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What ever happen to Flanking and other Minor Raider (BoP's) Buff's?

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  • solidshatnersolidshatner Member Posts: 390 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    I am NOT happy about this 25% down to 8% Flanking TRIBBLE. The bonus was clearly advertised at 25% and I purchased a B'Rel BoP with Enhanced Battlecloak in anticipation of it. I wasted hours grinding for the Breen ship to get the 33%. Are you telling me my money has been stolen and thats getting NERFED too? I get this is a Tribble test but seriously - if they get the idea to launch that I wish someone with the time and funds could get away with suing them. If just to send the message STOP WRITING CHECKS YOUR BUTTS' RARELY CASH!!!

    And yeah - I get there was probably a disclaimer saying 'blah blah stats subject to change' but come ON!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • shadowfang240shadowfang240 Member Posts: 30,939 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    I am NOT happy about this 25% down to 8% Flanking TRIBBLE. The bonus was clearly advertised at 25% and I purchased a B'Rel BoP with Enhanced Battlecloak in anticipation of it. I wasted hours grinding for the Breen ship to get the 33%. Are you telling me my money has been stolen and thats getting NERFED too? I get this is a Tribble test but seriously - if they get the idea to launch that I wish someone with the time and funds could get away with suing them. If just to send the message STOP WRITING CHECKS YOUR BUTTS' RARELY CASH!!!

    And yeah - I get there was probably a disclaimer saying 'blah blah stats subject to change' but come ON!
    they made it ABUNDANTLY clear from the start the flanking bonus against players was going to be significantly reduced...don't blame them because you didn't read closely enough
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    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"

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  • cryptkeeper0cryptkeeper0 Member Posts: 776 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    they made it ABUNDANTLY clear from the start the flanking bonus against players was going to be significantly reduced...don't blame them because you didn't read closely enough

    Indeed it said the bonus was reduced on players, it's reduced on the breen ship too. Cryptic even pointed this out quite explicitly. Alot misunderstandings and rage on these forums seems to be a lack of reading thoroughly. The extra ambush damage is nice too.

    I'm kinda disappointed no buffs to raptors, and the kdf and rom vet ships. Specifically a shield mod boast.
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    PVP whining causing problems in another MMO.

    *yawn*
  • tehbubbalootehbubbaloo Member Posts: 2,003 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    kolbrandr wrote: »
    PVP whining causing problems in another MMO.

    *yawn*

    what problem does flanking bring to sto?
  • timezargtimezarg Member Posts: 1,268
    edited March 2014
    mondoid wrote: »
    http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=15621061#post15621061



    Klingon Raiders have received a good amount of tuning and improvements across the board.

    All Tier 2 and above Klingon Raiders will receive a 10% boost to their base hull hit points.
    This should help off-set the risk of using cloak to ambush your enemies.
    Raider Flanking: Attacking enemies from their rear arc will grant the attacker a 25% bonus damage boost.
    This bonus is significantly reduced (+25% down to +8.3%) when attacking a player's rear arc.)
    Affects all Klingon Raiders, with the exception of the Tier 1 B’Rel Bird-of-Prey.
    Improved Ambush Damage: The bonus damage awarded from existing cloak has been increased on any Klingon Raider that also has Raider Flanking.
    Raiders receive an additional +10% bonus damage while flanking.

    Forgot about that additional 10% damage boost. Yeah, this'll be quite an excellent boost that will help bring the BoP back into relevance when it comes to burst damage out of cloak. Depending on how it all fleshes out, it might even help negate the crit bonus advantage Rommies get. Especially now that they fixed the Nausicaan Pirate trait, which allows for some minor overall damage boost in that regard.
    tIqIpqu' 'ej nom tIqIp
  • solidshatnersolidshatner Member Posts: 390 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    they made it ABUNDANTLY clear from the start the flanking bonus against players was going to be significantly reduced...don't blame them because you didn't read closely enough

