Yes, it's a fail for me too. I was looking for the Mantle (just because I think it would be nice for a DC to show its god symbol) but, despite the huge number or boxes opened, I found only potions, ench, kits, bags and dyes.
So I think this stuff is not good enough to justify all those farming hours.
IMHO I prefer the farming lights/coins/symbol (etc.) version of an event. At the end of that, u can "buy" what u really want at a vendor and organize your time to reach that goal.
At least it should be active only when in solo. Hey, you're running a dungeon with a party, and suddenly everybody has to wait for you because you started crafting three items at a time?
At least it should be active only when in solo. Hey, you're running a dungeon with a party, and suddenly everybody has to wait for you because you started crafting three items at a time?
It is only active while solo. You can not get the challenges to drop if you are grouped.
In other news. 80 boxes opened, 1 coin, no cloak. The drop rate of the goodies is sucktastic. I feel bad for those who have opened hundreds with no luck.
0
pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2014
Glad this is over. Got so many "Epic rewards" I got tired of so much epicness. Here are a few examples of epic rewards:
This is not how you do events, dear devs. Please start offering serious rewards. I'm not talking about giving us high rank enchants or BiS gear, I can understand that.
But please offer desirable cosmetics, not just one item with 0.01% drop chance/event, but make them a few to choose from, let us sell the unwanted ones, and don't gate behind days of mindless grinding and/or RNG.
0
firkraaqMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 16Arc User
edited February 2014
this event wasn't an event at all ... devs u really gave up on this game, didn't you? Pvp matchmaking is a joke (since beta), pve stuck, new modules are just grind fests, I don't want to be offensive, playing since beta and still hope something will change, but it is hard to be positive any longer ... Please add some new real D&D content. TY
Nothing higher than rank 4's drop from enemies - hence, what's appropriate for a level 60 character are rank 4 enchantments. You *do* get the greater potions, though...
You do get some Rank 5s and 6s from Event end chest I remember getting a rank 5 savage from the event that dropped them, this is an event reward you should have at least a chance to get them. Oh and the quest in graveyard is actualy level 26 so yeah if it's apropriate for lvl 26 to get a rank 3 how is it that apropriate for a level 60? Like I said it must be reevaluated. Either give a level 26 quest a rank 2 which you can get from doing SCA tier 2 or raise the rewards that state apropriate for your level.
0
zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited February 2014
. . . Well, after 387 total Gift Boxes opened on my main character, I finally got a cloak! I opened up almost a hundred on another character and no cloak and then just over 50 on a third character and no cloak. I really do not like the RNG system in this game, it is very unforgiving. There should be checks and balances in it, so say the system detects that you opened an "X-Amount" of them without gaining a certain item, so then it grants you increasing chances to get better stuff as you open more until you do get a truly "Epic" reward.
A lot of people believed this, since 360 days is a silly amount of time to get that companion. It means never missing a single day, no bad weather, no vacations, no work, no obligations.
If you miss a day, then it takes 361 days. Miss 2 days, it takes 362 days. Ardent coins aren't ephemeral.
If you miss a day, then it takes 361 days. Miss 2 days, it takes 362 days. Ardent coins aren't ephemeral.
Ardent(and celestials) work on a 20h reset before you can get another(and in the celestials, a 29h timer before it vanishes). Technically if you're obsessive enough you can get the angel in "only" 300 days.
RIP Neverwinter 26/06/2014
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited February 2014
Technically, yes. Realistically, far too much trouble for a person who basically keeps a 24h schedule. I guess if you didn't have a job or need to sleep regular hours....
. . . Well, after 387 total Gift Boxes opened on my main character, I finally got a cloak! I opened up almost a hundred on another character and no cloak and then just over 50 on a third character and no cloak. I really do not like the RNG system in this game, it is very unforgiving. There should be checks and balances in it, so say the system detects that you opened an "X-Amount" of them without gaining a certain item, so then it grants you increasing chances to get better stuff as you open more until you do get a truly "Epic" reward.
