Dog Control Heeeeeeeelp

pwestolemyname

I am working on a Telepathy build and would like to be able to dog control at Kiga, just to give the regulars a break every now and then. But, I would also like her to be useful in other content. I went Control/DPS, more or less. In regular missions, she's fun, especially solo. Just lock everything down and watch it melt. But, it seems like most of the dog control builds I've seen are Control/Tank.

I've practiced pulling the dogs for a bit. I pop one, they root me and then kill me before they even all gather around me so I can sleep them. Even if I'm blocking. So, I'm wondering if I need more HP and a defensive passive or something.

My sleep is 38 seconds in Hybrid and 48 seconds in Support, using AoPM. It's 36 seconds in Hybrid using Ego Form.

Anyway, here is the build. The leftover advantages are because I took the new advantages on Mental Leech and Shadow of a Doubt. I have a Retcon, so any help would be greatly appreciated.
PowerHouse   (Link to this build)

Name: Vice

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Presence (Primary)
Level 10: Ego (Secondary)
Level 15: Dexterity (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: Mind over Matter
Level 6: Acrobat
Level 9: Finesse
Level 12: Ascetic
Level 15: Shooter
Level 18: Shrug It Off
Level 21: Showmanship

Powers:
Level 1: Psi Lash
Level 1: Ego Sprites (Rank 2, Slave Mentality)
Level 6: Ego Sleep (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 8: Manipulator
Level 11: Telepathic Reverberation
Level 14: Force Shield (Force Sheathe)
Level 17: Lifedrain (Rank 2, Vampiric Sympathy)
Level 20: Mental Storm (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Telekinetic Assault (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 26: Ego Form (Rank 2, Rank 3, Id Blades)
Level 29: Mental Leech (Rank 2)
Level 32: Shadow of Doubt (Rank 2)
Level 35: Masterful Dodge
Level 38: Aura of Primal Majesty (Rank 2, Rank 3)

Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flight
Level 35: Superspeed

Specializations:
Presence: Dominion (2/2)
Presence: Grandeur (3/3)
Presence: Moment of Glory (3/3)
Presence: Force of Will (2/2)
Guardian: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Guardian: Ruthless (2/2)
Guardian: Tenacious (2/2)
Guardian: The Best Defense (3/3)
Vindicator: Aggressive Stance (2/2)
Vindicator: Merciless (3/3)
Vindicator: Modified Gear (2/2)
Vindicator: Mass Destruction (3/3)
Mastery: Vindicator Mastery (1/1)

spinnytop

Okay first thing, Life Drain won't work - it'll break the CC on the dogs. You need sustained healing that doesn't break CC - I use Empathic Healing personally.

Second thing you might consider an aoe stun, something that stops the dogs so you can get that first sleep off. Something like TK Malestrom, ego storm, thunder clap etc

Thirdly, you seem a bit glass cannony so you might have trouble surviving the initial pull to even get the process of holding going.

Otherwise you're fine.

pwestolemyname

spinnytop said:

Second thing you might consider an aoe stun, something that stops the dogs so you can get that first sleep off. Something like TK Malestrom, ego storm, thunder clap etc

Mental Storm won't do that? It's a Paralyze and applies instantly

pantagruel01

pwestolemyname said:

spinnytop said:

Second thing you might consider an aoe stun, something that stops the dogs so you can get that first sleep off. Something like TK Malestrom, ego storm, thunder clap etc

Mental Storm won't do that? It's a Paralyze and applies instantly

Mental storm's hold duration on tap is 0s.

roughbearmattach

Guardicator seems like an issue to me.

You need another spec to boost Hold strength/duration. If you swapped on of your specs for Sentinel, you could pick up a nice HoT, plus better holds.

I tried doing a pure AoPM CCer, but it generally could not survive the *second phase*, since Kiga will take a shot or two at you as you attempt to hold the hounds. Defense just isn't high enough. I run dual-passive, with my second passive being PFF, to essentially give my toon another 8K health (I switch back to AoPM once I establish the holds).

You may want to drop one of your telepathy DoTs to make this build work. I went through a lot of heartache messing with an existing toon to get it to be a dog CCer--compromises have to be made.

pwestolemyname

roughbearmattach said:

Guardicator seems like an issue to me.

You need another spec to boost Hold strength/duration. If you swapped on of your specs for Sentinel, you could pick up a nice HoT, plus better holds.

I thought 30 seconds of hold minimum was what was needed? My durations right now are more than that. Do I need that much more? I mean, I'll give up my Wardicator if I haaaaaaaaaaaave to, but I'd really rather not.

pantagruel01

pwestolemyname said:

I thought 30 seconds of hold minimum was what was needed?

It might be technically possible with 30 seconds, but IME it's quite hard with less than 50-60s, because a 30s hold on a target that has 1 stack hold resist lasts 15s, and it takes 15s for resist to wear off.

