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Hobus Forgiveness or Forgetfulness?

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  • reynoldsxdreynoldsxd Member Posts: 977 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    sollvax wrote: »
    Step one get a decent ship
    Step two rise in the service of new romulus
    Step three obtain a time ship
    Step four intercept the explosion with a "sub space tachyon inversion matrix " and " cross patch the temporal differential" thus sending the explosion into a pocket universe (ideally the Q's)
    Step Five return to the EMPIRE and shoot the tal shair for treason
    Step six marry your child hood sweetie and settle down to raise epoah

    Extra Round: stand vigil till the end of time to prevent other time agencies from undoing what you did....





    AS for why we do not have the RSE to play:

    Cryptic killed that possibility the moment taris was revealed to have butt fcked the romulan people hardcore - and then not continuing the story line.

    The whole thing just disappears and you move on to other things. Like de'faily or some other po dong misfit needing help.

    Sure we get the part with Hakeev and Empress sela getting abducted but that came like 2 years after the original plot line and didn't answer ****. It just reinforced what we already knew:
    Ze iconians have convinced several romulans and remand that blowing up their own world is totally cool.

    end of story. There is no resolution to that plot.


    And now the new republic will open another plot thread with martians landing walkers on random planets.....
  • bronzesilencebronzesilence Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    kain9prime wrote: »
    Which is why we will side with the Klingon Empire...

    Brilliant logic. At least Federation members tried and succeeded in containing the supernova (even if they were too late to save Romulus). Pretty sure the Klingons didn't do squat to help aside from Worf.
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    I cannot wait for LoR to arrive! All I have seen and read points to a phenomenal and dramatic expansion of the STO universe. Well done, Cryptic!

    There is one nagging detail that I have yet to see resolved (and maybe it is in LoR). According to the Path to 2409, in 2387, it was known Hobus was becoming unstable and Spock and Picard petitioned the Vulcan Science Academy for help to quell Hobus before it exploded. They were turned down flat and, in essence, left Romulus to die. How will LoR handle this? It would seem to me Romulus could never forgive the Federation for abandoning them. What would be the premise for the survivors to either forgive, or never find out in the first place, what the Federation did (or didn't do). It was only Spock acting alone that stopped the supernova from engulfing the rest of the quadrant. Granted, the Romulan Senate did not want to go ask their long lost brethren for help, but nonetheless, I think the Federation had an obligation to help, and they sat on their hands.

    So I've been perplexed with the sudden, willing alliance between D'Tan and the new Romulan Republic, and the Federation. Did the survivors forgive the Federation's betrayal, forget, or did they never know?
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    First it's important to understand that the Federation cannot just go into the Romulan Empire and do whatever it wants. They couldn't "invade" Romulan space to try and deal with what was going on at Hobus. They would have needed to be asked by the Romulan government or else face a war. So I can't see how any of the Reunificationists would feel anger toward the Federation because of what happened.

    It's also important to understand that D'Tan and his people were the outsiders within Romulan society. They were the group influenced by Spock's 19 years of reunification teaching, but they were not the majority of Romulans - nor in the majority opinion. Most Romulans just like things the way they were - with possibly a little less Tal Shiar/KGB fear.

    I could see where D'Tans group might hold some anger toward Vulcan for not helping, but this is the reunificationist group. They're the ones who wanted to get back with the Vulcans so they might be overlooking the slight as trying to understand Vulcans' logic.