DDO did exactly that a couple of years ago. Every 20 epic chest openings/per character yields choice of epic item for that dungeon. RNG is fine if a limit is established.
0
dardoveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
DDO did exactly that a couple of years ago. Every 20 epic chest openings/per character yields choice of epic item for that dungeon. RNG is fine if a limit is established.
You could however still not get the item you wanted under DDO's system since it didn't give you the full list of drops.
0
syka08Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2014
On the whole, I think the event was rushed.
The idea behind it and the way it was executed was well done and seems to be a great strive to prevent bots from farming it. I'm still not clear why (and if this has been addressed, please do point me in that direction) the content will not drop in dungeons and GG, but whatever, it's that way for all events of this nature.
Other than that, the event was pretty lackluster, and I'm okay with this, as I'll stretch my imagination even further and say that this was more of an experiment to test out this new mechanic. The one thing that cheesed me off hard core, was the fairly (or seemingly) broken Champion of the Gods Achievement. THAT, could have been executed a lot better.
To keep my post on topic with the thread, however, I thought the drops fair. R4s everywhere, which made for good feed to my enchants. Can't beat that. I never once saw the cloak and from what I've been reading through this apparently a lot of people out there didn't either (if respondents up to page 7 of this thread reflect a good sample pool of the population). I wasn't really doing it for the invocation gift, but I did manage to snag two of them, so yay for that.
That's about all I got. Here's to hoping the next "special drop event" is improved.
A question about the Mantle...was it only a rare blue??? Anyone else getting upset that when they announce these things they put them in the Epic purple text or Rare blue text only to find out in game its not that???
I'm glad I didn't spend a lot of time trying to grind for it. Never got the mantle now I'm glad because would have been upset.
EDIT: Someone earlier had posted that it was a blue Rare...thats why I asked but I see it was truly purple Epic in game...thanks for the clarification...whether it was truly "Epic" beyond its rarity is a different thing
A question about the Mantle...was it only a rare blue??? Anyone else getting upset that when they announce these things they put them in the Epic purple text or Rare blue text only to find out in game its not that???
I'm glad I didn't spend a lot of time trying to grind for it. Never got the mantle now I'm glad because would have been upset.
It is a Purple Epic transmute item -
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
A question about the Mantle...was it only a rare blue??? Anyone else getting upset that when they announce these things they put them in the Epic purple text or Rare blue text only to find out in game its not that???
I'm glad I didn't spend a lot of time trying to grind for it. Never got the mantle now I'm glad because would have been upset.
Well, it's "purple" in the respect that other free appearance change neck items have been purple. It doesn't have any stats of its own.
And for the information of everyone, there was a Speaker For Ao on the event dais in PE that allowed you to view the tooltips for all the special rewards the gifts could drop. It's not like the mantle was a big secret mystery.
People were getting upset because the gift boxes trumpeted epic quality rewards for all openings, as far as I can tell, even though the vast majority contained common potions and enchantments.
This event felt so insignificant to the point that there's barely any feedback when it ended, because it actually feels like the event didn't happen at all.
0
ladymythosMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 637Bounty Hunter
People were getting upset because the gift boxes trumpeted epic quality rewards for all openings, as far as I can tell, even though the vast majority contained common potions and enchantments.
There are a few reasons why I was upset with the event in total, including the boxes. To name a few:
1. The quests or "challenges" are far too easy.
2. They are time-limited. I'd much rather have harder challenges with no time limit.
3. The reward are <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Tier 4 enchants at lvl 60? Really? I get tons of them from normal play anyway, making them pointless.
4. Most of the time, I had to look up the quest log just to see if I had a challenge, and what I had to do.
And the worst part?
5. This is exactly what I have come to expect from this game. Great game, crappy events. Summer event, winter event, CTAs, Challenge of the gods... it's nothing new. But the sad part is we've had plenty of these "events", so you would think they would have been improved by now. But nope, it's just the same, old BS we've had since the start - and most likely, we'll keep getting this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for a long, long time.
0
dardoveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
But nope, it's just the same, old BS we've had since the start - and most likely, we'll keep getting this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for a long, long time.
