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Smaller amount of ZEN in ZAX orders
dfnce
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 509 Arc User
Current limitation per order is 5K ZEN or 25 mln AD. That means a single account is able to bid for 25K ZEN or 12.5 mln AD simultaneously. This amount of AD is very huge for majority of players. There is no reason to allow such high amount of ZEN per account to placed in ZAX order. A player can make most of single item purchases on ZEN market with 2-3.5k ZEN.
Proposal is more limited account simultaneous bidding for ZEN to 5K total (or 1K zen per order). Queue will consists of same amount of orders but due the fact each order is smaller in ZEN, particilar orders will be implemented quicker. Reducing ZAX timing is good for new players if they want to buy slots/respecs/wards. There is no problem with supply AD to ZAX and paying customers who are exchanging ZEN to AD won't even notice such limitation exists on other side. Obviously multi-account may override it to certain degree, but this is PWE responsibility to police their game.
Only small group of people is able to rotate this amount of wealth in AH-ZAX-ZEN schema. I leave the question that longer ZAX waiting time is actually make you to buy ZEN. This argument is nice in theory and applicable to some people, but for me it falls between "i don't care to wait few weeks" and "PWE corporate brass know what they are doing, obviously".
Proposal is more limited account simultaneous bidding for ZEN to 5K total (or 1K zen per order). Queue will consists of same amount of orders but due the fact each order is smaller in ZEN, particilar orders will be implemented quicker. Reducing ZAX timing is good for new players if they want to buy slots/respecs/wards. There is no problem with supply AD to ZAX and paying customers who are exchanging ZEN to AD won't even notice such limitation exists on other side. Obviously multi-account may override it to certain degree, but this is PWE responsibility to police their game.
Only small group of people is able to rotate this amount of wealth in AH-ZAX-ZEN schema. I leave the question that longer ZAX waiting time is actually make you to buy ZEN. This argument is nice in theory and applicable to some people, but for me it falls between "i don't care to wait few weeks" and "PWE corporate brass know what they are doing, obviously".
EX-DL-BtS / ITF-KC-KB / BF-HD-IBS / FtF-IT-ST-Dis / CA-GW-PG
"When no appropriate rule applies, make one up."— (The unwritten rule)
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— (The unwritten rule)
To put things in a broader perspective note that (AFAIK) the most expensive items in the ZEN store are at present 7500 and 5000 ZEN at present, although all of those are for automatically BtA services.
Then he might as well buy ZEN?...lets face it,its close to impossible without flipping items on AH/exploiting etc. to make 13 mil AD(26k zen at 500 AD/1)
And if someone really wanted to do that and played legitimately,he would most likely play dozens of hours daily since mod 1...so waiting a couple weeks/even months wouldnt be a problem for him.
Lets say he's a free player with 2 character slots(thus making 48k AD daily due to RAD cap) and also making 52k more from selling things on AH.Thats an estimated 100k AD/day so it'd take 130 days(4 monnths 10 days) to make sufficeint amount of AD.On the other hand,getting 26k ZEN with 2 weeks wait and 5k ZEN limit'd take just over 70 days(at most 84 days if last 1k ZEN takes 2 weeks too),which is significally less than amount of time spent to make the AD even at ridiculous 100k /day.
Lets face it:noone ever needs that much ZEN and 1.it gives cryptic no profit as its AD->ZEN exchange and 2.People that put such ridiculous amounts of AD on exchange slow down other orders and create a huge inflation by themselves.Im of the opinion that if the limit was 1k ZEN total,there would be no 2 weeks queue,at most 1 day and AD->ZEN would go down to under 400 again.
The real question is: Why even buy exp/campaign boosters if someone paying so much AD most likely has sufficient amount of time to do all dailies daily,thus no need for the boosters..that cuts the amount of ZEN required to 11000 which at current 2 weeks wait time(which would be shorter because the exchange would be less flooded by people with bilions of AD...)and 5k ZEN limit would only take a month.
On the other hand between invokes and leadership and such I make over 100k day, and that is my only source of income other than occaisionally selling dyes from ctas, professions assets from leadership chests, etc. With nothing in particular I wanted to spend the AD on, last month I gave 5 million AD (via two trash embroidered purses in the AH, so i spent 5.5) to a Foundry author for them to promote the Foundry with, no strings attached. Yes, I gave away 10, 000 zen worth of AD.
12 million is less than you think, and can easily be legitimately earned.
All those Zen people want to buy for AD? That is profit for Cryptic, because the only way Zen gets into the system is someone purchased those zen with real money at some point (barring some small amount that comes in via Zen surveys, and Cryptic probably gets paid via Peanut Labs for those).
What? If you want dragonborn, xp boosts and campaign unlocks you want them now not having to wait. If you want a dragonborn warlock you will want that ready for you to create your warlock, if you want an xp boost, you want that as soon as you've created it, if you want the campaign unlocks you will want that as soon as you reach 60 (which wouldn't take long). You assuming they have enough time for the dailies is irrelevant. You don't get to tell what they do or do not want, though I personally wouldn't bother with the dread one since you pretty much only need to do the dungeon which is 1 instance. Sharandar would be tempting for me if it wasn't ridiculously overpriced. Either way if it'd available from the zen store, then someone should be able to get what they want as long as they have the funds.
Nope. There are some of us who were here from the start. Zen was not always at 500. There were times when it was low in 300. Stuff were unbound. etc, etc, etc...
If you want them "now" then how about buying zen with ad beforehand?-_-.
@bernatk
Im aware of that...i actually do remember unbound sets,as for the AD/zen the lowest i've seen it at was 340 or so(with exchange being semi-instant or instant).