Note that 60s is highly desirable on the monkey, because hearts lasts 60s before the next set is spawned.

Sample combat log from pulling dogs:

[Combat (Self)] Your Brainscramble deals 297 (638) Ego Damage to Amaguq.
[Combat (Self)] Akhlut deals 1252 (14165) Cold Damage to you with Lunge.
[Combat (Self)] Amaguq deals 994 (11248) Cold Damage to you with Lunge.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 51 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 45 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Bionic Shielding gives 1377 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Bionic Shielding gives 1379 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Keelut deals 993 (11238) Cold Damage to you with Lunge.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 47 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Bionic Shielding gives 1445 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Qiqirn deals 977 (11060) Cold Damage to you with an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 46 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Bionic Shielding gives 1569 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Qiqirn deals 991 (11210) Cold Damage to you with Lunge.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 47 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Bionic Shielding gives 1410 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Akhlut deals 986 (11158) Cold Damage to you with Icicle Shard.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 47 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Sentinel Aura gives 299 Health Points to you.
[Combat (Self)] Keelut deals 961 (11194) Cold Damage to you with Icicle Shard.
[Combat (Self)] Your Determination gives 46 Energy to you.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 91 (197) Crushing Damage to Akhlut.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 100 (215) Ego Damage to Akhlut.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 92 (198) Crushing Damage to Qiqirn.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 89 (192) Ego Damage to Qiqirn.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 98 (212) Crushing Damage to Amaguq.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 95 (205) Ego Damage to Amaguq.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 131 (281) Crushing Damage to Keelut.
[Combat (Self)] Your Telekinetic Maelstrom deals 138 (298) Ego Damage to Keelut.

pwestolemyname

Cool, thanks for all the info!

dakrushmor

Personally l use this DaKehte 4 mezzin' dawgeZ:

http://powerhouse.nullware.com/powerhouse.html?v=13&n=Wwyhuh the Lamprey&d=1634HSOMPTYH06090049B0W9D033707F703F40LIF05FB007A007B03FA003G03DM0300002sIe0aGG0V2f

PowerHouse (Link to this build)

Name: Wwyhuh the Lamprey

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Presence (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Intelligence (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: Divinity
Level 6: Diplomatic
Level 9: Shrug It Off
Level 12: Healthy Mind
Level 15: Quick Recovery
Level 18: Negotiator
Level 21: Lasting Impression

Powers:
Level 1: Wrist Bolter (Automated Assault)
Level 1: Mini Gun (Challenging Strikes)
Level 6: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 8: Force Shield (Rank 2, Rank 3, Force Sheathe)
Level 11: Ego Sleep (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 14: Ego Sprites (Rank 2, Slave Mentality, Challenging Strikes)
Level 17: Thunderclap (Rank 2, Collateral Damage)
Level 20: Telepathic Reverberation
Level 23: Entangling Mesh
Level 26: Bionic Shielding (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 29: Manipulator
Level 32: Inertial Dampening Field (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Masterful Dodge (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 38:

Travel Powers:
Level 6: Rainbow Flight
Level 35: Athletics

Specializations:
Presence: Repurpose (2/3)
Presence: Selfless Ally (2/2)
Presence: Dominion (2/2)
Presence: Force of Will (2/2)
Presence: Vulnerability (2/2)
Sentinel: Torment (2/2)
Sentinel: Caregiver (3/3)
Sentinel: Sentinel Aura (3/3)
Sentinel: Wither (2/2)
Overseer: Administer (3/3)
Overseer: Overseer Aura (3/3)
Overseer: Trapped (3/3)
Overseer: Conservation (1/2)
Mastery: Sentinel Mastery (1/1)

pwestolemyname

dakrushmor said:

Personally l use this DaKehte 4 mezzin' dawgeZ:

http://powerhouse.nullware.com/powerhouse.html?v=13&n=Wwyhuh the Lamprey&d=1634HSOMPTYH06090049B0W9D033707F703F40LIF05FB007A007B03FA003G03DM0300002sIe0aGG0V2f

Cool. How is it in other content? Do you only use it for dog tanking?

dakrushmor

pwestolemyname said:

dakrushmor said:

Personally l use this DaKehte 4 mezzin' dawgeZ:

http://powerhouse.nullware.com/powerhouse.html?v=13&n=Wwyhuh the Lamprey&d=1634HSOMPTYH06090049B0W9D033707F703F40LIF05FB007A007B03FA003G03DM0300002sIe0aGG0V2f

Cool. How is it in other content? Do you only use it for dog tanking?