Same, old BS? They have done several different types of events over the past year. Challenge of the Gods gave a new take on events with the challenges. It is not like they are doing the same thing over and over again. They are trying different things with the different events.
Have all the events been good, no, but I think overall the events team has done a good job and have given us some great events.
There are a few reasons why I was upset with the event in total, including the boxes. To name a few:
1. The quests or "challenges" are far too easy.
2. They are time-limited. I'd much rather have harder challenges with no time limit.
3. The reward are <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Tier 4 enchants at lvl 60? Really? I get tons of them from normal play anyway, making them pointless.
4. Most of the time, I had to look up the quest log just to see if I had a challenge, and what I had to do.
And the worst part?
5. This is exactly what I have come to expect from this game. Great game, crappy events. Summer event, winter event, CTAs, Challenge of the gods... it's nothing new. But the sad part is we've had plenty of these "events", so you would think they would have been improved by now. But nope, it's just the same, old BS we've had since the start - and most likely, we'll keep getting this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for a long, long time.
Agreed with your point 5 lady, even though it sounds a little too harsh (CTA's kind of fun imo).
The main and common problem about most of the events (never been in all) thus far is how repetitive the process of the events can get.
But the fact that they're doing these events shows that they're trying, no matter how bad it is.
Maybe in future events they could do something like what some other games do, where the people in-charge logs in the game and do something creative and fun (short term events).
This event felt so insignificant to the point that there's barely any feedback when it ended, because it actually feels like the event didn't happen at all.
and I didn't get my cloak... true is basically worthless but I like how my gwf look in a cloak and wanted it so I could always have one, anyone know cloak Transmutation items?
I wasn't very impressed with the event, I've got to say. A bunch of crappy potions, a bunch of R4 enchants, got about 14 of the divine injury kit, 16 of the dye, 4 invocation gifts and finally four and a half hours before the end after hours and hours of mind-numbing farming over the course of the event, the Celestial Mantle for my Cleric. Hundreds of boxes, hundreds of challenges...
Honestly the most worthwhile stuff was the tons of R4 enchants/major healing potions/lesser marks of potency/greater identify scrolls/fomorian concoctions from the endless farming of Sharandar I was doing. Just went in circles around the Plateau, killing Redcaps, doing every challenge that dropped even if I hated it.
Most annoying for my DC were:
Amaunator - Kill five enemies without using at-will powers. DCs are not powerhouses of damaging encounter powers, heh. Also, I kept autofailing it picking it up mid-combat.
Silvanus - Kill 10 enemies without using Encounter powers. While we're not powerhouses, we are however good at taking down groups of trash. No chains to throw on groups of Powrie/Witherers, no Sunburst to follow up, no Astral Shield to keep my health up against the few things that actually bother doing damage. Would always get this while in Dread Ring with nothing but big, tough enemies around.
Moradin - Complete three crafting tasks in 20 minutes. Super annoying because if you planned to do it you had to leave at least one profession slot open. Usually needed to AD rush. Occasionally bugged so that a naturally finishing task wouldn't credit, though AD rushed always did. My DC now has all professions at L1 because I discovered that the 'Hire your first x' tasks counted and used those until I ran out.)
Chauntea - Use 10 healing potions. This required either going out of your way to buy minor healing pots so you could chain-drink out of combat, or literally sitting there getting pounded to be able to mash the button for a pot as soon as the timer expired. Not as annoying as it could have been since Sharandar loves to drop major healing pots, but still irksome. On the other hand, the box that finally gave me the Mantle dropped from the Chauntea challenge, so I guess I can't hate it too much? ...Yes I can.
Least annoying were:
Tymora - Kill 10 enemies without using healing potions. I'm a DC. Nearly everything I do heals. Not an issue.
Tempus - Kill 10 enemies without using Daily powers. Non-issue, both dailies I slot are non-damaging, and Sharandar doesn't do enough damage to my DC to need it. Neither does Dread Ring when I was there the run dailies.
