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TR, impossible to catch changes (bad)

demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
Please change impossible to catch back to previous mod 10.5 changes.

1) if I start flurry sequence and press impossible to catch before the third strike, my at will count resets to the first attack.

2) if I cast gloaming strike and tap impossible to catch before gloaming finishes, impossible to catch does not cast.

3) if I cast impossible to catch while holding sly flourish, the attack count before debugging strike is reset to 1.

This is terrible.....

Impossible to catch is not as responsive as it used to be, and it interrupts our combat flow. Most of the time it will not even actovate when cast, only pause our character and reset our actions.
@strumslinger
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Comments

  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    If I cast any encounter and try to use impossible to catch while the encounter is casting, impossible to catch won't cast.

    Before we could click impossible to catch during any moment without breaking our at will combo chain or without hindering other encounter powers
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    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • barrelofoilbarrelofoil Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited November 2016
    +
    It brake TRs dynamic. Also TR is a low defense class.....
    It's terrible, im only want understand the meaning of this act,
    "Dear gamers, we desided that TR feel themself too good, so we desided to broke one of the moust important skill"
    or something like that, or what?

    Demonmonger, when they wanted to change "key-chest" rules, the community made a lot of pages of their negative opinion, and developers see that probably they will lose money with their actions, so they canseled the changes.
    Am afraid they really don't care about TR problems while the question not about the money.


    Post edited by barrelofoil on
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  • barrelofoilbarrelofoil Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited November 2016
    xsayajinx1, you opinion is clear, expectable and trivial unfortunately.
    Could you please, keep your "just adapt" to yourself or your partner, i'm not askin' advise.

    In pve ITC important in some builds, do you want it or not.

    TR Tank- its funny, what class on pvp suffering so much that skill need to be broken?
    The things, you're talkin' about, are realy connected with ITC, or it's just rhetoric?
    Could you please develop your theme?

    Post edited by barrelofoil on
  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,594 Arc User
    edited November 2016

    "It brake TRs dynamic. Also TR is a low defense class....." - posted by @barrelofoil
    - Highest deflect severity and the most easy ways to stack deflect to unreachable numbers for any other class. --> One of the most tankiest classes in-game.

    False. HR can reach much higher deflect chance, Sabo & Exe do not get deflect from feats. And the main ability score for PvE is Strength, that does Not give deflect.


    - PvE is easy... activate your ITC, then start at-wills / encounters etc. Just adapt.

    Are you that good with TR in PvE that you can outdps GWF, Trapper, etc... please teach us all plebians, the way of the PvE TR. /s

    ITC was used a self buff by some, with press the advantage feat. The short duration makes it necessary to time it exactly to the right moment to be effective, in example the last DF bleed stack. Now it can't be done.

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  • barrelofoilbarrelofoil Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    micky1p00 said:

    ... The short duration makes it necessary to time it exactly to the right moment to be effective, in example the last DF bleed stack. Now it can't be done.

    That's it.
    morenthar said:


    The complete removal of ITC should be just part of the TR changes. We need damage increases and I believe they are coming. When we get those damage increases it should make up for your lack of ITC/Press.

    Ok, just tell us whole the plan of changes, when you remove smth. it meens that you should add smth.
    Changes can be global and interesting, maybe it will lead to the class reborn.
    But now it's only broken mobilyty.
    Whisperknife is the other story.


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  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,594 Arc User
    edited November 2016

    micky1p00 said:



    False. HR can reach much higher deflect chance, Sabo & Exe do not get deflect from feats. And the main ability score for PvE is Strength, that does Not give deflect.

    Are you that good with TR in PvE that you can outdps GWF, Trapper, etc... please teach us all plebians, the way of the PvE TR. /s

    ITC was used a self buff by some, with press the advantage feat. The short duration makes it necessary to time it exactly to the right moment to be effective, in example the last DF bleed stack. Now it can't be done.