Not only, it's also Quiji heart mezzer, Dino soaker & awesome offtank for TA, that also even can replace healer (you can run with it + Main + 3 DPS), if plop lniquity R3 as last power.

dakrushmor

Also l wish to note, that you'll need some extra devices: [Psionic Accelerator] - 150 DS, [Telekinetic Forcefield lnducer] - 50 DS. Also it's not necessary, but you may plop [Revenancy] too, it's Bloodmoon device & quite rare, but due recent Kiga stuff. Dawgez often may shuffle towards main tank due delay of Stun from Thunderclap, after first sleep, but if put Revenancy when they sleep 10 s or something, then shoot one more sleep when old is worn off, they won't shuffle for sure, and there you'll be generated normal # of aggro during 2nd sleep with Ego Sprites. Long ago someone called Revenancy useless, and Eclipse fight hard, and that bad Cryptic planning, but actually it's now maybe the most useful device amongst Bloodmoon ones as it's AoE paralyze, that doesn't consume power slots. And it looks cool. To not hold 2 keyz at once, for example l jammed them this way:
/bind ctrl+2 inventoryexec 1 devices 1 /bind ctrl+3 inventoryexec 1 devices 2 /bind ctrl+4 inventoryexec 1 devices 3

roughbearmattach

Darkrushmor is right to point out devices. My dog CCer does well as TA offtank and heart mezzer, but in regular PvE content, Psionic Accelerator is super helpful in clearing mobs. I also take Psychic Surge device.

pwestolemyname

Okay, here is another shot. I'm going from Control/DPS to Control/Tank/Heal. Basically, Able to handle Kiga's dogs, sleep Hearts, and heal DPS at Dino. Plus, not be pathetically useless in other content, story, Alerts, TA, lairs.

The last 3 powers are still undecided. I think for this to work I need a 100' pull power and a couple of heals. But, I am open to other ideas. I like Ego Blast because it is also a Damage Debuff, which is useful when fighting hard targets.

Also, I have not spent all my Advantage points, so any recommendations there, are appreciated. For example, does ranking up Mental Storm or TK Maelstrom enhance the duration of their mezz effects?

I haven't tested this in game, yet, but I am pretty sure that by stacking PRE and using Support Role with AoPM, I should have nearly 60 seconds of Sleep time.

Also, regarding the Ego Storm vs Mental Storm question, I know that the Paralyze on MS does not happen on tap, but in testing, I can get about 6 seconds duration with a half-second charge. On the other hand, ES requires a maintain of at least a full second to enable Incapacitate. Plus, MS has the range. So, I feel like MS is the better choice. But, if I am mistaken somehow, please let me know.

Okay, here is the build
PowerHouse   (Link to this build)

Name: Vice

Archetype: Freeform

Super Stats:
Level 6: Presence (Primary)
Level 10: Constitution (Secondary)
Level 15: Ego (Secondary)

Talents:
Level 1: Mind over Matter
Level 6: Shrug It Off
Level 9: Showmanship
Level 12: Ascetic
Level 15: Quick Recovery
Level 18: Wordly
Level 21: Lasting Impression

Powers:
Level 1: Psi Lash
Level 1: Ego Sprites (Slave Mentality, Challenging Strikes)
Level 6: Ego Sleep (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 8: Manipulator (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Telepathic Reverberation
Level 14: Mental Storm
Level 17: Telekinetic Shield (Telekinetic Reinforcement)
Level 20: Telekinetic Maelstrom
Level 23: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 26: Aura of Primal Majesty (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 29: Masterful Dodge (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 32: Ego Blast
Level 35: Mindful Reinforcement (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 38: Arcane Vitality (Rank 2, Rank 3)

Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flag Speed
Level 35: Heroic Flight

Specializations:
Presence: Dominion (2/2)
Presence: Grandeur (3/3)
Presence: Moment of Glory (3/3)
Presence: Force of Will (2/2)
Sentinel: Torment (2/2)
Sentinel: Sentinel Aura (3/3)
Sentinel: Rejuvenated (1/3)
Sentinel: Wither (2/2)
Sentinel: Genesis (2/2)
Sentry: Precise (3/3)
Sentry: Sentry Aura (3/3)
Sentry: Stalling Tactics (3/3)
Sentry: Persevere (1/2)
Mastery: Sentinel Mastery (1/1)

spinnytop

Well you can just have a tank pull the dogs for you. That's pretty much the best way to do it now for both phase 1 and 2. That way you just Ego Sleep them off the tank and then get into your normal rotation. That also means you don't need a 100 ft pull anymore, but having a long range attack isn't bad either way. I prefer Mind Break m'self.

With the Ego Sleep + Mental Storm rotation you want as long of a duration as you can get. Basically you want your Mental Storm to last long enough that the stack of hold resist falls off before you apply Ego Sleep, otherwise you'll spend some time with 2 stacks of hold resist which will really cut down your durations. Shorter durations generally makes the whole process riskier and you want everything to be as low risk as possible since once you screw up everybody dies. I think my mental storm lasts just long enough and I think Im at something like 80 seconds on my sleep?