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Forums > Home› Neverwinter Discussion › General Discussion (PC)

It's unpleasant...

diogene21diogene21 Member Posts: 8 Arc User
in General Discussion (PC)
I'm back to play Neverwinter after some time. Unfortunately, on my return I noticed the usual big flaw of this game: virtually absent pvp (at least at low levels). This is really unpleasant. I would like to know this total absence of pvp what it is due to; I do queues of 2-3 hours, but never starts a session. I do not believe in the absence of players. Are there any other problems behind this fact? And why do not developers take care of it? It's a pity that a nice game like Neverwinter does not have a fully accessible pvp compartment...
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Comments

  • rickcase276rickcase276 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,404 Arc User
    I suspect it is for many reasons. Lack of new classes, so less people leveling new characters, lack of good rewards from PvP, and still only the two maps that have been there forever. But that is only a guess.
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Member Posts: 1,641 Arc User
    PUG-stompers would roll new toons & mail themselves BIS enchants & PvP gear so they could roll over new players that didn't know how to PvP yet. So, the new players stopped queueing. PvP doesn't really start until level 70 now. Even then, the population is low.
  • kangkeokkangkeok Member Posts: 1,123 Arc User
    I would suggest that instead of having a que type system for pvp, they should make a room type one. So people can see how many player are in the room and are able to join or leave the room at will. Also make a few room that are ongoing for 24/7. IMO, that's more transparent to the player and its faster to join the game.
  • flippy#8481 flippy
    flippy#8481
         Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    wintersmoke said:

    PUG-stompers would roll new toons & mail themselves BIS enchants & PvP gear so they could roll over new players that didn't know how to PvP yet. So, the new players stopped queueing. PvP doesn't really start until level 70 now. Even then, the population is low.

    for the reasons you just stated - the level 70 pop remains low

  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Member Posts: 1,492 Arc User
    NW mostly is a PvE game. PvP is not getting that much focus and effort from the developers. The total amount of developer resources is limited and it seems they (rightly) prioritize PvE. They cannot spend enough resources on PvP to make a meaningful experience.

    If you primarily want to PvP, my advice would be looking elsewhere.
  • diogene21diogene21 Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    mentinmindmaker said:

    NW mostly is a PvE game. PvP is not getting that much focus and effort from the developers. The total amount of developer resources is limited and it seems they (rightly) prioritize PvE. They cannot spend enough resources on PvP to make a meaningful experience.

    If you primarily want to PvP, my advice would be looking elsewhere.

    I know this very well, man: nobody keeps me from staying here. :)

    Mine is a statement, not a criticism. Why is the pvp sector not taken into account, given that this would only make the gaming experience more varied and intriguing? I think this because, if so, Neverwinter could gain even more popularity, in the panorama of mmorpg. As for pve content and setting the game I believe it has already few rivals ...
  • djflippersdjflippers Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    Here's a crazy idea: balance PvP around ilevel.
  • forcemajeureforcemajeure Member Posts: 69 Arc User
    I honestly can't recall any PVE-oriented games that had a decent, consistent PVP side. The issues of balancing PvE and PvP across the same skill and gear sets, and the way the crowd who likes PvP will generally abuse any imbalance they can get their hands on to get kills and wins - even if it destroys the long-term PvP environment - means that anything but dedicating the game to either PvE or PvP will fail.

    You end up with either a PvE game with some afterthought PvP tacked on, or a PvP game with minimal PvE content.
  • diogene21diogene21 Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    forcemajeure said:

    I honestly can't recall any PVE-oriented games that had a decent, consistent PVP side. The issues of balancing PvE and PvP across the same skill and gear sets, and the way the crowd who likes PvP will generally abuse any imbalance they can get their hands on to get kills and wins - even if it destroys the long-term PvP environment - means that anything but dedicating the game to either PvE or PvP will fail.

    You end up with either a PvE game with some afterthought PvP tacked on, or a PvP game with minimal PvE content.

    I apologize, but I just can not agree with you. I tried dozens of mmorpg: each of these had both a PVE look and a PVP appearance. I have no idea that you have not tried many other games, if you think this: WoW and GW2, for example, have both PVE and PVP balanced content. But I also believe that you did not understand the subject of my observation. I am not complaining that Neverwinter has few PVP aspects; I simply say that until now, I could not even play a PVP map, because the queues last for hours and never lead to anything. I do not think any other player does not queue up to play a PVP map. So, what is the problem? I prefer PVE, to be honest, but from time to time I like to break the monotony with a little PVP. I remember that a few years ago, when I tried the game the first time (it was 2014, I think) some PVP bout I could play it. And it was also fun! Then, over the years (I do not know why) this has not become almost as possible. I just say it would be nice if the developers were able to find a way to revive this aspect of the game (I try to tell one: if the problem is related to the level of equipment, this can be leveled, I think).

