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Can we please get a T6 Oberth

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  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    My fanfic will have both 150-meter-long Oberths, and the TNG derivative Sagan-class at 180 meters, with variants up to 200m. As for making up a class to fill appearances of a 300 to 360 ship shown in at least 2 episodes of TNG, I am open to suggestions.
    And I will be writing my Oberths as T6...
    Since that may be a bit off-topic, please message me your suggestions or post in my thread, https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline#/discussion/1246696/starbase-catan-wip-discussion-thread
    We don't want to clutter up this thread too much.

    Maybe a TMP connie

    There will be Connies, and more …

    On another note, since it looks like most, and possibly all new ships, will be Scaling Ships, that you can use from T1 to T6, we'll most likely get a Scaling Oberth. Which could be awesome for classics being reintroduced/updated. There will probably be a new class based on the Oberth, but with access to Oberth parts for those that have them. I would also hope they add in more parts for customization options.
    ;)
    Post edited by anubis0sarvour on
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  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    So, for a T6 Oberth, who favors Eng seating and Consoles, and who favors Tac?
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  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 3,196 Arc User
    Maybe it would make more sense as balanced eng/tac at 3/5/3.
  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Maybe it would make more sense as balanced eng/tac at 3/5/3.

    Perhaps. The lore (canon) has the ship had special shields, alloys and bulkheads to make it highly durable, and its defenses are minimal. So just working off of the 'canon/core lore' which is a bit leaner than in the licensed works, as per https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Oberth_class, it already reflects engineering over tactical. If they made it balanced or neutral, I and no doubt many others would still get it, but as the canon lore has it favoring engineering over tactical, it seems to me a no-brainer to make the standard T6 Oberth reflect that.

    Ideally the standard would, as I stated, favor Engineering while still being a dedicated Science Vessel. This should go into the C-Store, not a lockbox. The Mirror Universe version would be the reverse, favoring Tactical. This one (also T6, duh) would be in the Lobi store. Strategically this would be the best way to implement it, as things the fans/player community wants, and optimizing its profitability. People have to open Lockboxes to get Lobi, so either they use their real world money to Buy Keys, or trade Dil for Zen to Buy Keys.

    What I just outlined, is the best strategy not just simply to make players happy, but to Optimize Cryptic's Profits, to have the strongest possible returns. There is a third option, while less appealing to the community, would still be viable but somewhat less profitable, but at least it would see steady sales (profitable in long run). Make the T6 neutral, with Eng/Tac balanced, and enough Universal Console Slots & BOff Seating that the players can tip the balance any way they want. Tac or Eng, or even double-down on Sci. This versatility would make it popular enough some players would buy it just for the different builds they can make, regardless of the class. So this would be modestly profitable (imho), but still profitable; I just don't see it as profitable as option A. As more product usually leads to more sales.
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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    Given that we have seen the Oberth on screen in movie as a special science vessel, in clips of battles fighting the Borg on Tv, and as a Top Secret test vessel for new tech (also on Tv), Cryptic has a clean slate. We've seen it as Science, in battle (tact), and as a test bed for technology (eng).

    Make it a 3 pack like the Dyson or multi-mission? With a Sci/Tac/Eng option?

    Or if it has to be just one, make it a miracle worker science ship (why not mix up another set of classes? we have a couple "scouts" now that are Sci/Tac like the new Vulcan ship or the Lukari ship) so 4/4/3 console layout but has the bonus "universal console" slot. BUT has the 3/3 weapon loadout and sci skills inherent to a sci vessel (secondary deflector NOT included)
  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    While I am all for variants, and the more the merrier, tbh, it should be a Science Vessel since that is what it was designed for. Yes they were used in combat but that was not their primary function. Updated Oberths should still have their Secondary Deflector and Science abilities. As I outlined above, variants built for different criteria by different makers makes one version a good Sci/Eng vessel, while another makes a good Sci/Tac. That said, doing a 3-pack similar to the Dyson ships or MW Cruisers, could work if done right. Maybe add a special Console or Shield that comes in the ships. Or maybe a new Secondary Deflector.
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,659 Arc User
    I'd like a version like the 3D model I posted here, awhile back.
    dvZq2Aj.jpg
  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    edited February 2019

    And if they wanna update it a bit, they could do something like that
    2M0eGpS.jpg

    Also fixes that "how do they go down below?" question.

