Tips for new foundry authors

crok2

Let's hear them

We probably don't all agree on the same points but I think there are some things we can agree on. (We'll see)
I'll start. Write your script first and be ready to change it! What I did when I started my first quest (which I deleted) was to make elaborate rooms. Once I had my story I realized it made no sense to my elaborate rooms and that the pacing was all wrong. IE: Really? I expect them to walk for over a minute with nothing happening?

Also, my first room was supposed to be someones house. I decorated it all up and I loved it! THEN I saw that there were hanging skeletons from the rafters! (lol) I was so caught up in placing items that I missed that one small (HUGE) detail.

Get your story/quest working before you work on details. Even though details are the fun part.

Keep a notepad and write down every little thing that needs fixed. Otherwise you will forget and look past it since you end up running your quests a zillion times focusing on one thing or another, but not always seeing the big picture.

Some people will HATE your quest. Don't be discouraged. You will get 10 good reviews and one bad review and the good and bad can be about the same thing. IE: 5 stars! Loved the challenging battles! And then a 1 star! It was too easy. Or 1 star! too hard. 5 stars: LOVED the long story. 1 star. The story was too long! All about the same quest :P

thunderspanker

My first suggestion is get in the Foundry, and just play with the tools for a while, and become familiar with the layout. Make a map, throw some stuff on it, and then play it to see what that looks like. Drop tons of stuff in there, and then play it again to walk around and look at everything. There are a lot of things to pick, choose, do, and alter. Getting a perspective on what the objects look like, how big they are, and how they fit together will get you a long ways into the foundry.

mandodo69

thunderspanker wrote: »

My first suggestion is get in the Foundry, and just play with the tools for a while, and become familiar with the layout. Make a map, throw some stuff on it, and then play it to see what that looks like. Drop tons of stuff in there, and then play it again to walk around and look at everything. There are a lot of things to pick, choose, do, and alter. Getting a perspective on what the objects look like, how big they are, and how they fit together will get you a long ways into the foundry.

I agree with the above post. I learned everything (almost everything) by just exploring the tools and content. Never hesitate to ask somebody. We did not get to be Silverstars and Moonstars for nothing.

izatar

Play the game to 60 before starting with the foundry. This is the fastest way to become familiar with the game's themes and conventions, not to mention the types of artwork and encounters available in context.

Most people do not or cannot read the text of your quest. You will get more and better reviews if you accommodate these people. Your quest should still make some sense and be still be completable by people who didn't read a single word. Also keep your quest text short! Even literate people don't want to be crit by a wall of text.

Pay attention to the golden path to make sure it takes a sensible route from objective to objective. Many people will be trained by the official campaign to follow the golden path religiously and will get lost, confused, and decide your quest sucks if the golden path goes into a brick wall or disappears for no reason.

Do not make mazes. People hate mazes. Feedback on maze quests in beta bear this out!

Do not make people walk though empty scenery. Don't make distances realistic, walking is boring.

Sound drives the emotional response to your quest, so music and sound effects are important!

If your quest has the phrase "Go to Next Map" anywhere in it, it is not finished.

Do not stack encounters. Difficulty varies with class, level, and cryptic balancing. One encounter at a time only!

thunderspanker

izatar wrote: »

If your quest has the phrase "Go to Next Map" anywhere in it, it is not finished.

LOL.. so true.. this is one of those things you want really pay attention to.. I personally like mazes, though.

gillrmn

Don't try to please everyone. Concentrate on what kind of players you want to develop you maps for and make the quests for them.

If you want to develop maps with jumping puzzles, do it. If you want to develop maps with mazes, do it. If you want to have tough combat, do it. If you want a strong story, do it.

But do not try to please everyone by having everything. Even if you have everything, some people will not be amused.

In this way, you must have your own vision. Once you have a vision, you need not listen to any advice including mine - just keep an eye on technical things which you think will go well with your vision.

Lastly, do not believe people when they say, it can't be done. Its just that they are just not able to see what can be done at that moment.

Also, the day you strongly disagree(after being in agreement) with our advice would be when your technical expertise is better or equal than ours.

thunderspanker

I would like to add to gillrmn's post.. If you disagree with something, we like to know, cuz thats gives everyone something to go debate, discuss, test, and beat on the Foundry with..

bachus1234

I think you cant sattisfy everyone at he same time, might be that hack and slash stuff gets rated way higher then story based campaigns, but that will not withold me from building camaigns that come lose to my pnp stuff..

.. But i can allready hear them out loud, to much reading, walls of text, cicky clicky click... For those people everything with more then 2 words in a single sentence feels like a wall of text and a burden to read..

Before starting the creation of my first campaign, i will have to play a lot of content from others to find out the possibillities and dos and donts from he forgery.

gbachura

I agree with pretty much everything above, esp. Gillrmn's post(s).

One thing I think I will add/stress that I didn't catch from the above is...

Test. Retest. Test again. Test again! Keep on testing it.

