Why should I choose greed? Game won't be more fun if I choose greed.
It's my right and my decision what I choose. If I want that item, I choose need.
I will never apologize for choosing need.
My problem is players, such as you, who tell me what I ought to choose.
If I designed the game, there would be no loot rolls, but that's no an option.
Edit: When I join a party, if the leader makes loot rules, I leave.
Arguing with other players about loot is what ruins my fun.
Really? I don't remember telling you what you should choose. Only that you look like a hypocrite posting that people take the "fun" out of it when they concentrate on loot...yet you blatantly said you usually roll Need on items just because you want them instead of actually need them in your first post and then go on about your "right" not to choose Greed in this gem of a post above. Sounds like the loot aspect of this is more important than you made it out to be.
There is a difference between being loot-focused (which I really dislike as well) and putting yourself at a disadvantage over others you run with.
Personally I prefer to go into a dungeon to have fun, and see it as a happy byproduct of that fun that party members walk away with an even (over time) amount of loot.
The very best dungeons for me are not the ones where we loot the final boss in record time, but ones where we enter as a 5 individuals and exit as a team.
Oh, I agree with this. Rolling Need when everybody else is doing it regardless is a natural reaction to prevent being disadvantaged by a system that the others aren't bothering to honor or pay attention to. But people nonchalantly saying that it's not about the loot but the "fun" while constantly rolling Need unless someone "desperately" (in their opinion/decision) needs an upgrade pretty much says that their fun is more important than yours by action regardless of what their words are saying.
It's sometimes enlightening to watch people justify actions for certain behaviors within a community, gaming or otherwise. We can go on (and on) about the devs and the mods who are doing their fair share to shape the public opinion of this game but it's also the players that have a stake in this as well.
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bladerunner2000Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 21Arc User
edited September 2013
Unfortunately, with the last patch epic drops are the only way to make any real AD unless you are willing to pay to play. Previously you could sell your DD or seal items. Crafting is useless and no one has the time to make 24K rough AD/day. So whereas before I might have said only Need if you really need it for your toon, I now feel that it's a must to Need on everything if you want to make any real AD. However, I do agree that all drops should be Greed as everyone had a part in getting that drop.
I did a FH just a few hours ago during DD, I needed on icefall gauntlets as I am a GF. The party made a big fuss over it so I said ok np we'll roll on the next green, CW won the roll, I gave him the gauntlets. Then we get to the boss drops, we stated beforehand that we were going to greed. Shadow weaver boots dropped, of course the same CW that was complaining before AND took my gauntlets needed and took shadow weaver boots.
Long story short, don't trust pugs and just need if it's your item...
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
0
ladymythosMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 637Bounty Hunter
there are five people in this dungeon that are all part of the success of running it. why should you get the item just because it's something in your class? the 'need' button puts your vote above everyone else that's submitted 'greed'. especially if the item is clearly not an upgrade, but a downgrade for you.
i think there should be a forced 'greed' option... just like right now you can start a 5-person group and make it to where the lead decides who gets boss-dropped loot. wouldn't that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> off all the ninja looters?
Are you serious? ARe you asking why I should get the item, if I'm the only one who can actually use it? It's really simple: I'm the only one who can use it. The weird part is we've had this system in all the other MMORPGs I've ever played, and it's never, ever been a problem in any of them. This is the only game ever I've played where the Need/Greed is too hard for most players to understand. You need if you need it, greed if you don't. What part of that don't you understand?
I just assume need. I wait till the first person rolls, then follow suit. Though I typically pass on a lot of stuff, cause well, Im not very greedy/needy.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
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ladymythosMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 637Bounty Hunter
edited September 2013
Please don't just assume things in PUGs. All it takes is one little question at the beginning, then all need/greed problems will be solved through the entire dungeon.
I need on blue items, purple items, enchants and resources. I pass on all green gear because its not worth my time. I expect everyone else to need on things they can use as well, so it doesn't bother me when they do.
If the group is down for greed on all, thats fine.