    This one? Hmn, yeah... I just might! I like what the guys at Trekyards came up with; there's a one-person lift similar to what they have in Engineering in TNG/VOY & ENT, but it would follow a curved track through the pylons. Additionally there's a Jefferies Tube or two per pylon.
    avoozuul wrote: »
    I tried to find some nice images of an advanced version of the Oberth and I couldn't really find much, but this images apparently has three variations of an Oberth and they look interesting. Although the one on the left looks a bit ugly.
    fDBT3h5.jpg

    I suspect I may well use all of these, and add these images in my fanfic discussion thread, https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline#/discussion/1246696/starbase-catan-wip-discussion-thread
    blitzy4 wrote: »
    In this case as it's as game wise it'd essentially be a science BoP with less weapons, make the phase cloak innate to the ship. Sure it'd probably be a 3/2 weapons layout, but science! Basically think normal Klingon cloaking style (NOT Battle Cloak), but with a phase cloak to make up for the sqiushyness.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Starfleet_Assault_Cruiser_Technology_Set#Console_-_Universal_-_Incremental_Phase_Cloaking_Device
    Hmn, that might work...
    Post edited by anubis0sarvour on
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  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 3,196 Arc User
    All the TNG ships in the game already have a TNG skin with their default material. I bought a Keldon for my aliengen fakedassian before they added them as a proper species, I bought another Keldon when I made an actual Cardassian toon, now I regret buying one for the former. I do like the Keldon more than the three newer Cardassian ships which I found underwhelming due to their inflexibility, however I wish they actually made the Keldon a warship like in the show rather than a regular cruiser, same goes for the D'Deridex.

    I really do hope they add a T6 Oberth at least by next year if not this year, it would give me an excuse to use my science toon more often.
  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    T6 Pegasus Class. I'm in for sure. Would love a TNG skin on it just because....I'm dreaming, so why not?
  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 3,196 Arc User
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.
  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,659 Arc User
    T6 Pegasus Class. I'm in for sure. Would love a TNG skin on it just because....I'm dreaming, so why not?

    :3
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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.

    I meant like giving it a saucer update and lower hull and nacelles from TNG. As in, the Pegasus actually turned out to be pretty freaking epic....so we threw new technology at it and TADA.

    I mean the back story for half the ships we are getting now is "we found an old shipyard full of ships, and just threw a bunch of new stuff on them! Or decided to build them again using modern technology, because why not?"

    Just saying, what if Starfleet decided that the Oberth really WAS a great all around ship to have so start building them again, but obviously using modern components.
  • anubis0sarvouranubis0sarvour Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.

    I meant like giving it a saucer update and lower hull and nacelles from TNG. As in, the Pegasus actually turned out to be pretty freaking epic....so we threw new technology at it and TADA.

    I mean the back story for half the ships we are getting now is "we found an old shipyard full of ships, and just threw a bunch of new stuff on them! Or decided to build them again using modern technology, because why not?"

    Just saying, what if Starfleet decided that the Oberth really WAS a great all around ship to have so start building them again, but obviously using modern components.

    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    I would like to see a T6 Oberth with both new and old skins, and more parts to swap around appearance-wise.
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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.

    I meant like giving it a saucer update and lower hull and nacelles from TNG. As in, the Pegasus actually turned out to be pretty freaking epic....so we threw new technology at it and TADA.

    I mean the back story for half the ships we are getting now is "we found an old shipyard full of ships, and just threw a bunch of new stuff on them! Or decided to build them again using modern technology, because why not?"

    Just saying, what if Starfleet decided that the Oberth really WAS a great all around ship to have so start building them again, but obviously using modern components.

    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    I would like to see a T6 Oberth with both new and old skins, and more parts to swap around appearance-wise.

    I agree that the larger vessel (Pegasus specifically) should be a different class, technically. So T6 should be Pegasus class to mesh better with canon? Total agreement with you there.