You will always catch things you missed. So keep playing through it. Over. And over. Beat that **** thing to death.

And I bet you'll still find things you can improve on, change, alter, or adjust.

Cheers!

krubar

My tip is Invisible walls!!!

Learn to use Invisible walls because they are you friend.

wininoid

After running into trouble in NWN, NWN2, and STO due to a mismatch between What I Can Envision and What I Can Create, I've been taking the approach of sketching out the quest with the story board. That ensures that I don't go overboard with branching dialog and side quests and so forth. I have to always remind myself that it needs to get finished and published at some point.

1. First I make a quick outline of the plot (no more than 1 line per high level plot point) in google docs or a notebook.
2. Then I create all the objectives in the story board.
3. Next I make simple maps (1-2 rooms) and place objects, npcs, and encounters, but only ones needed to satisfy the storyboard.
4. Then I write simple dialog for the conversations, 1-2 boxes max.
5. I keep going at the super stripped down level until my quest has all the components I want to include.
6. The goal of all this stripping down is to have a completed quest that I can play through without any errors. That means all the "coding" bits are done (e.g. visibilities on/off at the right time, story flow works and is logical, contacts work properly and update, etc.)
7. Play the bare-bones-but-complete quest many times and make sure you like the flow of the story.
8. Then I use pen and paper to sketch up the real maps and I create them.
9. Once the maps are in place, I populate them with objects, build any customized things, place encounters, etc. to make it look good and playable. Run through each map many times to make sure it works, looks good, etc.
10. Then I write the full dialog in google docs and cut/paste it into the dialog editor (I wish there were a better way).
11. Finally I add music and sound effects.
12. Play, play, play. Hunt for bugs, typos, etc. Try to play it "wrong". Go the wrong way. etc. Keep a notebook and write down every little thing. You won't remember that one typo on the first map when you get done. Also you can write down the ideas for your next quest to get them out of your head. DO NOT STRAY! DO NOT START WORKING ON OTHER QUESTS! THIS ONE IS ALMOST DONE! SPRINT TO THE FINISH LINE!
13. Publish and play through with a different class. Unpublish and fix.
14. Publish and create a "check out my quest" thread.
15. Buy more coffee and get brainstorming for the next one.

My key point is to get a full, playable quest done as quickly as possible. Think of it as a prototype. By playing through a bare-bones quest, you'll be able to spot problems early. Problems that you can't see until you actually play it. Then you can fix those before you spend days fine tuning a beautiful room or dialog that winds up in the trash.

gbachura

Wininoid that's a spectacular post. I think it should be featured for everyone to read somewhere, somehow. It includes most of the strong suggestions we 'Stars have been making and it organizes it into a great paint-by-numbers sort of 1, 2, 3... fashion.

Awesome!

musty

My tip... Save often!

agentjaspor

Building a map from scratch? Not looking forward to manually placing every single detail to make the room come alive? "Populate room" is your friend! Right-click a room on the map, choose "Populate Room," and a bunch of items will be placed in there automatically that fit the theme of the type of room. So a hour interior will have furniture and vases and bookshelves, while a dungeon room will have chains and skeletons and piles of rubble. It may not be exactly what you envision and will need some adjusting, but I've found it to be a great starting point when adding a brand new totally empty room to your map.

demiurgerealm

I haven't gotten my hands on the foundry toolset yet, but my methods from nwn will serve here too. I keep a spiral bound graph paper journal for scenario design and I WRITE EVERYTHING DOWN. Every idea, every character sketch, every quest step, every map doodle, every monster concept, everything goes in there. After the first rush of stream of consciousness idea flow stops it gets organized on separate pages by category.and the details filled in. Once the module is released I pull the pages out and staple them together and file them with other completed projects. The journal is ready for the next project.

tilt42

demiurgerealm wrote: »

I haven't gotten my hands on the foundry toolset yet, but my methods from nwn will serve here too. I keep a spiral bound graph paper journal for scenario design and I WRITE EVERYTHING DOWN. Every idea, every character sketch, every quest step, every map doodle, every monster concept, everything goes in there. After the first rush of stream of consciousness idea flow stops it gets organized on separate pages by category.and the details filled in. Once the module is released I pull the pages out and staple them together and file them with other completed projects. The journal is ready for the next project.

Hah, I have the completely opposite approach. If I have an idea that I later forget, I assume that the idea just wasn't good enough to begin with. I've had story ideas in my head for years before even putting a word down on paper, and the process of forgetting and refining them mentally makes them much better. It requires a bit of discipline though.

thunderspanker

tilt42 wrote: »

Hah, I have the completely opposite approach. If I have an idea that I later forget, I assume that the idea just wasn't good enough to begin with. I've had story ideas in my head for years before even putting a word down on paper, and the process of forgetting and refining them mentally makes them much better. It requires a bit of discipline though.

Yes. Sometimes you build something cuz you are just goofing around, and its just great.. You love every part of it.. Now it just needs a story, and that is where having a storehouse of ideas is really gonna pay off. However you keep these ideas is a personal thing for everyone.. I kinda go with Tilt's mentality on this one, but having a list of things is never a bad idea.

chili1179

Be patient.