Oghma - Use 3 dailies in 5 minutes. I AP gain pretty quickly, so this was a non-issue even occasionally <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> up with not killing a Powrie fast enough. Use Divine Armor right off, kill stuff, use it again once I hit, kill more stuff, use it again, boom.
Sune - Use Encounter powers 10 times in combat. Not an issue, constantly rotating them in combat. Main quirks were that using Chains to start a combat often didn't work, and Astral Shield apparently didn't count at all. Still not an issue.
Only mildly annoying/neither easy or hard:
Corellon - Survive 30 seconds in combat while below 50% health. I don't slot regen or lifesteal, so those weren't an issue unless I had an invocation boon granting me regen. Mostly this consisted of finding something tough enough to actually beat me down below 50, then running in circles occasionally popping Sunburst if I got too low. This one was kind of annoying, and also rather a lore fail - The Protector and Preserver of Life wants me to... Be a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>? Bwuh? My DC is Corellite, so this was somewhat irksome.
Kelemvor - Kill five enemies while below 50% health. Again, find something to beat me up. Go run around throwing Chains on trash. Meh.
Torm - Kill five enemies within one minute of each other. Eh. Pick it up right before something is about to die, kill it, go nuke a group of trash, done.
Selune - Kill five tough enemies. Not a big deal.
Anyone I'm forgetting, their challenge must not have made an impression at all. :P
All in all, pretty meh. I didn't completely hate it, but it was not exciting or fun. I'm glad I at least got the cloak finally, and I seem not to suffer the clipping issues many reported with it on my char. Well, my staff clips through it, but my staff does that with every cloak in the game.
This event felt so insignificant to the point that there's barely any feedback when it ended, because it actually feels like the event didn't happen at all.
Indeed, it was quite a non-event. For me it basically sums up as "Was doing my dailies, got a few weird quests, got a few extra rewards". Couldn't even be bothered to farm it.
The whole idea? Excellent concept. Very poor execution.
opened 155 gifts didn't farm event last 15h,
got 2 mantles on the last day,
3 invocation gifts, only one worked.
22 dyes & 11 injury kits.
Sold all pots for gold ...........
used the rank4 enchants 2upgrade my artifacts.
event left me wanting more, & no "tablets of Fate" 2be seen anywhere.....
Your gift of the gods contained a reward of Epic quality is what a second hand car
salesman told me when i bought a car from him.
did enjoy event for the first day....
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Sune - Use Encounter powers 10 times in combat. Not an issue, constantly rotating them in combat. Main quirks were that using Chains to start a combat often didn't work, and Astral Shield apparently didn't count at all. Still not an issue.
I came to realize that the encounter powers had to be used while you were already in combat, therefore using them as an opening move wouldn't count.
Comments
So I think this stuff is not good enough to justify all those farming hours.
IMHO I prefer the farming lights/coins/symbol (etc.) version of an event. At the end of that, u can "buy" what u really want at a vendor and organize your time to reach that goal.
Such Reward, much wow. This event is genius as their new ideas for PvP.
It is only active while solo. You can not get the challenges to drop if you are grouped.
In other news. 80 boxes opened, 1 coin, no cloak. The drop rate of the goodies is sucktastic. I feel bad for those who have opened hundreds with no luck.
This is not how you do events, dear devs. Please start offering serious rewards. I'm not talking about giving us high rank enchants or BiS gear, I can understand that.
But please offer desirable cosmetics, not just one item with 0.01% drop chance/event, but make them a few to choose from, let us sell the unwanted ones, and don't gate behind days of mindless grinding and/or RNG.
You do get some Rank 5s and 6s from Event end chest I remember getting a rank 5 savage from the event that dropped them, this is an event reward you should have at least a chance to get them. Oh and the quest in graveyard is actualy level 26 so yeah if it's apropriate for lvl 26 to get a rank 3 how is it that apropriate for a level 60? Like I said it must be reevaluated. Either give a level 26 quest a rank 2 which you can get from doing SCA tier 2 or raise the rewards that state apropriate for your level.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
If you miss a day, then it takes 361 days. Miss 2 days, it takes 362 days. Ardent coins aren't ephemeral.
