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astrals for zen
eldarfreak
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3 Arc User
just spent astrals to get enough zen for enchanted box keys, i dont have the zen is there an issue with this?
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RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ????
FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
When you put in an offer, you are getting in a very long line (at this point anyways), in which first come first served is in play. Once all the orders in front of you have been processed, you will get yours.
In general, this takes about 24 hours per 1 million, give or take a half day (nobody can say exactly because "as far as we know" this is all player driven and they don't pump new Zen into it to keep it moving...again, "as far as we know").
TL:DR - Just sit tight, you'll get it, but its not instant.
Since you said "keys", I assume you are talking about 10 keys purchase which is 1125 Zen. Even with a 15% off coupon, it is still 956 Zen. If that is the case, you may as well get one month VIP. That costs 1000 Zen. With 15% off coupon, 850 Z.
That gives you 30 enchanted box keys (one each day for 30 days).
Users generally note that the backlog of orders goes through at a rate of about 1 Million AD per 24 hours, but as this is a player driven market, that is not set in stone or always accurate. You can see the backlog amount by going to the tab to sell Zen and see how much is waiting to be sold there.
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That is, there are some people willing to pay more for zen than current, and they're unable to due to the cap.
HOWEVER, the thing the Free Market Purists don't seem to realize is that there are externalities involved in propping up the value of astral diamonds with this cap. Free-to-play players aren't able to afford the price of zen in terms of AD if the cap is lifted; it would basically go to the whales only. This could cause a migration of F2P players away from the game, as instead of having to wait a week for their zen, they need to put double or triple the amount of gametime RESOURCES into obtaining zen, and it just isn't worth the effort anymore. But as the play base declines, so too does the value of astral diamonds in terms of real-world dollars. So even if person A theoretically would be willing to spend a dollar to get 100,000 astral diamonds but not to get 50,000 astral diamonds, if the game's health suffers as a result of leaving players, it's possible person A wouldn't be willing to spend a dollar to get even 200,000 astral diamonds.
If you oversimplify your economic models, you will sometimes come to incorrect conclusions. This doesn't mean you can't use simple models, but don't simply assume those models to be absolute truth.
Although, actually, rereading your post, it looks like I jumped the gun. You claim "LEFTISTS NEVER LEARN" but then the rest of the discussion seems to be a criticize of free-market ideology, so now I'm just confused. Trololol indeed.
What's your position, exactly? Other than "Marxist BAD!" of course.
When I posit that you're "FREE TRADE WOO!" it's because I read you as saying "lift the AD price ceiling." Because that's the free trade position. Are you instead saying there shouldn't be a zen exchange at all?
Want Zen? Pay or Wait. That's all there's to it. Inflation is not a function of price caps.
If they really wanted to fight AD inflation they would just lower/remove certain methods for obtaining monstrous amounts of it. *coughs* armies of invoking and leadership alts *coughs*
The zen price cap actually encourages people to flush all their AD into zen. If anything, I'd say the price cap helps to limit inflation, not cause it, because it diverts excess savings out of the economy into another vessel. However, this does have weird impacts on zen based items.
I didn't state that the price cap causes inflation, I said that it's not a function of it, hence it's irrilevant. (but somehow people think that the price cap helps limiting the AD inflation, when it does not.)
Free trade isn't an inherent moral virtue, it's just a thing that causes economies to do things. Raising the AD cap will certainly cause more zen to be injected into the market all else being equal, but that zen will be out of reach of those without the AD to afford the new price.
All in all, I'm actually pretty on the fence regarding whether the ceiling should be lifted, but typically people make really bad arguments on both sides of the issue which is extremely frustrating.
Edit: It's not about the "natural right to zen." It's about whether the reputation of the game and the income of the game are both optimized under one set of conditions or the other.
Don't get me wrong-I agree that the wait time creates a distortion. But it allows poorer players access to zenstore items (eg Preservation Wards) that they otherwise wouldn't have access to. Preservation Wards are a fundamentally necessary component of the game.
Incomes are fixed. If Neverwinter wants to consider itself free-to-play, as it does, it really needs to make sure that all necessary components for meaningful play are obtainable for free-to-players. You can say "well, that's just not how f2p games need to work, Neverwinter needs to embrace its p2w elements!" and I wouldn't even necessarily disagree with you on that (but nor would I agree). Rather, it's simply the case that that does not appear to be part of the marketing strategy, and we can therefore surmise that Cryptic feels that embracing p2w elements would go against what they want the game to be.
Note: The vast majority of zen store items are purchasable on the AH in one form or another. Since the cost of production of Preservation Wards is always 5000 per, plus the wait time, the cost pf Preservation Wards will always be 5556 plus some change (where "some change" measures how much the market considers the time value of money as a cost). If, however, the price cap was raised to, say, 1000 per zen, then a player would have to spend nearly twice as much AD per ward.
2.) Again, that presumes that the increase in zen into the system from individuals willing to pay more for zen because of the increased AD value of the zen outweighs the decrease in the value of zen from departing players unable to purchase wards.
3.) It's mostly that you're treating free markets as an inherent virtue, instead of simply one method. Also, to be more specific, you dropped the "Lulz Marxists" bomb, which signals one as not being serious about an economic debate.
I'm going to not edit this post, since I edited my last post, and we're having edit wars that makes the conversation super hard to follow.
I'll also grant that a lot of the issue centers around the fact that AD is fixed source of income, so the AD a new player has is always X, regardless of what the price level is.
Anyway:
Free Trade (no ceiling) allows for the transfer of zen to AD. The only reason to assume that this leads to a somewhat optimum outcome is if we believe market equilbria to be efficient.
However, we have a market equilibrium: the value in terms of AD for items on the AH. The value of items on the AH is a cross-section of the fact that zen costs 500 AD, and the fact that one has to wait for zen.
As the number of people willing to sell zen at 500 AD declines, the price of AH items should increase.
There is no imperative to remove the AD ceiling; instead of charging more for zen directly, players may instead character for zen indirectly. But how much they are able to charge for zen is limited by how much other players doing the same thing are carging.
The main barrier, then, is not the AD cap, but rather the 10% AH cut. So the question is, why is the equilibrum of the AH somehow worse than the equilibrium of a zen market without a price cap?
If we're concerned with the purchasing power of the dollar in terms of in-game items, why not instead halve the cost of items in terms of zen? If a preservation ward costs 5 zen instead of 10 zen, the effective purchasing power of dollars is essentially doubled, since the purchasing power of zen is essentially doubled.
I suppose the question is, why do we want to make the game harder for free-to-players?
If the problem is that the AD cap means dollars don't get invested into the system because dollars aren't "worth enough" then why not just double the "worth" of dollars, instead of halving the "worth" of the AD that players have?
I think the point we agree on is that you should make AD by "playing the game" (though personally, I like market manipulations as well, eg crafting shirt/pants and abusing the obviously broken zen market~)