Play test.

Ask questions.

Play test.

Don't be afraid to experiment.

Play test.

Check out other author's quests for ideas.

Play test.

Play test.

Play test.

All the other things mentioned, and play test.

gillrmn

thunderspanker wrote: »

..., but having a list of things is never a bad idea.

I do make a list but it never works. Things come to you while you are creating stuff because it kind of feels you are in that world.

Nevertheless I do make a list first, just to have a reason to start the quest.

celantra

Go through the detail objects to get an overview of what is available. Setup a test map to look at things if you want to get a real perspective. Then go through the cryptic maps and see the way they have built their environments. Everything making up Protectors Enclave is available in our detail objects just to give you some idea. Learn to build from base objects. It will make your maps unique and even if players don't realize it, having settings that they have not seen hundreds of times before will intrigue and excite them. Over time you will become so familiar with the detail objects available that you will be able to truly build your vision and not have to rely upon what has already been prebuilt by cryptic.

chili1179

Almost forgot!

Keep an eye on your budget list (currently bottom left). This can be a nightmare if you plan big lengthy quests.

thaliff

Some good tips here. Complete Foundry newb, so I'll be here often.

For me, I'm scripting the story out from my initial breadcrumb all the way to the main and secondary storyline conclusions. The one benefit I see here with the foundry and the players, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the players can't go off on a tangent. With my pnp group, they didn't pick up and move on the breadcrumbs as I intended, and subsequently I had to DM on the fly. This ended well as I was able to create a completely new story on the fly, and months later, reinsert them into the story I started initially.

Also as a humble suggestion, get voice recorder/voice recorder app and use it. I've already voiced half a dozen ideas while driving that I might have forgotten by the time I got to my desitnation.

crok2

Players can actually go off course but not in a good way or a way you ever imagined. It is so interesting to play with a friend and see what they do. It's like, "Wait. Why would you think you should jump off the cliff there?" Note to self: Put invisible walls around the cliff so people can't jump off. (even though the sparkly trail or blue area markers were no where near the cliff.) Or, I made a 12 foot pool type thing and the first thing a friend did was jump in. Luckily I had anticipated that and put stairs back out.

crok2

Oh, another tip. Z=Y. I guess it is standard for 3D editing programs to have the Z be called by Y so some people might not have an issue with this. (Camera view) But the first time I tried to place a painting on the wall by using numbers (before 3D mode) I was slightly confused. I assumed that to move the painting up 10 feet I would change the Z to 10, but it is actually Y that changes to 10.

bobcat1313

I thought you was going to give me tips!!! like money! bwahahahaha! I can't really explain how I do this... It involves underwear/beers/boxing gloves/and treasure maps!!!!!

My tip is to have fun! Make what you want, but do listen to some reviews. I overhauled my first quest a few times, and drasticly changed my story. I think its a decent quest now. How I created it. I actually had the story written and what needed done. I tested out stuff in foundry to make sure I could do some of these things. Then I created it. After that Polish Polish, Spell Check!

thaliff

Also abuse Evernote. I use it daily in my business. Quick idea on any device, and it syncs to all devices. It's what I use for taking voice memos as well.

thunderspanker

I use gumnotes, but totally agree 100 percent.. You could be walking in the soup isle at the supermarket, and think, yes, I need a vegetarian in my quest, so I can kill it... lol

Nothing against vegetarians.. it was just an example..

thunderspanker

If anyone has beamed here, and didnt read the entire thread, I recommend you start over.

musty

Evernote... I live off it

moondawg13

Spell check, then check the spelling again then check the grammar, then recheck them both.

When writing your dialogue use a word processor that has a spell checker, and preferably a grammar checker. I find that MS Office One-Note works well for me. It allows you to have each paragraph in its own text box so it makes it easy to copy and paste your text into the Advance Dialog Editor.
Remember:Their means "belonging to them", There means "not here", and They're means "they are".

When placing items, especially outdoor buildings, walk around them in 3D view and make sure they are not floating. I use a stone wall as a "foundation", in cases where the terrain is not level, to fill in the gaps.

And always remember you can ask any of us Silverstars or Moonstars for help anytime.

krubar

Also, I don't think you need emergency exits in your quests anymore. In the upper right of your in game screen, below the mini-map, there is a little door icon that you can use for exiting or to abandon a quest. The door icon is there when you are in any foundry quest. People playing your quest might not know about the little exit icon though so I still use emergency exits.

If you use exits that let people leave early then I recommend that you surround your exits with invisible walls. You can then make it where you can talk to the invisible wall that will let the player know that they are about to exit the quest. After a certain dialog is selected, the invisible wall can disappear and allow the player to select the exit.

If you do not use invisible walls with dialog around objects, when someone clicks the exit by mistake or to see what it is, they will be ported out of the quest and they may not want to do that.