    If then, as the previous user did, we want to force some arguments, in order to justify an aspect not considered in this game ... Ok, you're right!
  • kangkeokkangkeok Member Posts: 1,123 Arc User
    diogene21 said:

    forcemajeure said:

    I honestly can't recall any PVE-oriented games that had a decent, consistent PVP side. The issues of balancing PvE and PvP across the same skill and gear sets, and the way the crowd who likes PvP will generally abuse any imbalance they can get their hands on to get kills and wins - even if it destroys the long-term PvP environment - means that anything but dedicating the game to either PvE or PvP will fail.

    You end up with either a PvE game with some afterthought PvP tacked on, or a PvP game with minimal PvE content.

    I apologize, but I just can not agree with you. I tried dozens of mmorpg: each of these had both a PVE look and a PVP appearance. I have no idea that you have not tried many other games, if you think this: WoW and GW2, for example, have both PVE and PVP balanced content. But I also believe that you did not understand the subject of my observation. I am not complaining that Neverwinter has few PVP aspects; I simply say that until now, I could not even play a PVP map, because the queues last for hours and never lead to anything. I do not think any other player does not queue up to play a PVP map. So, what is the problem? I prefer PVE, to be honest, but from time to time I like to break the monotony with a little PVP. I remember that a few years ago, when I tried the game the first time (it was 2014, I think) some PVP bout I could play it. And it was also fun! Then, over the years (I do not know why) this has not become almost as possible. I just say it would be nice if the developers were able to find a way to revive this aspect of the game (I try to tell one: if the problem is related to the level of equipment, this can be leveled, I think).

    If then, as the previous user did, we want to force some arguments, in order to justify an aspect not considered in this game ... Ok, you're right!
    Now u make me think of 10v10 gauntlgrym 2014. Good times.
  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Member Posts: 1,492 Arc User
    diogene21 said:

    mentinmindmaker said:

    NW mostly is a PvE game. PvP is not getting that much focus and effort from the developers. The total amount of developer resources is limited and it seems they (rightly) prioritize PvE. They cannot spend enough resources on PvP to make a meaningful experience.

    If you primarily want to PvP, my advice would be looking elsewhere.

    I know this very well, man: nobody keeps me from staying here. :)

    Mine is a statement, not a criticism. Why is the pvp sector not taken into account, given that this would only make the gaming experience more varied and intriguing? I think this because, if so, Neverwinter could gain even more popularity, in the panorama of mmorpg. As for pve content and setting the game I believe it has already few rivals ...
    The problem probably is limited resources.

    They have enough people to either make a good PvE experience, or a good PvP experience, but not both.

    It also could be a problem of market adaptation, it is possible the customers see a game as either PvP or PvE, so trying to be good in both might be futile from an income point of view.

    What I have seen in other games is that in order to balance things properly, PvE and PvP abilities are completely separated. That way they can be tuned independently. Basically you have a PvE and a PvP version of all abilities.
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Member Posts: 1,641 Arc User
    diogene21 said:

    forcemajeure said:

    I honestly can't recall any PVE-oriented games that had a decent, consistent PVP side. The issues of balancing PvE and PvP across the same skill and gear sets, and the way the crowd who likes PvP will generally abuse any imbalance they can get their hands on to get kills and wins - even if it destroys the long-term PvP environment - means that anything but dedicating the game to either PvE or PvP will fail.

    You end up with either a PvE game with some afterthought PvP tacked on, or a PvP game with minimal PvE content.

    I apologize, but I just can not agree with you. I tried dozens of mmorpg: each of these had both a PVE look and a PVP appearance. I have no idea that you have not tried many other games, if you think this: WoW and GW2, for example, have both PVE and PVP balanced content. But I also believe that you did not understand the subject of my observation. I am not complaining that Neverwinter has few PVP aspects; I simply say that until now, I could not even play a PVP map, because the queues last for hours and never lead to anything. I do not think any other player does not queue up to play a PVP map. So, what is the problem? I prefer PVE, to be honest, but from time to time I like to break the monotony with a little PVP. I remember that a few years ago, when I tried the game the first time (it was 2014, I think) some PVP bout I could play it. And it was also fun! Then, over the years (I do not know why) this has not become almost as possible. I just say it would be nice if the developers were able to find a way to revive this aspect of the game (I try to tell one: if the problem is related to the level of equipment, this can be leveled, I think).

    If then, as the previous user did, we want to force some arguments, in order to justify an aspect not considered in this game ... Ok, you're right!
    If I'm not mistaken, WoW & GW2 are both subscription games.
  • johonxgaltjohonxgalt Member Posts: 93 Arc User
    GW2 is buy to play with a cash shop for fluff. but no monthly sub.
    wintersmoke said:



    If I'm not mistaken, WoW & GW2 are both subscription games.

  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • cabar1cabar1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 124 Arc User
    No PVP players? You must be mistaken, otherwise how do you explain all the nerfs?
    99 lines of code on the wall, 99 lines of code, add one line, compile it again....... 113 lines on code on the wall
    113 lines of code on the wall, 113 lines of code, rewrite one line, compile it again.......
    Wait For It
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User
    I had a fully functional PVE GF, almost BiS for PVE. I sunk 24 Mil AD into her to try and get her PVP ready. After that huge investment I still got stomped left right and center by those who have been playing regularly.

