, I'd assume ya still have to end build some regardless? I mean, that's understandable, but I'm still curious how Concussor + ChestB + Minigun + some end building w/ Guardicator compares to TM + Micro + Minigun + Avenger Mastery w/ little-no end building. I wouldn't actually think them to be that far apart, but I haven't parsed them myself.

raighn · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

Hm, a dual passive build. Judging by Initiative being taken, I'd assume ya still have to end build some regardless? I mean, that's understandable, but I'm still curious how Concussor + ChestB + Minigun + some end building w/ Guardicator compares to TM + Micro + Minigun + Avenger Mastery w/ little-no end building. I wouldn't actually think them to be that far apart, but I haven't parsed them myself.

I can't speak for a build using Concussor beam... but... I can give my personal experience with Plasma + ChestB + Minigun vs TM + Micro + Launcher... the damage output from the two builds is actually fairly close... though in my personal experience the build using Micro comes out on top still... I've also done a comparison with Plasma + ChestB>Micro + Minigun... the build that uses ChestB only for the debuff in my experience came out on top...

pantagruel01 · July 2015

flowcyto wrote: »

Hm, a dual passive build. Judging by Initiative being taken, I'd assume ya still have to end build some regardless? I mean, that's understandable, but I'm still curious how Concussor + ChestB + Minigun + some end building w/ Guardicator compares to TM + Micro + Minigun + Avenger Mastery w/ little-no end building. I wouldn't actually think them to be that far apart, but I haven't parsed them myself.

It's probably comparable, I haven't tried using a build like that myself and it's tough to judge relative parses when you don't know the gearing and skills of the other person. Under powerhouse test dummy conditions I get a bit over 5k dps, but Kaiserin would probably do more with the same setup, I've never been able to match her numbers with any powers.

prettycelt · July 2015

I'm back to experimentation, this time using Eyebeam/Plasma Beam/Chest Beam (mainly just tap for the debuff). As far as the targeting/facing issue, I've found that having "Disable hostile target auto-facing" OFF, with "Always Face Forward" and "Allow turning when facing target" ON allows me to move around my targets while still firing Eyebeams or Plasma Beam into them the entire time.

So basically it's an Eyebeam to get their attention from a distance, then tap Chest Beam for the debuff and fry them with Plasma Beam. Eyebeam could have just as easily been Minigun, of course, and Minigun is better damage (and is AoE to boot), but it eats more energy which is then not there for Plasma Beam.

At my current level, specs and gear, a full 6-second Minigun (U-28/Infrared sensor) attack would eat 188.6 energy and deal 1704 damage (less for targets behind the initial target). I'm just looking at the power descriptions for these numbers, this isn't from any kind of parse. A full 5.5-second Eyebeam (20/20) would eat 125 energy and deal 1309 damage (more for targets behind the initial target). So the Eyebeam is slightly more damage per energy spent ratio than Minigun, but it's negligible and probably only because I'm wearing the Cyber-Augmented Q secondary gear for the +25% non-physical damage buff.

Really it just seems to come down to theme and personal preferences. Eyebeam looks cooler alongside Plasma Beam than Minigun does IMO. I only wish Eyebeam offered Challenging Strikes like Minigun does for the offtank role I want to play with this toon, or applied Plasma Burn, or something. Just having the advantage that lets it burn thru to other targets after the eternity of 5 seconds seems rather lackluster.

carrionbaggage · July 2015

Since you're going the Particle Damage route, you could consider adding Laser Sword (Particle Acceleration). If you don't mind getting close (and if it doesn't break your theme), a single swipe of the sword in-between Eyebeam->Plasma Beam cycles keeps the Particle debuff stacked and offers a nice DPS boost during lengthy boss fights. You could also tack on Crippling Challenge, to help with your off-tanking.

flowcyto · July 2015

At my current level, specs and gear, a full 6-second Minigun (U-28/Infrared sensor) attack would eat 188.6 energy and deal 1704 damage (less for targets behind the initial target). I'm just looking at the power descriptions for these numbers, this isn't from any kind of parse. A full 5.5-second Eyebeam (20/20) would eat 125 energy and deal 1309 damage (more for targets behind the initial target). So the Eyebeam is slightly more damage per energy spent ratio than Minigun, but it's negligible and probably only because I'm wearing the Cyber-Augmented Q secondary gear for the +25% non-physical damage buff.

The base (and I mean no gear/talents//dmg role/etc) dps for Eye Beams is about 200, where Mingun's is about 203. So yeah, they'll be close on single-targets. However, Minigun is often preferred not just cause it can AoE better, but also cause of its debuff adv when used in conjunction w/ other attacks.

prettycelt · July 2015

I ran around doing a LOT of PvE today, and test after test against mobs in the Powerhouse, and finally came to the conclusion that Eyebeam, while fun, simply cannot hold a candle to Minigun. Even with 20/20 advantage. Minigun with the U-238 Rounds for that debuff in combination with the debuff from Chest Beam just rules. And Infrared Guidance advantaged for the 5' width...yeah. I just had to go back to it.

So right now I am running with (at level 25 Hybrid and in no particular order):
UNION JACKRABBIT
The Impulse
Con/Int/Rec

Power Bolts
Minigun (R2/U-238 Rounds/Infrared Guidance System)
Plasma Beam (R2/R3/Challenging Strikes)
Chest Beam (R2)
Defiance
Concentration
Energy Shield (Phalanx Defense System)
Reconstruction Circuits (R2, R3)
Overdrive

Constitution:
Resilient 2/2
Unyielding 2/2
Fuel My Fire 3/3
Armored 2/2
Tough 1/3

Protector:
Bulwark 2/2
Fortified Gear 3/3
Resolute 1/3

Energy has been much better (still not perfect but definitely better). I plan on buying Fire All Weapons, probably Unbreakable and Masterful Dodge to rotate between, some Active Offense, and whatever for the last slot...maybe Energy Wave for the big sphere AoE. The Laser Sword was an interesting suggestion but I don't think I'll go that route, this toon has Flag Speed and is more mobile/ranged (running circles around the targets and burning them down).

Looking for good Power Armor build

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