Neverwinter Census 2017
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They work grouped, but not in dungeons (actual dungeons, not lairs).
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Ardent(and celestials) work on a 20h reset before you can get another(and in the celestials, a 29h timer before it vanishes). Technically if you're obsessive enough you can get the angel in "only" 300 days.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
DDO did exactly that a couple of years ago. Every 20 epic chest openings/per character yields choice of epic item for that dungeon. RNG is fine if a limit is established.
You could however still not get the item you wanted under DDO's system since it didn't give you the full list of drops.
The idea behind it and the way it was executed was well done and seems to be a great strive to prevent bots from farming it. I'm still not clear why (and if this has been addressed, please do point me in that direction) the content will not drop in dungeons and GG, but whatever, it's that way for all events of this nature.
Other than that, the event was pretty lackluster, and I'm okay with this, as I'll stretch my imagination even further and say that this was more of an experiment to test out this new mechanic. The one thing that cheesed me off hard core, was the fairly (or seemingly) broken Champion of the Gods Achievement. THAT, could have been executed a lot better.
To keep my post on topic with the thread, however, I thought the drops fair. R4s everywhere, which made for good feed to my enchants. Can't beat that. I never once saw the cloak and from what I've been reading through this apparently a lot of people out there didn't either (if respondents up to page 7 of this thread reflect a good sample pool of the population). I wasn't really doing it for the invocation gift, but I did manage to snag two of them, so yay for that.
That's about all I got. Here's to hoping the next "special drop event" is improved.
I'm glad I didn't spend a lot of time trying to grind for it. Never got the mantle now I'm glad because would have been upset.
EDIT: Someone earlier had posted that it was a blue Rare...thats why I asked but I see it was truly purple Epic in game...thanks for the clarification...whether it was truly "Epic" beyond its rarity is a different thing
It is a Purple Epic transmute item -
Well, it's "purple" in the respect that other free appearance change neck items have been purple. It doesn't have any stats of its own.
And for the information of everyone, there was a Speaker For Ao on the event dais in PE that allowed you to view the tooltips for all the special rewards the gifts could drop. It's not like the mantle was a big secret mystery.
People were getting upset because the gift boxes trumpeted epic quality rewards for all openings, as far as I can tell, even though the vast majority contained common potions and enchantments.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
1. The quests or "challenges" are far too easy.
2. They are time-limited. I'd much rather have harder challenges with no time limit.
3. The reward are <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Tier 4 enchants at lvl 60? Really? I get tons of them from normal play anyway, making them pointless.
4. Most of the time, I had to look up the quest log just to see if I had a challenge, and what I had to do.
And the worst part?
5. This is exactly what I have come to expect from this game. Great game, crappy events. Summer event, winter event, CTAs, Challenge of the gods... it's nothing new. But the sad part is we've had plenty of these "events", so you would think they would have been improved by now. But nope, it's just the same, old BS we've had since the start - and most likely, we'll keep getting this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for a long, long time.
Same, old BS? They have done several different types of events over the past year. Challenge of the Gods gave a new take on events with the challenges. It is not like they are doing the same thing over and over again. They are trying different things with the different events.
Have all the events been good, no, but I think overall the events team has done a good job and have given us some great events.
Agreed with your point 5 lady, even though it sounds a little too harsh (CTA's kind of fun imo).
The main and common problem about most of the events (never been in all) thus far is how repetitive the process of the events can get.
But the fact that they're doing these events shows that they're trying, no matter how bad it is.
Maybe in future events they could do something like what some other games do, where the people in-charge logs in the game and do something creative and fun (short term events).
and I didn't get my cloak... true is basically worthless but I like how my gwf look in a cloak and wanted it so I could always have one, anyone know cloak Transmutation items?
Honestly the most worthwhile stuff was the tons of R4 enchants/major healing potions/lesser marks of potency/greater identify scrolls/fomorian concoctions from the endless farming of Sharandar I was doing. Just went in circles around the Plateau, killing Redcaps, doing every challenge that dropped even if I hated it.