Foundry - Fight Club? (nw-dluqbofu7)
- JailBreak (in development)
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
0
bioshrikeMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,729Arc User
edited September 2013
The devs need to step up, when it comes to stuff like this. There should be a loot mode, which must be voted on and cannot be changed once agreed upon, that allows "greed only" for purple items, for instance. Along with that, there should be a "vote kick" option, where 3 or more people must agree before someone can be kicked. You should also *not* be able to kick someone between the time a boss fight has started until *after* that boss's item has been rolled on. Lastly, a way of replacing a player that has DC'd/quit, after the 1st boss has been fought, needs to be added. Those replacements can be chosen from the existing queue, to prevent people from abusing it to get their friends in to the dungeon.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
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bladerunner2000Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 21Arc User
The devs need to step up, when it comes to stuff like this. There should be a loot mode, which must be voted on and cannot be changed once agreed upon, that allows "greed only" for purple items, for instance. Along with that, there should be a "vote kick" option, where 3 or more people must agree before someone can be kicked. You should also *not* be able to kick someone between the time a boss fight has started until *after* that boss's item has been rolled on. Lastly, a way of replacing a player that has DC'd/quit, after the 1st boss has been fought, needs to be added. Those replacements can be chosen from the existing queue, to prevent people from abusing it to get their friends in to the dungeon.
Agree with most of this but actually it should not be possible to "kick" someone after 15 minutes or so. Reason being I've seen instances where weak team members are kicked just before a final boss to replace them with better players which is really unfair to those players which helped get them there. If a group wants to kick someone they should be forced to decide early on, not after most of the work has been done.
Also, there should be a re-queue penalty (at least 30 minutes) if someone quits within 30 minutes of joining a PUG. I'm really tired of people immediately inspecting groupies, deciding they are not good enough, and quitting before one pull. If people queue for a PUG they should be forced to at least try or have to wait some period of time before queuing again.
If an item would be an upgrade for me, I hit need.
If it is a sidegrade and there is another CW in the group then I look at his gear and decide if he needs it or not, if he does then I pass.
If I just want to sell it then I hit greed.
If it is an enchant I need it.
If it is a runestone then I will probably need on it, but no one really cares anyway, lol.
As a CW I will only do all greed runs. Seems every dungeon now has at least 2 CW in the group, and if everyone needs im at a 50 percent disadvantage to getting drops. Why should I run the same dungeon to have half the chance at loot vs other classes? Simple answer is I should not and I do not. Another thing that I've yet to read (may have missed it) is the fact that different classes loot value is not the same. So when i run CN on my GF i should be garranteed a ****ty drop because my loot is worth 1/4 of the other classes? Don't get me wrong, I don't run CN on my GF but the concept is still the same. CN almost always have 3 CW now so running that without an all greed is just plain stupid for any CW. All greed or GTFO!!
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bioshrikeMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,729Arc User
Agree with most of this but actually it should not be possible to "kick" someone after 15 minutes or so. Reason being I've seen instances where weak team members are kicked just before a final boss to replace them with better players which is really unfair to those players which helped get them there. If a group wants to kick someone they should be forced to decide early on, not after most of the work has been done.
Also, there should be a re-queue penalty (at least 30 minutes) if someone quits within 30 minutes of joining a PUG. I'm really tired of people immediately inspecting groupies, deciding they are not good enough, and quitting before one pull. If people queue for a PUG they should be forced to at least try or have to wait some period of time before queuing again.
I agree with your points. My only issue is that any sort of "leaver penalty" would have to be able to tell the difference between a DC or other unintentional crash, and someone actually clicking 'leave'. Additionally, should a player be penalized if the rest of the team is *that bed*? I mean, I know it sounds petty, but it does happen that the other team, as a whole, consists of really poor players...
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Agree with most of this but actually it should not be possible to "kick" someone after 15 minutes or so. Reason being I've seen instances where weak team members are kicked just before a final boss to replace them with better players which is really unfair to those players which helped get them there. If a group wants to kick someone they should be forced to decide early on, not after most of the work has been done.
0/10 troll post, poor effort on your part. the #1 complaint about dungeons is the inability to replace members either by inviting or by randomly assigned via queue once the first boss has been killed. do your research and try trolling again.
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maisaanMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 166
edited September 2013
We've done a lot of runs in the guild and not matter how you set the loot before you enter, even if everyone get's lead in turn and set it to round robin, it will always be need or greed.
This apply when we have queue for a dungeon.
If you run into one, non epic, then the leader can choose how to set the loot system.