    And YES I want the new Oberth to have BACKWARDS skins (TOS, TMP (kinda the one we have, but redo the model), TNG) Don't really want to see the new pointy nacelles and such. Star Trek canon always had federation nacells kinda looking like tubes of varying degrees. These glowing hypodermic needles.....are NOT warp nacelles in MY head canon.
  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    I am not sure "Pegasus" is a good name for an Oberth variant, considering it was involved in illegal cloaking experiments. Maybe "Grissom" Class might be better. The ship might have had a tragic fate, but its crew died in the service of Starfleet ideals. So it is a bit more deserving of honor, isn't it?
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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    I am not sure "Pegasus" is a good name for an Oberth variant, considering it was involved in illegal cloaking experiments. Maybe "Grissom" Class might be better. The ship might have had a tragic fate, but its crew died in the service of Starfleet ideals. So it is a bit more deserving of honor, isn't it?

    Well...it was a clandestine project? I mean Starfleet DID approve it. And they DID create section 31, so they are ok with breaking or bending the rules (I mean we have TV canon, something like a dozen or so times the Prime Directive was broken? For a "good reason"?) And before said fatal/questionable mission the Pegasus was a test bed for technology "Much of which is found in this very ship (Galaxy)". So it would be a logical step. But a TOS flavored variant for sure should be the Grissom class.
  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,214 Arc User
    Ships of a class tend to follow naming conventions. Thus, Pegasus being a mythological horse, ships of the class should be named for mythological horses.

    Sleipnir, (I used that for a Centaur Class in my fanfic)
    Bucephalus
    Aithon
    Zephyrus
    Enbarr
    Gringolet
    Unicorn
    Tianma

    There are whole lists of mythological horses and horse-beasts, not to mention the lists of named war-horses of famous generals.

    You might also consider Pegasus to be a hybrid magical beast, and instead go that route, with Hippogriff and Hippocampus, for example.
  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    Well, the Grissom is an Oberth class, and not named after a mythological horse. The Pegasus is the outlier here.
    Well...it was a clandestine project?
    That did not stay clandestine, leading to a diplomatic incident as a recorded violation of an interstellar treaty, and presumably lead to the Commander of the operation suffering disciplinary charges, So I think reusing the name so soon strongly related in the same context as that incident might be considered problematic.

    I figure due it being a mythological name, it will eventually be used again for a new ship, but maybe with a bit more distance to the incident.
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  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,214 Arc User
    I was referring to the idea that Pegasus was a larger variant of the Oberth rather than a member of the Oberth Class. Each size would be a different class, even though built on the same theme, such as the Witchata class heavy cruisers being derived from the Brooklyn Class Light Cruiser which informed the design of the Alaska Class Large Cruisers.

    Each size category would be its own class of vessel. Thus Pegasus would be an Oberth-type, not an Oberth Class vessel.
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    You can have the Oberth stock skin, the Pegasus variant skin and the Grissom Variant skin. in any event they'd all fall under the same ship configuration, i'd rather they named the T6 version the Esteban Class. This way Captain Esteban is honored for his duty to science and the important role of the Grissom with the Genesis planet.
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  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 3,196 Arc User
    You can have the Oberth stock skin, the Pegasus variant skin and the Grissom Variant skin. in any event they'd all fall under the same ship configuration, i'd rather they named the T6 version the Esteban Class. This way Captain Esteban is honored for his duty to science and the important role of the Grissom with the Genesis planet.
    Yes, I can support that class name.

  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 3,196 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.

    I meant like giving it a saucer update and lower hull and nacelles from TNG. As in, the Pegasus actually turned out to be pretty freaking epic....so we threw new technology at it and TADA.

    I mean the back story for half the ships we are getting now is "we found an old shipyard full of ships, and just threw a bunch of new stuff on them! Or decided to build them again using modern technology, because why not?"

    Just saying, what if Starfleet decided that the Oberth really WAS a great all around ship to have so start building them again, but obviously using modern components.

    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    I would like to see a T6 Oberth with both new and old skins, and more parts to swap around appearance-wise.
    But if they do make the T6 variant bigger then it might not be possible to swap parts with the older one, also I think the T1 model was made as a single part altogether.