    @micky1p00

    1. TR is still tankier than HR due to 75% base deflect severity (85% with pot). Additionally, HR can't reach much higher deflect % because if a TR runs with 85-90%+ the HR would have to run with 100% all the time, which is not possible.

    2. Who cares about Paingiver? As long as you finish the content it's all good & fine. If the GWF rush forward and kill the trash mobs before you can even touch them and outdps you in the end by 10-20 mil doesn't really mean anything.

    3. Another example: If the boss has only 300k HP left and my encounter/daily does 5 million, how much do I get added to my Paingiver chart? Exactly. 300k only. Paingiver means HAMSTER. Period.

    4. Edit: I would rather like to see ITC changed to: This powers duration is halfed when marked for PvP and leave it as it was before for you PvE guys but yeah, seems devs have another view on the things. And if they don't change it like mentioned above I rather see it nerfed to uselessness for the sake of PvP as PvE is not competitive anyways.
    1. If we measure in effective HP, a TR will need 10k in deflect stat to match HR 50% chance from feats (+same 10k stats). And HR can go higher than 50%.
    Here, the top reds:



    Pots are irrelevant, all classes can use those. The delta is the important part.

    2. Where did I mention paingiver? I did not. And please spare me the rush forward and as long as you complete part, I'm not first day here, unfortunately. Compare ACT after several FBI runs, and then multiply the difference in efficiency over the 1k runs that you need to get what you actually want from there (if you want something)

    3. Same as 2, I never said anything about paingiver.

    4. In the same spirit I can say that PvP is so broken it's not competitive in NW, so no need to break PvE a the main content for the sake of it. For PvP there are other games,like overwatch, TF2, dota2, lol, sc2, etc....
    But, to your point, if you think PvE is not competitive, please take a look at any of the class balance threads, everyone want to be top something.

    Here:


    Or at least not to be useless. And don't describe rainbows and unicorns, most don't want to be useless even if someone else carries to completion.

    Bottom line, I will applaud separation of PvP and PvE, but random skill changes that widely used by people is not the way to get balance there or there. Or more correctly, IMO, it was changed because of the new weapons, so ITC can proc the weapon buff. I assume that one of the devs saw it and changed it so. IMO it was a haphazard change that didn't take into account neither PvP or PvE and the verity of uses.

    I actually do not use ITC, but others have very high ping, or can't dodge in time or use it as part of a buff build, 'random' changes like this break a lot of things.

    Halving the time in PvP and keeping as CC breaker, may work, but I wont presume to know much about PvP in NW.
    Post edited by micky1p00 on
  • barrelofoilbarrelofoil Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited November 2016


    4. Edit: I would rather like to see ITC changed to: This powers duration is halfed when marked for PvP and leave it as it was before for you PvE guys but yeah, seems devs have another view on the things. And if they don't change it like mentioned above I rather see it nerfed to uselessness for the sake of PvP as PvE is not competitive anyways.

    With halftime duration and new cast, it becomes totally usless.
    This is the main thing of your opinion, why do you need spend so much words and try to face it like objective moment? Just say: "i dislike this skill so much and very glad that it's broken now"- It is simple and clear, i can understand this cind of opinion, we all humans (Are we?:)
    The main thing is: new cast brakes TRs dynamics and ability forecast enemy actions and this is one of the moust interesting things of TR gameplay, especeally on PVP.

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  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,594 Arc User

    @micky1p00 Didn't had to look on that fancy cartoon or you whole text but in the fly I read the last sentence. Nice, that we do agree.