Off cause you go into the dungeon to have fun (?) but you also go for the loot
i think the need/greed system needs to be re-evaluated. we need an option that is greed only. you can either greed it or pass it. that gives everyone the chance to get the loot. that way they can keep the system the way it is concerning class specific items. the way it is now, it gives an unfair advantage over others simply because unethical individuals can opt to wait until everyone has already chosen 'greed' before they make their decision of 'need'. or if it's a set piece for a GF and the already decked out GF chooses need because he's the only one that has that option in front of him. not because he needs it to use it but needs it for the salvager or the auction house. i'd like to at least know that by investing 40-50 minutes with a casual group of gamers that we all get the same fair shake at the loot.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
The group leader has an option (O screen) to set the different loot roll policies (round robin, need/greed etc, all greed,...) but it is always unavailable/greyed out.
Not in dungeons, but I've been playing a lot of duo questing with a friend and we use the round-robin setting because then we aren't constantly interrupted with loot rolling. We trade around a few class items when we stop to sell stuff.
Need if it's something I need, if I already have better I'm not going to need regardless of what others do. For enchants I just pass as soon as others start needing, as again I'm not rolling need on something I don't need.
Need if it's something I need, if I already have better I'm not going to need regardless of what others do. For enchants I just pass as soon as others start needing, as again I'm not rolling need on something I don't need.
You don't need enchantments? As in you already have R10's or? Lol I wish I were so pro that I didn't even see the need to slot enchants...
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited September 2013
They're just going to be R4s at best from dungeon drops though, right? You can run around solo in Feywild for a while and pretty much fill a bag with 3s and 4s, like candy.
They're just going to be R4s at best from dungeon drops though, right? You can run around solo in Feywild for a while and pretty much fill a bag with 3s and 4s, like candy.
But if you run around filling your bags with them then you admit that you need them. This guy is so pro that he walks around with his gear unslotted b/c he doesn't need enchantments.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
I don't know what the 'norm' is, but here's what I do (seeing as I run PUGs and play a GF):
1. If I know it's an upgrade on my equipment I 'need' it.
2. If I don't know for sure that it's an upgrade, but still usable by my class, I 'greed'.
3. If I can't use it, I pass.
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tang56Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited September 2013
From running pugs, the usual rules seem to be:
Need: Blue accessories, runes, shards, enchants, profession resources, epics.
Greed: Blue gear
Pass/greed: Green gear
RIP Neverwinter 26/06/2014
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
But if you run around filling your bags with them then you admit that you need them. This guy is so pro that he walks around with his gear unslotted b/c he doesn't need enchantments.
I was more thinking his perspective involved not getting worked up over rolling for enchantments in dungeons since it's easy-peasy to get a ton of them alone.
From running pugs, the usual rules seem to be:
Need: Blue accessories, runes, shards, enchants, profession resources, epics.
Greed: Blue gear
Pass/greed: Green gear
Yes, this does seem to be the norm, and is usually what I end up doing, with occasional exceptions depending what the trends are with the group I 'm in.
I think that the usual MMO rule is Need for things you can equip (specially here that you can't see the stats untill you use an identifying scroll on it) greed for things you want to sell, like things you can't equip, and pass if you're not interested at all, that's why the options are "need" "greed" and "pass".
if you want the thing and can roll need, roll need
if you want the thing and can't roll need, roll greed
if you don't want the thing, pass
if they came out with a loot option that was all greed only, i'd be fine with that. but at that point why even bother with loot rolls? have loot randomly assigned and placed into your bags as you go through the dungeon. but since that option is not yet available, trying to force greed only onto a group of randoms (that can still roll need even when they agreed not to) is just asking for disappointment. and as mentioned earlier, this ends up slowing your group down as people stop to police the rolls of other group members. the dungeon experience becomes more about enforcing artificial loot rules than having fun smashing monsters :P
Comments
Really? I don't remember telling you what you should choose. Only that you look like a hypocrite posting that people take the "fun" out of it when they concentrate on loot...yet you blatantly said you usually roll Need on items just because you want them instead of actually need them in your first post and then go on about your "right" not to choose Greed in this gem of a post above. Sounds like the loot aspect of this is more important than you made it out to be.
Oh, I agree with this. Rolling Need when everybody else is doing it regardless is a natural reaction to prevent being disadvantaged by a system that the others aren't bothering to honor or pay attention to. But people nonchalantly saying that it's not about the loot but the "fun" while constantly rolling Need unless someone "desperately" (in their opinion/decision) needs an upgrade pretty much says that their fun is more important than yours by action regardless of what their words are saying.