And as for "close to impossible",i did go too far with it,maybe more approriate term'd be "extremely time consuming".Not that the point changes,unless you're exploiting/flipping on AH,Neverwinter is Grind to Win or P2W,with the first part not always being true(due to long exchange times caused by several players possesing absolutely insane amounts of AD)
1) The campaign completion items were new and weren't something to be anticipated.
2) By constantly saving up for so long you're wasting any possible investment opportunities for a long while. I'm sure you'd think differently if it actually afected you. Otherwise it's very easy to think "not my problem".
...
Saving up for so long?If someone wants to buy it all then he saves up for it...or he doesnt buy it.
Like,really there is no logic in it.
Your logic:
-He wants it instantly not waiting 2 weeks for zen exchange
-He wont buy it beforehand because...he cant afford to?
Then why buy it?
As for the "campaign boosters are new" thing,this doesnt belong in this thread as the proposed limit will only affect the future and not the past.
That said,i'll discuss with you no more as it leads nowhere.
On topic:I support lowering the limit as it will decrease inflation and provide better experience for free players.(at the same time,yes i know cryptic wants to frustrate them to buy zen,but they're more likely to quit than buy it due to this imo.)
I'm saying that by increasing the time to get what you want will make for a less efficient income if you relied on selling enchants or wards.
There's going to be new unexpected things added. How are you supposed to know beforehand if you want zen and how much for future items? There's still going the be the wait to get it, you're just wanting to multiply the wait depending on zen wanted. If there's a lower transfer limit then people may be more likely to hoard their zen because they know it's harder to get.
Too many restrictions is bad, it's poisoning the game. If it can negatively impact on a legitmate player, then maybe you have to think that maybe it's best to let it go.
Okay,i said i wont discuss it anymore,but i guess i can answer that..
"How are you supposed to know beforehand(...)"
AD->ZEN price will probably stay at 500 : 1 for now.While AD -> ZEN exchange takes a lot of time,exchanging it the other way around is instant for now.This means that you should transfer all your AD you dont really need to ZEN as it doesnt cost you anything(you can revert instantly)= you'll have ZEN when new content arrives so that point is pretty non-existant.
"You're just wanting to multiply the wait depending on zen wanted"
Actually,there'd be a problem of causing people to wait longer for very large quantites of ZEN for the first two-three weeks after the change,but the point is,the AD backlog would drop to about 20% or less of what its now,causing the wait time to actually be way lower than now for people that want lower quantites of ZEN(from 15 days to 3 days) and roughly the same/slightly lower for people who want large quanities.That is,this change'd benefit everyone.
And what if the backlog was ever to return? They're now restricted a lot more for how much zen they can ask for despite having enough. Just because it can work now, doesn't mean it's good for the long term.
Using AD to buy the packs would have a reverse effect. It increases demand for zen and hence the backlog even if it's being reduced overall.
It does work in the long term.
The current backlog is 6 000 000 000 AD(240 offers at AD limit).Assuming absurdly rich players(well,at least those that put max amount in exchange all the time) cause half the backlog(pretty sure its more,probably close to 70-80%),that'd be 3 000 000 000 AD.Now,with 5x lower limit,they can only put 600 000 000,which reduces overall backlog from 6 000 000 000 AD to 3 600 000 000 AD,which is a 40% decrease at minimum just by lowering the limit 5 times.
If they make multiple accounts to post the AD,they can be banned which causes an even larger drop of backlog.
A win-win.
One of example of unfair access is DDoS attack when single entity (it can do it with thousand proxies but benefit itself only) generates most of request to internet site while legit users need wait or unable to use it. NW ZAX seems to implement orders in serial way, which is "unfair" in terms of software. The suggestion is not about to make fairness where it possible, but to improve gaming experience for new players. Reducing single order size only forces to login a gateway few more times to check the state of ZAX. PWE could implement fair queue internally by splitting any order into batch of 1K, so any time when order completed for 1K, it goes to the end of queue. But that would be a major rehaul of ZAX
— (The unwritten rule)
They do any of these suggestions, people would just make multiple accounts sell junk to their main account thru the ah and make multiple ZAX purchases thru multiple accounts. The zen could then be used to buy something and trade it directly to the main account. These ideas in this thread would change nothing but the size of the accounts database as players create more accounts to bypass the restrictions put in place. It's just a bad idea that would benefit no one as nothing would really change, and it would hurt PWE as they'd have to store more data on the servers which, more data = more money spent.
By scaling size to 5, you need 5 accounts to get to previous level. There will be always people trying to trick the system and you can't do anything about it. This is why i don't claim that x5 is going to reduce queue to 20%.
Moving AD between accounts takes AH cut which is good for economy.
PWE has enough space for keeping gold seller accounts. It doesn't impact their performance.
Cost of storing data per client is irrelevant nowadays compared to cost of acquiring and keeping him loyal.
The change is to address small part of population. It is about less than few %.
Most of population won't even notice the limitation and they don't need to run alt accounts to get all ZEN they need for themselves.
Cost of change is low and it can be rolled back easily.
— (The unwritten rule)
This is one of the reasons why I think Cryptic are going to make all ZEN store items BoA eventually.
At that locked exchange rate, for example, the least expensive Greater Soulforge on the AH is $110. Think about it.
Unlocking the Zen:AD market and letting the two currencies adjust naturally would encourage more people to enter it from the Zen side (benefiting Cryptic), eating heavily into the backlog (benefiting AD holders wanting Zen), and dramatically cutting into the 3rd party AD seller business (benefiting everyone).
The cost of those are greatly dependent on coal ward pricing. The most efficient way to get them being via the zen store. That means with a higher zen exchange rate the ad cost to sell them will go up along with it.