Cloaking Device option for Temporal ships

captainhunter1 · June 2018

Something that has been bugging me for a while is the fact my Romulan Temporal Destroyer has no cloaking device. I suggested sometime back that it be equipped with one, being it's Romulan and all. Unfortunately this really isn't possible due to the fact that both the Temporal Destroyer and Temporal Science ships are 'generic' vessels all with identical stats regardless of faction - they simply get reskinned depending on which one you choose.

Since this is the case (and I don't see Cryptic giving them ALL built-in cloaking devices, otherwise they would have done that when they were released), why not add these Temporal craft to the list of ships that can use the Universal Cloaking Device Console?

Makes sense doesn't it? This way Romulan and Klingon Temporal vessels could have the option to use a cloak or not, and even the Federation could do so as well since I would definitely think that these future ships would fall into that 'special' category that is an exception for Fed cloak usage.

What do you all think?

daqhegh · June 2018

Not every ship needs a cloak. Fancier ones, like the Temporal ones, have other abilities unique to those ships. Some are crazy OP without cloaks. Chill out, man.

warpangel · June 2018

1. The romulans and klingons are members of the Federation in the time period those ships are from (and the mirror versions conquered by the Terran Empire), so the skinjobs shouldn't even exist. The only reason they do exist is that part of the storyline wasn't yet written when the temporal lockbox was released in 2012. Notice when they added the Paradox dreadnought to that line, it only had the one version.
2. Game balance abstractions don't need to make sense. Every ship can't cloak because they want cloaking to be "special" in some way and it's more or less arbitrary what can and can't cloak. In canon, every ship can cloak just install a little device. There is no rational reason not to have one on everything.
3. The cloak consoles are a complete waste of space.

captainhunter1 · June 2018

daqhegh wrote: »

Not every ship needs a cloak. Fancier ones, like the Temporal ones, have other abilities unique to those ships. Some are crazy OP without cloaks. Chill out, man.

That's why I wasn't asking that a cloak be hardwired into the Temporal ships. They must give up a console slot in order to use one, trading away one advantage for another. It also requires the purchase of another ship which comes with the Cloaking Console - actually increasing profit for Cryptic, while keep 'cloaking' Temporal ships somewhat rare. It would be fantastic to at least have this option available.

(My OCD.... Rommie. Ships. Must. Have. Cloak.

)

gaevsman · June 2018

captainhunter1 wrote: »

daqhegh wrote: »

Not every ship needs a cloak. Fancier ones, like the Temporal ones, have other abilities unique to those ships. Some are crazy OP without cloaks. Chill out, man.

That's why I wasn't asking that a cloak be hardwired into the Temporal ships. They must give up a console slot in order to use one, trading away one advantage for another. It also requires the purchase of another ship which comes with the Cloaking Console - actually increasing profit for Cryptic, while keep 'cloaking' Temporal ships somewhat rare. It would be fantastic to at least have this option available.

(My OCD.... Rommie. Ships. Must. Have. Cloak. )

I love the Tlaura, i love it… but it really does not need a cloak, that little ship is a beast!

captainhunter1 · June 2018

gaevsman wrote: »

I love the Tlaura, i love it… but it really does not need a cloak, that little ship is a beast!

Lol, neither do any of these.... Dreadnought Cruiser, Tactical Escort Retrofit, Avenger Battle Cruiser, Fleet Avenger Battle Cruiser, Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit, Fleet Dreadnought Cruiser, Aquarius Light Escort, Fleet Aquarius Light Escort.

Yet they can all equip it.

It's time to add Temporal Ships to that list.

cryptkeeper0 · June 2018

captainhunter1 wrote: »

gaevsman wrote: »

I love the Tlaura, i love it… but it really does not need a cloak, that little ship is a beast!

Lol, neither do any of these.... Dreadnought Cruiser, Tactical Escort Retrofit, Avenger Battle Cruiser, Fleet Avenger Battle Cruiser, Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit, Fleet Dreadnought Cruiser, Aquarius Light Escort, Fleet Aquarius Light Escort.

Yet they can all equip it.