    Well, if you ignore all the parts where I don't agree (and they are the majority), then I guess......
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  • lordseth1985lordseth1985 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 319 Arc User
    I play as TR since beta [first char I made: Seth DarkHands] and itc always worked like pre mod 10.5: instant use, cc break and immune... some ppl complain about it's "long duration": 5 seconds is that really long? that's just a little time to try to breath and use a potion. and since we don't have high defense [the higher defence I achieved was around 20%], any other class can kill us, even with 75% deflect. IMO itc was our secret move, and now... it's useless both pvp and pve.

    as I said, even with high deflect%, we still are easily killed on pvp. just need a stun or cc and bang! k.o., byebye tr, so long and tnx for all the fish.
    On pve? it was our "salvation move". I lost count of how many times I used itc to revive any downed friend, many times on CN. also, I use it as a buff with press the advantage, like many others.

    just to finish, the power should work like it used to be. otherwise, WHY ON NINE HELLS IT SOULD BE CALLED "IMPOSSIBLE TO CATCH"????
    Avestruz.Q.T.Seduz - Rogue, natural born assassin.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    edited November 2016
    I agree with you seth...

    Sucks that we fought to save other people from nerfs(edit nerfs) but they hate tr so much that they don't even lift their voices to assist us.

    Today in CN I went through the same problem you spoke of.. needed itc to revive my team. I didn't have it slotted, since the nerf, and everyone is suffering because of it.

    My new pvp stance is tab dazing strike smoke bomb shadow strike repeat.... permanent stun combo.

    Sucks.. but this is all I can do since I refuse to shocking execution everyone.

    No more epic toe to toe battles....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • marcelene55marcelene55 Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    Other dps classes shine in PVE by clearing trash and providing moderate dps on bosses. The inverse has been true for the TR. His party role was boss killer. The TR could stand behind a boss and pour on the dps and hit ITC while other classes had to scoot it out of the red circles. In dungeons with multiple bosses a TR could make a valuable contribution. Now, that role and value to a group has been diminished. Hope you TR's have nice guildies that don't mind taking you along out of pity.
  • asterotgasterotg Member Posts: 1,742 Arc User

    ...

    TR Tank- its funny, what class on pvp suffering so much that skill need to be broken?
    The things, you're talkin' about, are realy connected with ITC, or it's just rhetoric?
    Could you please develop your theme?

    When I started playing, we used a TR tank in PvE, bc no one was able to keep aggro against him and if played right, he was unkillable. Many nerfs later he is still viable in PvP, but difficult to play in PvE. I see some PvE TRs with incredible high DPS now and then, but most of them suck (including my TR) compared to other DDs with similar gear.

    Chars: CW, DC, GF, GWF, HR and TR.
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  • marcelene55marcelene55 Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    Survival is not a problem, nor really the issue. But a TR's forte is boss dps. You will be doing less of it if you are popping around like a flea.
  • guille23mxguille23mx Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 340 Arc User
    I really hope they revert back ITC the way it was before 10.5 Nerf.
    All the TR should unify and ask for this .
    Peace
  • pitshadepitshade Member Posts: 5,665 Arc User
    terramak has already said the change was 'unintended' in a preview thread and will be looked into.
    "We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    terramakterramak Posts: 545 Cryptic Developer
    November 8
    Thanks again for all the feedback, folks.

    I can't currently give an expected timeline for future fixes to things Infantile Compensation procs off of. I believe the current plan is to address other cases where the power rapidly procs.

    The unexpected / undocumented change to HR Plant Growth was added to our internal issue tracking the other day, and I'll ask folks to take a look at the ITC change too. Appreciated.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • barrelofoilbarrelofoil Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited November 2016
    morenthar said:

    FFS, the TRs complaining about this from a PvE angle.....



    So you friggin' have to dodge a bit. Seems like that involves some skill.....instead of pressing "my happy space" button.



    Its been overpowered in PvP and brainless in PvE. To hell with it.

    About "happy spase" button and flea.
    TR ia allready like a flea, with or without ITC.
    "Happy spase", you wrong with context. All characters have 3powers, 2at-wills, so when you compile the combo you haven't numerous of skills like in other games, also the Build system in NWO means that you choose tactic and make suitable build.
    In Short, it's not a "happy spase", it's "not to catch Tanks Bull Strike when my Duelist ends, or not to be stunned after Daily Pow. and etc"
    "My happy spase" it's something from psychology. Could you do not complicate the things.
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