Most annoying for my DC were:
Amaunator - Kill five enemies without using at-will powers. DCs are not powerhouses of damaging encounter powers, heh. Also, I kept autofailing it picking it up mid-combat.
Silvanus - Kill 10 enemies without using Encounter powers. While we're not powerhouses, we are however good at taking down groups of trash. No chains to throw on groups of Powrie/Witherers, no Sunburst to follow up, no Astral Shield to keep my health up against the few things that actually bother doing damage. Would always get this while in Dread Ring with nothing but big, tough enemies around.
Moradin - Complete three crafting tasks in 20 minutes. Super annoying because if you planned to do it you had to leave at least one profession slot open. Usually needed to AD rush. Occasionally bugged so that a naturally finishing task wouldn't credit, though AD rushed always did. My DC now has all professions at L1 because I discovered that the 'Hire your first x' tasks counted and used those until I ran out.)
Chauntea - Use 10 healing potions. This required either going out of your way to buy minor healing pots so you could chain-drink out of combat, or literally sitting there getting pounded to be able to mash the button for a pot as soon as the timer expired. Not as annoying as it could have been since Sharandar loves to drop major healing pots, but still irksome. On the other hand, the box that finally gave me the Mantle dropped from the Chauntea challenge, so I guess I can't hate it too much? ...Yes I can.
Least annoying were:
Tymora - Kill 10 enemies without using healing potions. I'm a DC. Nearly everything I do heals. Not an issue.
Tempus - Kill 10 enemies without using Daily powers. Non-issue, both dailies I slot are non-damaging, and Sharandar doesn't do enough damage to my DC to need it. Neither does Dread Ring when I was there the run dailies.
Oghma - Use 3 dailies in 5 minutes. I AP gain pretty quickly, so this was a non-issue even occasionally <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> up with not killing a Powrie fast enough. Use Divine Armor right off, kill stuff, use it again once I hit, kill more stuff, use it again, boom.
Sune - Use Encounter powers 10 times in combat. Not an issue, constantly rotating them in combat. Main quirks were that using Chains to start a combat often didn't work, and Astral Shield apparently didn't count at all. Still not an issue.
Only mildly annoying/neither easy or hard:
Corellon - Survive 30 seconds in combat while below 50% health. I don't slot regen or lifesteal, so those weren't an issue unless I had an invocation boon granting me regen. Mostly this consisted of finding something tough enough to actually beat me down below 50, then running in circles occasionally popping Sunburst if I got too low. This one was kind of annoying, and also rather a lore fail - The Protector and Preserver of Life wants me to... Be a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>? Bwuh? My DC is Corellite, so this was somewhat irksome.
Kelemvor - Kill five enemies while below 50% health. Again, find something to beat me up. Go run around throwing Chains on trash. Meh.
Torm - Kill five enemies within one minute of each other. Eh. Pick it up right before something is about to die, kill it, go nuke a group of trash, done.
Selune - Kill five tough enemies. Not a big deal.
Anyone I'm forgetting, their challenge must not have made an impression at all. :P
All in all, pretty meh. I didn't completely hate it, but it was not exciting or fun. I'm glad I at least got the cloak finally, and I seem not to suffer the clipping issues many reported with it on my char. Well, my staff clips through it, but my staff does that with every cloak in the game.
Indeed, it was quite a non-event. For me it basically sums up as "Was doing my dailies, got a few weird quests, got a few extra rewards". Couldn't even be bothered to farm it.
The whole idea? Excellent concept. Very poor execution.
got 2 mantles on the last day,
3 invocation gifts, only one worked.
22 dyes & 11 injury kits.
Sold all pots for gold ...........
used the rank4 enchants 2upgrade my artifacts.
event left me wanting more, & no "tablets of Fate" 2be seen anywhere.....
Your gift of the gods contained a reward of Epic quality is what a second hand car
salesman told me when i bought a car from him.
did enjoy event for the first day....
I came to realize that the encounter powers had to be used while you were already in combat, therefore using them as an opening move wouldn't count.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia