Indomitable Battle Strike VS Battle Fury

cesoso55

Hi, Looking for some thoughts or advice from experienced players about which encounter is better all around, asumming you use HD and DS as the other encounters. Battle fury is considering you are using relentless battle fury feat to have reduced cooldown so you are probably giving up student of the sword for this feat. I know Lia knowles Build focus on Staying power + Ibs, but doing some testing with the dummy I'm not very sold on giving up Battle fury and if going this route can even pick up deep gash for example instead staying power for a bit extra dmg since almost not using dmg encounters. The reason is that Ibs get more dmg bonus while unstopabble but that delay in the animation does not seem to gain much advantage since sure strike hits very fast while unstoppable and Battle fury can buff that without losing animation attack speed while unstoppable. Also battle fury buff your weapon master strike for aoe dmg + more sprint and a little buff to the party.

I don't use act and just can play around with my own buffs with the dummy so I don't know if Ibs get much better with party buffs, but if sure strike does get that buffs as well, I dunno if there much diference between those, thx.

cesoso55

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santralafax

It's my understanding that Deep Gash is lackluster in damage, and does not stack. I use IBS, but have heard a lot of PVP players swear by Battle Fury.

IBS and SureStrike both climb in damage when buffed--starting with self buffs from HD, DS, WMS--don't forget WMS. Then ITF from GF and more from buffs from Cleric. When you hear about some crazy GWF doing 6 million in damage on a single strike, they were using IBS.

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santralafax

xsayajinx1 said:

I am running with HD, BF and IBS as Swordmaster. Since I run 100% of the time with GFs there is no need to mark enemies with DS.



My highest IBS was 30mil in edemo with a t.feytouch doubt I could do the same dmg via sure strikes in the same time spawn.

There you go. I certainly vouch for Xsay's battleworthiness.

cesoso55

Thanks for the feedback. Good point about using both IBS and BF when playing with a GF. (anyway trash die fast with good parties so no much point marking them in those cases) Does Gf mark work the same as daring shout, giving 20% dmg and combat advantage for you? I have heard that mark from other gwf's only give 8% dmg for others instead of 20% if you are using your own DS, so I don't know about marks bonuses from other classes.

Also it seems to me that other classes can mark enemies as well, (or am i wrong? don't know if is OP or HR?), does that mark work the same as the GF one? Thanks

ghoulz66

Daring shout for the most part is useless in party play or with a companion as you'll be getting CA anyway and that's the whole perk of using DS. IBS/BF/HD is pretty much the best combo for max damage output. The feat to reduce the CD and increase the duration of BF means you can have it up about 70% of the time.

Once you learn how to cast it and immediately start attacking without the BF animation stalling precious time you never want to go back.

rinat114

ghoulz66 said:

Daring shout for the most part is useless in party play or with a companion as you'll be getting CA anyway and that's the whole perk of using DS. IBS/BF/HD is pretty much the best combo for max damage output. The feat to reduce the CD and increase the duration of BF means you can have it up about 70% of the time.

Once you learn how to cast it and immediately start attacking without the BF animation stalling precious time you never want to go back.

Uhm... no. Marked targets are 15% more damage to you since feated (in most cases), 20% more damage for the caster of DS (being yourself) + 8% more damage to everyone else + whatever %CA damage you have (and your party members). Marks can stack. The only scenario in which a GWF should use BF instead of DS is when another GWF is using DS on the mobs/boss, GF marks will stack and increase total damage done by you and the party. It's sort of leeching but that's how it should be done for max effect.

DS is anything but useless.

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rinat114

xsayajinx1 said:

@rinat114 DS isn't useless but if I play PvE it's only demo/tiamat or CN. There is always a GF or even a 2nd gwf with me which makes DS useless to me, but in general it's an good encounter of course.



In demo you are constantly in fight mode so you can activate BF whenever you want which makes it in my opinion far superior than DS. You can buff up with HD + BF before the portal get opened and once the mobs spawn you can already dish out insane damage.



In the end it's situational or comes to personal preferences.

Of course BF is great, however all I said is that one shouldn't use it no matter what. It's extremely situational and if you're the only GWF in the party/raid it shouldn't be a thing. You're depriving everyone along with yourself the extra damage of a mark (or double mark if a GF is there). What I do is simple, if there's only one other GWF in the raid/party, I simply ask which one they're running and I run the opposite. Running BF on the expense of another GWF running DS is also kinda leeching and your damage will be infact higher, but it's the only right way to do this without losing effectiveness.

ghoulz66

rinat114 said:

ghoulz66 said:

Daring shout for the most part is useless in party play or with a companion as you'll be getting CA anyway and that's the whole perk of using DS. IBS/BF/HD is pretty much the best combo for max damage output. The feat to reduce the CD and increase the duration of BF means you can have it up about 70% of the time.

Once you learn how to cast it and immediately start attacking without the BF animation stalling precious time you never want to go back.

Uhm... no. Marked targets are 15% more damage to you since feated (in most cases), 20% more damage for the caster of DS (being yourself) + 8% more damage to everyone else + whatever %CA damage you have (and your party members). Marks can stack. The only scenario in which a GWF should use BF instead of DS is when another GWF is using DS on the mobs/boss, GF marks will stack and increase total damage done by you and the party. It's sort of leeching but that's how it should be done for max effect.

DS is anything but useless.

Not everyone goes for the sentinel feat. The BF damage boost is considerably higher than an unfeated DS.

DS has a long CD and from my experience using BF feated my unstoppable meter refills way faster with the high uptime boost from BF.

scathias

lv 4 DS mark lasts longer than the cooldown of DS for me and i only have like 2-3k recovery, so like 15 seconds of mark uptime (so 20% from DS mark, 15% feat, + CA) vs BF which last time i tried it gave +20% damage for 8? seconds and then had a 18 second cooldown or something ridiculously large like that. I never tried BF when it was feated but if it is 18 seconds to start the feat can't drop it to anything better than 12 seconds and then you still get less up on BF than you do on DS.

BF is 20%, DS is 20% from the mark. and if you are fighting marked targets then why wouldn't you take the sentinal feat? it is simply superior to every other feat that you could take IMO

I could be wrong though, I obviously don't use BF so I am open to some actual information

ghoulz66

scathias said:

lv 4 DS mark lasts longer than the cooldown of DS for me and i only have like 2-3k recovery, so like 15 seconds of mark uptime (so 20% from DS mark, 15% feat, + CA) vs BF which last time i tried it gave +20% damage for 8? seconds and then had a 18 second cooldown or something ridiculously large like that. I never tried BF when it was feated but if it is 18 seconds to start the feat can't drop it to anything better than 12 seconds and then you still get less up on BF than you do on DS.

BF is 20%, DS is 20% from the mark. and if you are fighting marked targets then why wouldn't you take the sentinal feat? it is simply superior to every other feat that you could take IMO

I could be wrong though, I obviously don't use BF so I am open to some actual information

BF is actually more than a 20% DPS boost. It must start at a decent amount, but the tooltip never states what it's original buff amount is.

The feat both increases duration and decreases cooldown to the point that it's only down for a couple seconds till you can recast it.

vida44

I'm using BF. I have 5 points Student of the Sword, 5 points Vicious Advantage and 5 points Battle Awareness for that 25% more Power while Slam is Active.

cesoso55

vida44 said:

I'm using BF. I have 5 points Student of the Sword, 5 points Vicious Advantage and 5 points Battle Awareness for that 25% more Power while Slam is Active.

I tried battle awareness + slam but it seems that doesn't count your buffed power by companion since it was raising my power by only around 7k when i was expecting around 13.2 k power increase) (that at 53k power self buffed), still not bad (7k more power would be around 17.5% dmg increase), but i prefer a sustained buff like powerful challenge feat or Student of sword over it).

(will have to see if buffed power from party buffs like dc ones counts towards battle awareness but companion buffs doesn't seems to count for it)