    D'Tan is also just trying to survive in the wilderness against foes on every side. They're taking aid from anyone who will give it as they try to separate themselves from the Empire - which is why they have alliances with the Federation and the Klingon Empire. Right now they're in survival mode. Pointing fingers mode generally comes long after the danger has passed. :)

    both make good points, but the romulans are not stupid, they will have probably figured it out shortly after the hobus incident. Vulcans never had any use for the Romulans and there has always been bad blood there for thousands of year before the fedeartion existed, even before these vulcans who marched under the raptors wings, the culture of the vulcans had fractured considerably and beyond repair. they dont blame the federation but rather those same people who were once as one, ironically there is another cultural split in the romulan camp where one side can not forgive the other and this group marches under the symbolism of logic instead.
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    As I understand it the bomb was exploded in subspace - thus it could travel faster then light. Essentially it was moving at warp 10 from Hobus outward.

    then why was the romulan homeworld the only thing hit? if it was a non-directed subspace explosive device that destroyed hobus, other systems should of also been destroyed. unfotunately that was never explained, only that a bomb was set off on hobus and romulus and remus paid the price.
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
    Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Brilliant logic. At least Federation members tried and succeeded in containing the supernova (even if they were too late to save Romulus). Pretty sure the Klingons didn't do squat to help aside from Worf.

    Worf would never help the romulans. they killed his parents and conspired to destroy not only the house of mogh but ally with an hated enemy of Mogh, house of duras.
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
    Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
  • thecosmic1thecosmic1 Member Posts: 9,365 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    then why was the romulan homeworld the only thing hit? if it was a non-directed subspace explosive device that destroyed hobus, other systems should of also been destroyed. unfotunately that was never explained, only that a bomb was set off on hobus and romulus and remus paid the price.
    The explosion on Hobus had reached as far as Romulus/Remus before Spock was able to stop it with a Red Matter bomb. Spock tried to stop it before it Reached Romulus/Remus but was unsuccessful. There might have been several other, not colonized, systems that were also destroyed between Hobus and Romulus but their loss wasn't as important. Plus stars aren't really all that close to each other, even at warp 10. Think of it like this:

    Someone explodes a bomb on Sol. Alpha Centauri is about 4.2 LTYs away from Sol. The next closest stars are Bernard's Star at about 6 LTYs and Wolf 359 at about 7.8. Spock could have stopped the explosion before it hit Bernard's or Wolf 359 but after it hit Alpha Centauri. He simply failed to save Alpha Centauri.
    STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    The explosion on Hobus had reached as far as Romulus/Remus before Spock was able to stop it with a Red Matter bomb. Spock tried to stop it before it Reached Romulus/Remus but was unsuccessful. There might have been several other, not colonized, systems that were also destroyed between Hobus and Romulus but their loss wasn't as important. Plus stars aren't really all that close to each other, even at warp 10. Think of it like this:

    Someone explodes a bomb on Sol. Alpha Centauri is about 4.2 LTYs away from Sol. The next closest stars are Bernard's Star at about 6 LTYs and Wolf 359 at about 7.8. Spock could have stopped the explosion before it hit Bernard's or Wolf 359 but after it hit Alpha Centauri. He simply failed to save Alpha Centauri.

    precisely my point you cite between hobus and romulus system, but what about every other star system around hobus. all trek shows have a few stand out planetary systems to simplify the trek universe, who knows how many suns exploded in the local area besides romulus. that was never expanded on and even if spock did stop the nova at romulus, what about those other local systems, it doesnt save any of those either.

    the typical sterotype is that when something explodes inspace on trek, its a 2d ring expanding out, but its not like that, when the equinox exploded it formed a 3d ball that expanded out and that was a non-specific explosion. was the hubus event a directed explosion at romulus alone? or was it a directionless explosion from hobus?
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
    Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
  • thecosmic1thecosmic1 Member Posts: 9,365 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    precisely my point you cite between hobus and romulus system, but what about every other star system around hobus. all trek shows have a few stand out planetary systems to simplify the trek universe, who knows how many suns exploded in the local area besides romulus. that was never expanded on and even if spock did stop the nova at romulus, what about those other local systems, it doesnt save any of those either.

    the typical sterotype is that when something explodes inspace on trek, its a 2d ring expanding out, but its not like that, when the equinox exploded it formed a 3d ball that expanded out and that was a non-specific explosion. was the hubus event a directed explosion at romulus alone? or was it a directionless explosion from hobus?
    The point is there might have been other stars between Hobus and Romulus, or there might not have been any. We don't have a map of the Romulan Star Empire. Hobos might have been chosen because it was the closest star to Romulus. There's no information in canon, so all Trek maps are just non-canon assumptions.