It's sometimes enlightening to watch people justify actions for certain behaviors within a community, gaming or otherwise. We can go on (and on) about the devs and the mods who are doing their fair share to shape the public opinion of this game but it's also the players that have a stake in this as well.
Ah well. F2P is what it is and there are other games to play while they sort this out.
Long story short, don't trust pugs and just need if it's your item...
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Are you serious? ARe you asking why I should get the item, if I'm the only one who can actually use it? It's really simple: I'm the only one who can use it. The weird part is we've had this system in all the other MMORPGs I've ever played, and it's never, ever been a problem in any of them. This is the only game ever I've played where the Need/Greed is too hard for most players to understand. You need if you need it, greed if you don't. What part of that don't you understand?
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
If the group is down for greed on all, thats fine.
- JailBreak (in development)
And did you read anything past the first sentence?
Maybe assume wasn't the best word. Let me rephrase.
Past experience has taught me, someone will need.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Agree with most of this but actually it should not be possible to "kick" someone after 15 minutes or so. Reason being I've seen instances where weak team members are kicked just before a final boss to replace them with better players which is really unfair to those players which helped get them there. If a group wants to kick someone they should be forced to decide early on, not after most of the work has been done.
Also, there should be a re-queue penalty (at least 30 minutes) if someone quits within 30 minutes of joining a PUG. I'm really tired of people immediately inspecting groupies, deciding they are not good enough, and quitting before one pull. If people queue for a PUG they should be forced to at least try or have to wait some period of time before queuing again.
If it is a sidegrade and there is another CW in the group then I look at his gear and decide if he needs it or not, if he does then I pass.
If I just want to sell it then I hit greed.
If it is an enchant I need it.
If it is a runestone then I will probably need on it, but no one really cares anyway, lol.
I agree with your points. My only issue is that any sort of "leaver penalty" would have to be able to tell the difference between a DC or other unintentional crash, and someone actually clicking 'leave'. Additionally, should a player be penalized if the rest of the team is *that bed*? I mean, I know it sounds petty, but it does happen that the other team, as a whole, consists of really poor players...
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
0/10 troll post, poor effort on your part. the #1 complaint about dungeons is the inability to replace members either by inviting or by randomly assigned via queue once the first boss has been killed. do your research and try trolling again.
This apply when we have queue for a dungeon.
If you run into one, non epic, then the leader can choose how to set the loot system.
Off cause you go into the dungeon to have fun (?) but you also go for the loot
Not in dungeons, but I've been playing a lot of duo questing with a friend and we use the round-robin setting because then we aren't constantly interrupted with loot rolling. We trade around a few class items when we stop to sell stuff.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
You don't need enchantments? As in you already have R10's or? Lol I wish I were so pro that I didn't even see the need to slot enchants...
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
But if you run around filling your bags with them then you admit that you need them. This guy is so pro that he walks around with his gear unslotted b/c he doesn't need enchantments.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
1. If I know it's an upgrade on my equipment I 'need' it.
2. If I don't know for sure that it's an upgrade, but still usable by my class, I 'greed'.
3. If I can't use it, I pass.
Need: Blue accessories, runes, shards, enchants, profession resources, epics.
Greed: Blue gear
Pass/greed: Green gear
I was more thinking his perspective involved not getting worked up over rolling for enchantments in dungeons since it's easy-peasy to get a ton of them alone.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
If I really need it, I need it.
If everyone else needs, I need to - so mosttimes I wait and check what the others choose - so it hits mostly enchs.
On Items ... need if I need, else I greed or pass.
On purple Items I check if I can use it on Equip. If I can, need, if not greed and salvage.
Yes, this does seem to be the norm, and is usually what I end up doing, with occasional exceptions depending what the trends are with the group I 'm in.
if you want the thing and can't roll need, roll greed
if you don't want the thing, pass
if they came out with a loot option that was all greed only, i'd be fine with that. but at that point why even bother with loot rolls? have loot randomly assigned and placed into your bags as you go through the dungeon. but since that option is not yet available, trying to force greed only onto a group of randoms (that can still roll need even when they agreed not to) is just asking for disappointment. and as mentioned earlier, this ends up slowing your group down as people stop to police the rolls of other group members. the dungeon experience becomes more about enforcing artificial loot rules than having fun smashing monsters :P