It's time to add Temporal Ships to that list.

just add all fed ships

starkaos · June 2018

It is extremely likely that all Temporal ships had some advanced version of a Cloaking Device, but the Temporal ships had most of the 26th Century, 29th Century, and 31st Century technology removed before we gained access to them. Also, there is the likelihood of ships from the future need cloaking devices from their time in order to work. So you need a 29th Century Cloaking device to cloak a 29th Century ship.

thevampinator · June 2018

Well as far as I recall the Temporal ships or at least some of the federation ones did have the cloaking device however they patched the cloaking out. Believe it was the paladin ship or one of the futuristic twenty sixth century fed ships. one of them did in fact have a cloaking ability at first but they removed it. As that was an unattended feature. My best guess is they have their reasons for not giving any of them cloaking devices. I could see a time travel ship equipped with it just because it would be easier to not pollute or corrupt a timeline that way.

alcyoneserene · June 2018

Rom temporal ships are lacking, they don't have different stats from their fed clones, don't have singularity cores, and don't have cloaks of any kind.

Aesthetics might be nice, but it's a little hard to think of them and play them as temporal warbirds when they are just fed ships with a different skin.

koppster · June 2018

They had an opportunity to fix this with the T6 Verne. Instead it's more of the same with the Klink and Rom versions of these ships. Ergo: they don't care.

avoozuul · June 2018

I don't think it makes sense to give each faction their own versions of the Wells, in some of the missions we saw aliens from different factions still command the same ship, there was a Gorn commanding a Wells named Poh. The 31st century ships for an example were future multi-faction ships.

captainhunter1 · June 2018

avoozuul wrote: »

I don't think it makes sense to give each faction their own versions of the Wells, in some of the missions we saw aliens from different factions still command the same ship, there was a Gorn commanding a Wells named Poh. The 31st century ships for an example were future multi-faction ships.

Well, no, there wouldn't be different versions. They would remain exactly as they are now.

I'm simply asking that they be added to the list of ships which have the option to use the Cloaking Console.

lordgyor · June 2018

The Worm Hole Generator Console from the Jem'hadar Light Battle Cruiser can be equipted on any ship and functionally its a cloak with extra benifits. If you get that you can stick it on your temporal ship.

echatty · June 2018

I don't use cloak even if I have it. My Klingons don't cloak, my Roms don't cloak.

To me, cloaks are entirely unnecessary.

echatty · June 2018

azrael605 wrote: »

> @koppster said:
> They had an opportunity to fix this with the T6 Verne. Instead it's more of the same with the Klink and Rom versions of these ships. Ergo: they don't care.

Its not something that needs fixed.

I agree with this. Only reason anyone probably thinks cloak is necessary are PvP gankers, IMO.

alcyoneserene · June 2018

Cloaks do serve many purposes if you enjoy using this gameplay aspect. I find it a lot of fun, and also a way to role-play into your character & faction gear.

- bypass swarms of enemies in mirror invasion, or any map, to get anywhere fast without being forced into red alert
- enhanced battle cloaks for stealth torpedo bombers & sciscort
- ambush bonuses and buffing alpha strikes including science, extended with Reman species trait, other traits, etc.
- trait interaction: ex. honored dead to maintain dmg res buffs
- escape from incoming damage and nullify threat, ex. T5 Scimitar console for cloaking with shields up, starship traits (ex. Aelahl)
- PvP <-I don't do this in this game but others can tell you its merit there
- positioning, go almost anywhere to unleash sudden specific attacks without suffering damage (Ex. Scimitar Thalaron pulse)
- self-healing & passive regeneration by escaping red alert easily
- synergy with singularity core abilities
- turn rate boosts while cloaked (Romulan)
- duty officer abilities: ex. aux power boosts while cloaked, enhances stealth & anything scaling off of Aux
- console set bonuses that include basic cloak

echatty · June 2018

That's all fine for you. I do RP some myself and cloaks don't factor into it. I also don't PvP and never will. I don't come onto a game to fight other players, I come onto a game to have fun my way. I have nothing against how anyone else chooses to play either. That's what I love about STO. Everyone can play their way and that's perfectly fine.

I just never see a need for cloaking except for occasionally needing to slip away from a battle if you're about to blow up. And I seldom need to do that.

echatty · June 2018

Exactly, azrael. They never had a cloak and shouldn't have a cloak for that reason. The only times I have cloaks are when I'm on a Rom in a Rom ship or a KDF in a KDF ship. And even then, I rarely used it.

psychoplatt · June 2018

u can cloak on every ship - just check the competetive rep.

baddmoonrizin · June 2018

Well, if you think about it in terms of in-universe instead of in-game, it would probably be a good idea for a ship that time travels to have a cloaking device.

starkaos · June 2018

baddmoonrizin wrote: »

Well, if you think about it in terms of in-universe instead of in-game, it would probably be a good idea for a ship that time travels to have a cloaking device.