    Likewise we have no idea why Red Matter stops it. We only know that in doing so it created a wormhole that sucked 2 ships through. :)
    STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
  • naeviusnaevius Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    was the hubus event a directed explosion at romulus alone? or was it a directionless explosion from hobus?

    It was a 'subspace' explosion, and it therefore did subspace-y things. I believe every planet that was listening to subspace radio (classic rock channel) was affected. :P
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  • stormturmoilstormturmoil Member Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    More seriously, if Insurrection is to be taken as an indication of How subspace effects produced by subspace weapons behave (keeping in mind that they're banned for being ''unpredictable' as well), Then we can infer that Since the Hobus Supernova event was affected by having a subspace super-bomb thrown into, it'll behave in a similar subspace-y way

    In Insurrection, the subspace tear was attracted to and accelerated towards the Enterpirses Warp core due to subspace shenanigans; If the same thing holds here, then the Hobus Shockwave could equally be attracted to and accelerate towards Warp cores.

    Where's the nearest, biggest concentration of Warp cores going at the moment? Probably Romulus; other planets might be closer, and there might be other ships, but Romulus is both relatively close and Guranteed by nature of being the capital of the Romulan Star Empire to have huge amounts of ship traffic, and possibly warp cores for planetary power generation requirements, orbital defences etc.

    So, the Bomb (and the Hobus star with it) goes off, producing a Subspace shockwave that's attracted to Warpcore activity; Romulus is nearby, lit up like a christmas tree with subspace activity, and pulls the shockwave to it like a magnet pulls iron filings...

    Of course that assumes that Singularity cores have the same sort of effect on subspace that Matter/Antimatter cores do, but since they're both used to run Warp Drives off of, that's not a huge leap.

    If that Is the case, it also plays into Spock's solution: when he creates the Black Hole, he's suddenly created something even tastier, by subspace standards, than the whole of the Romulus system and all it's singularity cores was, so the Shockwave gets dragged towards that next.

    Yes, thinking about it makes my head hurt too; this is my personal cobbled together attempt at an exanation for what happened; take it as you will.
  • katanahiryukatanahiryu Member Posts: 145 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    mattimeo97 wrote: »
    Yet even as the complaining rolls off your tongue, here you are, having played through the aftermath of that story.

    Why are you here, if it is so unpalatable? Why do you consume more of something that you think is so bad?

    I hate this, it is revolting!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kain9primekain9prime Member Posts: 739 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Brilliant logic. At least Federation members tried and succeeded in containing the supernova (even if they were too late to save Romulus). Pretty sure the Klingons didn't do squat to help aside from Worf.
    Haha, so the hell what?

    The Federation is against political bodies such as the Romulan Empire due to the nature of their union and expansion via conquest. This is exactly why many Klingons don't mind turning their backs on treaties with the UFP - their expansionist nature is at odds with what the Federation charter is all about. Maybe beaten down, desperate and "peace-loving" Romulans (like D'Tan) will want to throw themselves at the mercy of the Federation, but the primary goal of traditional Romulans has always been to expand the Empire and eliminate or subjugate one's enemies by any means possible, even if they've had to ally themselves with another enemy.

    There is a history of such alliances with the Klingon Empire.

    Not so much with the Feds.

    Now you know, and knowing is half the damn battle...

    :rolleyes:
    The artist formally known as Romulus_Prime
  • kain9primekain9prime Member Posts: 739 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Worf would never help the romulans. they killed his parents and conspired to destroy not only the house of mogh but ally with an hated enemy of Mogh, house of duras.
    Sure.

    He had to fight along side them during the Dominion War, and as much as it pains me to refer to Star Trek: Nemespits, he seemed all to willing to claim the Donatra Romulans fought honorably. Pretty big thing for Worf to admit.
    The artist formally known as Romulus_Prime
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