    Cool - quote the source please.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • shadowfang240shadowfang240 Member Posts: 30,939 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Cool - quote the source please.
    in here, under the improved flanking section: http://community.arcgames.com/en/news/star-trek-online/detail/1000390-season-8-dev-blog-_27
    Designer’s Comments:
    Consistently attacking an enemy's rear arc (where their aft shield facing is) can require some clever positioning, practice and planning. Flanking requires that you strike the rear arc of the target ship and will provide a 33% damage bonus. It should be noted that this damage bonus is significantly reduced against players and it doesn't apply to mines and summon powers like the Scorpion Fighter device, Gravity Well or Tyken's Rift. It does apply to all energy weapons, all torpedoes (that don't spawn mines) and damage powers like Tractor Beam and Photonic Shockwave.
    Our goal is to use the Plesh Brek's Flanking ability as a prototype to fine to tune it before eventually rolling it out to Klingon Raiders along with some other minor improvements to these ships. It should be noted that Klingon Raiders will receive a slightly weaker version Flanking bonus (+25% instead of the Plesh Brek's +33%).
    the relevant section is even already underlined
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    How Game Devs SHOULD be interacted with:
    http://askagamedev.tumblr.com/post/157238832062/i-remember-your-52080-rule-and-it-was-an-awesome

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"

    "Beware of dog. Or possibly, enhanced, psycho-addicted, cybernetically-enhanced nightstalker death-dealing dog from hell."
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.

    Stand with Star Trek: The Animated Series content for STO! #TASforSTO
  • solidshatnersolidshatner Member Posts: 390 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    in here, under the improved flanking section: http://community.arcgames.com/en/news/star-trek-online/detail/1000390-season-8-dev-blog-_27


    the relevant section is even already underlined

    Fair enough and thanks. I originally interpreted the flanking bonus to be reduced to 8% in general - not just against players. All is still well, as long as they get it live.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    what problem does flanking bring to sto?

    Mostly players whining. PVP is the source for damn near all the whining in every MMO that has it.

    I love PVP, but hate PVPers.
  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 8,984 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    kolbrandr wrote: »
    Mostly players whining. PVP is the source for damn near all the whining in every MMO that has it.

    I love PVP, but hate PVPers.

    Really, man?

    You can go into the the various subsections of these forums or even ingame zone chats/channels and hear about varioius griping.

    The Gal-X reboot sucked. Cryptic completely missed the memo as to why there were huge gripes about the Gal-X and Galaxy class to begin with.

    Various, "What's your beef with the ____, Cryptic?" threads, with PVP not a driving point of them.

    How many T5 Connie threads have there been? That has long been a Fed desire, just as long as KDF wanting an endgame B'Rel. Except we actually got the B'Rel for endgame.

    Threads about improving the older STO ships which have been left completely behind in capability by newer ships.

    Not enough KDF ships compared to the Feds.

    How long have we around here in the KDF complained about not being to start the game from scratch as a Klingon? How long have we complained about the lack of content to progress from the beginning to endgame? It's been taken cared of the last several months, but dang dude, we have been griping about that since Day 1 of STO going live.

    How long have we in the KDF complained about the lack of uniform options, most importantly canon options as well as "modern KDF" uniform items that the NPCs use? Remember the whole fingerless gloves thing? We've asked for that since STO came out, and the Romulans get them instead.

    Power Creep increasing so high over development time of this game that it has trivialized the game's content. A game where the NPC AI has never been that good. Hell, NPCs don't even repair themselves, don't do Beam Overloads, don't do Torpedo Spreads. They barely do anything. But player power has increased making the game a total joke at "Elite." The bar has been lowered.

    Speaking of Power Creep, combine that with blatant overpoweredness of the Romulans via LOR. It is absolutely amazing what you can do in a Warbird, PVP or PVE, compared to any Fed or KDF ship and build. They have all the best characteristics of Fed & KDF benefits but sacrifice absolutely nothing. Then the BOFFs...

    Then there's the trivial "power" of Science BOFF abilities if you try anything else outside Grav Well.