Which is why I am of the opinion that all temporal ships had an OP cloaking device before they were sent back in time. Probably could fire weapons while cloaked, have a cloaking AoE, and 25th Century weapons would just pass right through the ship. The reason why it can't use 25th Century cloaks is the cloaks aren't properly calibrated to work with 29th Century ships. So a 29th Century cloak would work on a 25th Century ship, but not vice versa.

alcyoneserene · June 2018

psychoplatt wrote: »

u can cloak on every ship - just check the competetive rep.

"Hidden Payload" 2pc set bonus is nice, but only works when at 0% throttle and out of red alert. Yes it works with mask energy signature, so can bypass enemies with it, sit still anywhere, and cloak, but that's about it. Better than nothing.

Also, so many powerful abilities in the game, having a cloak on KDF & Rom timeships is hardly worth a mention for balance's sake.

Same applies to singularity warp cores & abilities that already result in lower total subsystem power levels, one less starship class-perk, and having to pay 2x for both warp cores and singularity cores on Roms. The cores also drain when out of red alert, lower stealth rating while cloaked, and have cool-downs and charge-up times, so these can't be spammed even with the two or three warbird consoles.

captainhunter1 · June 2018

echatty wrote: »

I agree with this. Only reason anyone probably thinks cloak is necessary are PvP gankers, IMO.

And Roleplayers like me.

From that perspective, every Romulan ship should have a cloaking device, regardless of what century it's from. Klingon ships are hit or miss in this aspect (as they were actually never supposed to have them in the first place - a single line of dialog missing from the Search for Spock (ST III) stated that Kruge stole the Bird of Prey from the Romulans), and Fed ships would be 'special' cases only.

Again, if you don't like having a cloak on these ships, that perfectly fine, don't mount the Console. I for one would like the OPTION to do so - especially when it comes to RPing a Romulan ship.

lordgyor · June 2018

Personally I'm fine with it either way, but if RP is your main concern, the Singularity Cloaking Rep power from the Romulan Rep should do the job, it's even effectively a science boost Enhanced Battlecloak that can't be used often or for long periods, just RP that its a side effect of trying to integrate Romulan tech with Federation tech, break Downs happen often.

Or use Cardassian Intel ships on your fed Characters as those have a cloak.

captainhunter1 · June 2018

lordgyor wrote: »

Personally I'm fine with it either way, but if RP is your main concern, the Singularity Cloaking Rep power from the Romulan Rep should do the job, it's even effectively a science boost Enhanced Battlecloak that can't be used often or for long periods, just RP that its a side effect of trying to integrate Romulan tech with Federation tech, break Downs happen often.

Or use Cardassian Intel ships on your fed Characters as those have a cloak.

Well, the captain of the ship is Romulan, and I like Romulan ships. So substituting another species ship is not really something I would do.

As for the Rep cloaking power, I have that, but 5 seconds active with a 5 minute cooldown really doesn't work for me as a substitute.

As Baddmoonrizen said above, these ships most likely had cloaking ability before they were stripped down and sold off. Why not simply allow us to put a cloak back on them, as an option, taking up a console slot that we could use for something else. That way everyone is happy. Those who want to put a cloak back on these ships can, and those that don't care, or don't want a cloak, don't have to. That's why the Cloaking Console idea is a great OPTION for these ships.

duncanidaho11 · June 2018

baddmoonrizin wrote: »

Well, if you think about it in terms of in-universe instead of in-game, it would probably be a good idea for a ship that time travels to have a cloaking device.

Certainly. However, they might employ a different cloaking principle; one that requires the temporal gubbins the powers at be stripped from these ships so we don't go back in time to mess with paleolithic art and give Galileo a pat on the back.

ichaerus1 · June 2018

duncanidaho11 wrote: »

baddmoonrizin wrote: »

Well, if you think about it in terms of in-universe instead of in-game, it would probably be a good idea for a ship that time travels to have a cloaking device.

Certainly. However, they might employ a different cloaking principle; one that requires the temporal gubbins the powers at be stripped from these ships so we don't go back in time to mess with paleolithic art and give Galileo a pat on the back.

Pretty sure that Daniels does this often as it is, to ensure his timeline is the correct one that happens.

Cloaking Device option for Temporal ships

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