  • artan42artan42 Member Posts: 10,450 Bug Hunter
    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    Other than concept art I've found no onscreen evidence that the Oberth is small at all beyond the compositing of one scene in Generations. There's no ship-to-ship comparisons in the TOS films and all StS comparisons in TNG (other than the one in Generations) have it over 300m. All bridge and interior sets used in the TOS films and TNG are too large to fit in a ship smaller than 300m. All cutaways of the superstructure in TNG have it larger as well.​​
    22762792376_ac7c992b7c_o.png
    Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    artan42 wrote: »
    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    Other than concept art I've found no onscreen evidence that the Oberth is small at all beyond the compositing of one scene in Generations. There's no ship-to-ship comparisons in the TOS films and all StS comparisons in TNG (other than the one in Generations) have it over 300m. All bridge and interior sets used in the TOS films and TNG are too large to fit in a ship smaller than 300m. All cutaways of the superstructure in TNG have it larger as well.​​

    And when the nerds analyze the various sets we have seen, to fit everything we "know" to be there within the ship the 300m is even too small. In TNG when you start breaking down how many decks are crammed into the saucer based on windows and the LCARS display we see briefly in scenes, I think the common thought is that it could easily be over the 300m size.

    But regardless, it's Cryptic and STO can pretty much do whatever they want. By screen canon, the entirety of a constitution class (T6 Light Cruiser) should be about the size of a Galaxy saucer, and is supposed to be smaller than the Excelsior....and that is not what we have in game. The NX-01 should be the size of a galaxy class warp nacelle, and the Defiant isn't much larger than the saucer deflector array, etc.

    Continuity aside, they do what works.
    avoozuul wrote: »
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Well TNG did have a slightly different design for the Oberth, it was also bigger than the one in the TOS movies.

    I meant like giving it a saucer update and lower hull and nacelles from TNG. As in, the Pegasus actually turned out to be pretty freaking epic....so we threw new technology at it and TADA.

    I mean the back story for half the ships we are getting now is "we found an old shipyard full of ships, and just threw a bunch of new stuff on them! Or decided to build them again using modern technology, because why not?"

    Just saying, what if Starfleet decided that the Oberth really WAS a great all around ship to have so start building them again, but obviously using modern components.

    Theoretically, that could be how we have the Oberth as 150m long in the TMP era and 300m long in the TNG era.
    Though for my headcanon I consider the 300m ship a different class, despite being named an Oberth in the same episodes, or depicted on an MSD as a smaller ship (~150m-ish) with fewer decks.

    I will post something more about Oberth scaling in another thread, and link it here for those who are interested.

    I would like to see a T6 Oberth with both new and old skins, and more parts to swap around appearance-wise.
    But if they do make the T6 variant bigger then it might not be possible to swap parts with the older one, also I think the T1 model was made as a single part altogether.

    If they release a T6, they usually have gone back and remade the original model. So the T1 we have now would have the modern graphics modeling done to it, thus making any parts interchangeable with the new T6. Same as the updates to the Galaxy (T4) when the Andromeda (T6) came out. All the parts are interchangeable across T4, T5, and T6 versions. Or the Heavy Cruiser (4 nacelle) when they relaunched it as a T3 with the Picard Maneuver, the parts are still usable up to even the Fleet version. So IF they redo the ship, we would have a modern overlay of the original ship skin, plus whatever "new" version we have. Historically, the parts would be interchangeable.

    The catch is IF they release it as a T6 Oberth direct successor. They may not, OR if they do temporal stuff to get it we could have the TOS/25 century ships where you just have two options: old or new.
  • rhazedurilerhazedurile Member Posts: 74 Arc User
    I will enthusiastically throw my support behind a T6 Oberth. It's always been one my favorite designs. I wouldn't mind seeing an updated 2410 version of the class - call it the Grissom Class?

    That said, I was listening to the 400th episode of Priority One, and it was stated their priority is the Discovery content for the moment, but with the launch of the upcoming Picard series, who knows?
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  • damienvryce2damienvryce2 Member Posts: 428 Arc User
    TRIBBLE world peace. I want a T6 OBERTH OF DEATH NOW!!!!! :):)
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  • artan42artan42 Member Posts: 10,450 Bug Hunter
    And when the nerds analyze the various sets we have seen, to fit everything we "know" to be there within the ship the 300m is even too small. In TNG when you start breaking down how many decks are crammed into the saucer based on windows and the LCARS display we see briefly in scenes, I think the common thought is that it could easily be over the 300m size.

    But regardless, it's Cryptic and STO can pretty much do whatever they want. By screen canon, the entirety of a constitution class (T6 Light Cruiser) should be about the size of a Galaxy saucer, and is supposed to be smaller than the Excelsior....and that is not what we have in game. The NX-01 should be the size of a galaxy class warp nacelle, and the Defiant isn't much larger than the saucer deflector array, etc.