    On and on, and PVP is not driving those issues. It drives some, to be sure, but saying the source of all issues is PVP is pretty damn shortsighted. I would have thought that someone with your experience around here would know that.
    XzRTofz.gif
  • shadowfang240shadowfang240 Member Posts: 30,939 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Hell, NPCs don't even repair themselves, don't do Beam Overloads, don't do Torpedo Spreads.
    there are many NPC ships in the game that use those powers...some use all 3
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    How Game Devs SHOULD be interacted with:
    http://askagamedev.tumblr.com/post/157238832062/i-remember-your-52080-rule-and-it-was-an-awesome

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"

    "Beware of dog. Or possibly, enhanced, psycho-addicted, cybernetically-enhanced nightstalker death-dealing dog from hell."
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.

    Stand with Star Trek: The Animated Series content for STO! #TASforSTO
  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 8,984 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    there are many NPC ships in the game that use those powers...some use all 3

    I can't remember the last time that NPC ships use them. I never see the repairs, never see their hull repair, never see their shields repair other than regular regens. But then again man, we blow stuff up so fast that it probably doesn't matter. Power creep to go along all the useless NPC AI and lack of abilities.
    XzRTofz.gif
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    I should have clarified. I was referring to the majority of whining about "balance" issues. In this game in particular, with PVE content that you can walk over in any ship, balance between the factions is not particularly important. But oh the PvP. The revamped Galaxy is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. Every t-5 ship of every faction is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. So where is the crying coming from? What is it about. PVE is not a competition.

    Why would the give a 25% flanking bonus vs NPCs, but only 8% vs Players? PvP whining. In this case, Fed PvP whining, since the only time you're going to using the flank is on decloak (against a competent player).
  • twamtwam Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    kolbrandr wrote: »
    The revamped Galaxy is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. Every t-5 ship of every faction is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. So where is the crying coming from? What is it about. PVE is not a competition.

    And yet most whining about the Galaxies was coming from PvE use situations... You tell me why, 'cause I don't know.
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    twam wrote: »
    And yet most whining about the Galaxies was coming from PvE use situations... You tell me why, 'cause I don't know.

    If that is true, I have no clue, because it makes no ****ing sense.
  • mimey2mimey2 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    kolbrandr wrote: »
    I should have clarified. I was referring to the majority of whining about "balance" issues. In this game in particular, with PVE content that you can walk over in any ship, balance between the factions is not particularly important. But oh the PvP. The revamped Galaxy is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. Every t-5 ship of every faction is fine for every bit of non-PvP content in this game. So where is the crying coming from? What is it about. PVE is not a competition.

    Why would the give a 25% flanking bonus vs NPCs, but only 8% vs Players? PvP whining. In this case, Fed PvP whining, since the only time you're going to using the flank is on decloak (against a competent player).

    Actually...

    Reduced flanking against players wasn't at all from PvP whining. It was actually that way right out of the starting gate. Heck, the day that they posted the info about flanking back before the Winter Event it was already stated as being reduced against players.

    Besides, everyone at the time had an equal chance to get the Plesh Brek and test it out, including it's own flanking that was accessible to all players. In terms of here on the forums at least, I saw no more than maybe a handful of threads and posts on the Plesh Brek.
    I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
    I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    Yes, they stated (and designed) that right out of the gate, because if they hadn't, it would have unleashed a poostorm of PvP whining.
  • tehbubbalootehbubbaloo Member Posts: 2,003 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    kolbrandr wrote: »
    Yes, they stated (and designed) that right out of the gate, because if they hadn't, it would have unleashed a poostorm of PvP whining.

    you mean 'it would have been incredibly unbalanced, and people would have talked about that'.
  • kolbrandrkolbrandr Member Posts: 266
    edited March 2014
    The only people that a flanking bonus would bite are the ones who are asleep at the wheel or just lazy. We are barely looking at the same increase that a ship with 5 forward weapons enjoys from every angle, and against those you don't get the luxury of knowing exactly where the attack will originate from.
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