    In my case I had the AD saved and bought my way in, didn't skill my way in. But that said, how would any new player stand a chance in there when they hit lvl 70 to have a chance to learn?

    There are only a few who are publicly trying to keep pvp alive, Robb spends a lot of time calling out PVP training. Minimi use to but I believe he's spending more time in PVE lately.
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    #1 reason is they need to release a new class to get lower levels active again. They made many changes to low lvl pvp and it was unplayable for awhile. They fixed it so it is playable now but it needs a revive still.

    Whoever said its the players fault obviously doesn't remember the changes they made to low lvl pvp that made it unplayable. They killed low lvl pvp not the players. Its fixed now but just saying.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,429 Arc User
    anesading said:

    #1 reason is they need to release a new class to get lower levels active again. They made many changes to low lvl pvp and it was unplayable for awhile. They fixed it so it is playable now but it needs a revive still.

    For the new player, new class and old class are all new class.
    For the season player, new class means a new character with super suit up gear.

    I am not saying they should not create a new class. I just want to point out a new class does not do anything to lower level for both PVE and PVP.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    > @plasticbat said:
    > I am not saying they should not create a new class. I just want to point out a new class does not do anything to lower level for both PVE and PVP."

    It brings in new players and also its existing players that want to try the class. Existing players have already tried the classes they are interested in by now.

    This also looks badly to any new customers for them because to a new player the inactivity in the que system could suggest that the game itself is inactive.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,429 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    anesading said:

    > @plasticbat said:

    > I am not saying they should not create a new class. I just want to point out a new class does not do anything to lower level for both PVE and PVP."



    It brings in new players and also its existing players that want to try the class. Existing players have already tried the classes they are interested in by now.



    This also looks badly to any new customers for them because to a new player the inactivity in the que system could suggest that the game itself is inactive.

    Why would season player run a new character in the queue system as an habit (instead of once a while) when they have other characters that could do that? There is an account limit for how many RQ you can run with good AD.

    Season player will either plays a new class slowly to enjoy or quickly to level up.
    If one wants to do that slowly, he does not want to run q to level it up fast.
    If one wants to do that quickly, he does not even need to play the character.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    > @plasticbat said:
    > > @plasticbat said:
    > Season player will either plays a new class slowly to enjoy or quickly to level up.
    > If one wants to do that slowly, he does not want to run q to level it up fast.
    > If one wants to do that quickly, he does not even need to play the character."

    The Op is talking about pvp and people do want to test future pvp builds as they level or just to be able to pvp on a class without needing a huge amount of AD to farm and compete (boons/campaigns/equipment)

    Some new players would want to try out the pvp system before they reach max levels aswell.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,429 Arc User
    anesading said:


    The Op is talking about pvp and people do want to test builds as they level or just to be able to pvp on a class without needing a huge amount of AD to farm and compete (boons/campaigns/equipment)



    Some new players would want to try out the pvp before they reach max levels aswell.

    That goes back to what I said in the beginning:

    For the season player, new class means a new character with super suit up gear.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    > @plasticbat said:
    That goes back to what I said in the beginning:
    >
    > For the season player, new class means a new character with super suit up gear.

    For those of us that did do low lvl pvp when Op was released will remember how many ops were in pvp and how active it was. Same thing with hr.
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7,155 Arc User
    Lack of interest in being roflstomped by twinks.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    > @greywynd said:
    > Lack of interest in being roflstomped by twinks.

    That's not what killed it though. They made base hp like 50k for a lv10. People could not test builds with this so they didnt have incentive to play and it died. Then they recently changed it back to what it is now. No more high amounts of health.
  • rifter1969rifter1969 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 516 Arc User
    I have to agree with the folks that mention that people that do it for their own ego stocking benefit.

    I still remember being in the Dwarven Valley farming BI to upgrade DF armors. And I happened to get caught when the PvP event kicked off...

    I started heading out... and a TR hunted me... alllllll the way back to the entry campfire....
    For what? To get an easy kill to boost his own numbers?
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7,155 Arc User
    anesading said:


    That's not what killed it though. They made base hp like 50k for a lv10. People could not test builds with this so they didnt have incentive to play and it died. Then they recently changed it back to what it is now. No more high amounts of health.

    No, but it is something that keeps new leveling players from going back into it when it keeps happening. There's nothing like seeing a low level with all r14 enchants.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,429 Arc User
    anesading said:

    > @plasticbat said:

    That goes back to what I said in the beginning:

    >

    > For the season player, new class means a new character with super suit up gear.



    For those of us that did do low lvl pvp when Op was released will remember how many ops were in pvp and how active it was. Same thing with hr.

    Back then, you did not have a level 4 character which had 2 rings with 3 companions with bonding, 3 rings with full enchantment + 5 mounts with full insignia.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • anesadinganesading Member Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    @greywynd This isnt a subscription based game like guild wars. You can argue the same for 70 pvp. So if you dont want to support the game and get items youd rather it be inactive :p
    Post edited by anesading on
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