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About Pay To Win Arguments
leisses
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
Well, I still have no position about this game being P2W or not, but I think people are saying this a lot.
So I think it would be better to have a topic to talk specifically about P2W. What is P2W? Why P2W? Limits of P2W?
In my opinion all Free 2 Play games NEED a little of "P2W", it's healthy to the game have it. In a certain level it is good because it makes more people invest on the game making: more profit to the game and heating the economy.
That said, I think "P2W" mechanics needs to be directly involved with mechanics that allow non-cash players to make profit trading with cash players.
And a player that place over 5 thousand dollars in a month at F2P must have some advantage for doing that, but the advantage can't be large, making it possible to non-cashers that REALLY play better than the casher to overwhelm them.
So I think it would be better to have a topic to talk specifically about P2W. What is P2W? Why P2W? Limits of P2W?
In my opinion all Free 2 Play games NEED a little of "P2W", it's healthy to the game have it. In a certain level it is good because it makes more people invest on the game making: more profit to the game and heating the economy.
That said, I think "P2W" mechanics needs to be directly involved with mechanics that allow non-cash players to make profit trading with cash players.
And a player that place over 5 thousand dollars in a month at F2P must have some advantage for doing that, but the advantage can't be large, making it possible to non-cashers that REALLY play better than the casher to overwhelm them.
Post edited by leisses on
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My argument against part of the system. The zen store isn't really the issue, and it can be easily fixed, before the next tier is released.
And like I said it's healthy for a F2P game to give some improvements to cash players, but those improvements need to have some relationship with non-cash systems so the economy can improve through all the community.
The cash shop specifically lets you pay to get there before others. So I can see there's some basis in the "pay to win" argument.
Well the more i though it through and the definition of P2W, i realized this game actually isn't.
P2W is where you can buy, for real money, gear that gives you an obvious stat advantage over F2Pers, however this is not the case with Neverwinter, everything is available to F2Pers.
People can criticize, yammer on, cry, whine or shout about P2W all they want but Neverwinter isn't.
Still makes no sense to me.
I was in on early release as a 'cash' player. My main character is only level 43. I see dozens of free players already at level 60. Does that mean I 'lost' the game despite paying cash?
dont be so ignorant.... its not rocket science. P2W means the same as Pay for an advantage. its nowhere near the worst ive ever seen in this game. but being able to progress faster than a F2P is considered P2W even though in this game its not a huge dif. some dif but not huge. but paying for that advantage can have huge drawback as you will discourage new players that want to try the game out before the decide to pay see that they are so far behind sooooo many other players that they feel it will take forever to catch up even by paying that they just give up and move on to another game. and the rotation continues. the advantages must be limited or you will lose alot of player base and this turns into another WoW community with alot of spoiled kids playing with daddys money.
btw from another players perspective seeing the "Founder" title the statement i get from that is that you payed for your stuff...you DIDNT earn it. tells me you lack pro experience and need outside help getting ahead.
Except that some people get the sense of pride in say that they supported the game more than others as well. Just because you don't value the money that you spend on or in a game doesn't mean that others don't. Paying money doesn't make you a better or worse player, it just makes you more invested in the game. It's just as much a fallacy to believe that someone who grindings for 20 hours a day is better than someone who plays casually. The reality is that everyone sets their own goals and benchmarks to measure success. Some people just feel the need to judge other people's gameplay in order to find value in their own.
Personally I play because I like the people I'm playing with and I like the gameplay. I love the concepts of the game and therefore I gave Cryptic money to keep developing the game. Each person has to decide that for themselves, but it is not a representative of any quality other than how much the person has invested their RL resources into the game.
I payed to support the development and get beta access so I could decide whether there was enough to keep me here.
"lack pro experience"? Wait, wut? My main is at level 43. I haven't done foundry grinds, skirmishes, dungeons or ANY PvP. Simply been following the quest line, Didn't realize I could actually make a living as a 'pro player'. Does it pay more than $200 an hour plus full benefits?
Was simply asking for clarification, no need to be insulting. F.Y.I, I played my first computer game in 1976. Played my first real time multi player game against people across the world in 1983 (ten years *before* the world wide web).
I still don't comprehend what 'win' means in a persistent world. If it's 'First to level', then the few folks that levelled on the 25th are the only winners. The folks that leveled on the 30th are the F2p Winners. Which makes everyone else what?