    Continuity aside, they do what works.

    Not really, all the sets and various deck heights would fit in a ship between 300 and 360m long.

    And by screen canon the Conni should be much bigger. The Galaxy is 642m and the Conni is canonically 450ish m based on its MSD in ENT which would make it far longer than the Galaxy saucer and the excelsior is about 600m long making it basically the length of the Galaxy minus the nacelles.

    The ingame sizes are precisely equal to the non-canon sizes found in various encyclopedias where the Conni is just under 300m and as long as the Excelsiors nacelles and the Excelsior is about as long as the Galaxy saucer and the Oberth is about the size of the Connis secondary hull. They're very careful and accurate about that, which is a shame because using the onscreen sizes rather than the tiny little encyclopedic sizes would mean the canon ships weren't dwarfed by the STO originals.

    The Defiant is the exception at its canonical length of 170m and not the encyclopedic length of 120m because it needs to be visible.​​
    22762792376_ac7c992b7c_o.png
    Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
    JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.

    #TASforSTO


    '...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
    'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
    'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
    '...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
    'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
    '...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek

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  • zerokillcf2011zerokillcf2011 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    artan42 wrote: »
    And when the nerds analyze the various sets we have seen, to fit everything we "know" to be there within the ship the 300m is even too small. In TNG when you start breaking down how many decks are crammed into the saucer based on windows and the LCARS display we see briefly in scenes, I think the common thought is that it could easily be over the 300m size.

    But regardless, it's Cryptic and STO can pretty much do whatever they want. By screen canon, the entirety of a constitution class (T6 Light Cruiser) should be about the size of a Galaxy saucer, and is supposed to be smaller than the Excelsior....and that is not what we have in game. The NX-01 should be the size of a galaxy class warp nacelle, and the Defiant isn't much larger than the saucer deflector array, etc.

    Continuity aside, they do what works.

    Not really, all the sets and various deck heights would fit in a ship between 300 and 360m long.

    And by screen canon the Conni should be much bigger. The Galaxy is 642m and the Conni is canonically 450ish m based on its MSD in ENT which would make it far longer than the Galaxy saucer and the excelsior is about 600m long making it basically the length of the Galaxy minus the nacelles.

    The ingame sizes are precisely equal to the non-canon sizes found in various encyclopedias where the Conni is just under 300m and as long as the Excelsiors nacelles and the Excelsior is about as long as the Galaxy saucer and the Oberth is about the size of the Connis secondary hull. They're very careful and accurate about that, which is a shame because using the onscreen sizes rather than the tiny little encyclopedic sizes would mean the canon ships weren't dwarfed by the STO originals.

    The Defiant is the exception at its canonical length of 170m and not the encyclopedic length of 120m because it needs to be visible.​​

    A) you said not really, and then agreed with me that it would all fit on a ship between 300-360m....that was my point, "canon" says its 120m, but we see it is in fact larger.

    B) Where are you getting your data from bro? Can't base sizes only off a the MSD, esp actual canon (i.e. printed or onscreen models next to each other) shows 288m for the Connie, the A is 303m. Yes the Galaxy is 642m, but the nacelles are spec'd out between 200m-250m (thus making the Connie per Canon, only slightly larger than the nacelles of the EntD and DEF less than half the length) The Excelsior/EntB is canon at 467m. OFFICIALLY those same sources put the Oberth at 120m....which is the problem. The NX-01 is placed at 225m and has the same crew capacity but less decks overall. And with the Oberth coming out much later, and with the visual references we have seen, the overall length would be more likely safe at the 300m - 360m range based on its appearances in TNG (thus the line of reasoning that later versions with the "technology used in this very ship" were perhaps built larger?

    Comparing MSD diagrams is notoriously a bad idea. Canon ship reference is either printed material or what we see for models on screen in comparison to known ships. I.E. In TNG we have clear scaling reference in 3 episodes that put the Oberth at roughly 300m. Excelsiors are always seen on screen as much smaller than the Galaxy, not 42m only. So printed material fits what we see in the models. the MSD is always off, and never even agreed with set canon, often having the wrong number of decks or locations of key spaces compared to what was known to be true. So again, Cryptic took liberties with the sizes of ships as a T6 connie is NOT slightly larger than a galaxy warp nacelle.
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