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Are players incapable of fighting the Tzenkethi in space?

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  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    I think it's here I should post this. Someone was asking what I've got ON my ship, so here's a screen of the gear I'm using.

    Um, seriously, you need to do something about that build. It's like you went out of your way to find pieces, all over your inventory, that do not match at all. You have one of those Protonic Tact consoles?! Why!? What weapon uses Proton dmg on your build?! There's only one weapon in game (which isn't an Experimental wep) that uses Proton, namely the Dyson Proton Weapon (from the Protonic Arsenal set), but you don't have it slotted. And it's been so long, after I switched to Locators, but is that a Phaser or a Disruptor Tact console? I'm going to assume Phaser, for my own sanity. :) And what's with the Nukara console? Or the Delta rep one? (for the Neutronic set). And is that the Trellium (sp?) console? You don't need it.

    Start by doing what echatty said: get the Quantum Phase torp, to match the console. Or, in your case probably better, get the Quantum Beam instead, and just don't do torps. Get rid of the Bio-Neural Gel Pack (or go full Polaron, with the Neutronic Torpedo Launcher or Beam; but not both). You can get all these from doing missions. Put nothing in your Tact consoles but Phaser-boosting consoles; preferably Vulnerability Locators, of course. The Temporal Disentanglement Suite is actually always nice to have, but your overall CrtH/CrtD situation is dismal to begin with. You'll want the blue, male Embassy boffs for SRO-like stats, to at least crank up your CrtH. And slot the rep CrtH Trait.

    I know you said earlier, that you chose most of these consoles for defense purposes. And I get that: lotsa shield boosts going on. But with this build, you're going to lose a war of attrition, regardless. The concept you're after (being a super-turtle) just doesn't get you anywhere. Make a more synergized build: choose a weapon type (Phaser, I presume), and stick with that. Then build around doing Phaser dmg. And maybe slot the (free) DOMINO console too, if you acquired it earlier.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 10,918 Arc User
    I think it's here I should post this. Someone was asking what I've got ON my ship, so here's a screen of the gear I'm using.

    Ouch, that's going to take a lot of work.

    Let's start with the most basic question though.. is this the best ship you have access to? You don't have any T6 ships? No Event Ships? nothing? That's the freebie T5, you have to have something better then that right?
    Insert witty signature line here.
  • nimbullnimbull Member Posts: 1,564 Arc User
    I'll post what I have for my human tac phaser captain. It's not perfect but hopefully it can be some help.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Quantum_Phase_Catalysts
    Beam array and console (Looks like you have the console already, just get the beam array) "Sunrise" mission. Grab torpedo till you can get next item.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Agony_Phaser_Energy_Torpedo_Launcher
    Ditch your other torpedoes for this when you can get it again. It runs off your phaser damage consoles.

    Crafted phaser beam arrays. Five should do. Go for [CrtD] and [Pen] on the modifiers if you can get em cheap that way. Use re-engineering to adjust bad modifiers.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Trilithium-Laced_Weaponry
    Grab the 360 phaser array for this set from the "Beyond the Nexus" mission. It's a beauty to have and grab a crafted 360 phaser array from the auction.

    Your tac consoles should be fully slotted with phaser damage consoles. This gives your weapons the most bang for their buck unless you are doing something science specific. If you can get fleet level tac console go for vulnerability locators that do phaser damage.

    Make sure your weapon power is set to max. Go in and make minor adjustments lowering the power till weapon power starts to deplete. Keep it set to "just at max" so you aren't dumping in to much power and not over doing it wasting extra power beyond max when you don't need to.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Romulan_Singularity_Harness
    Snag the zero point energy console, it's yummy from the romulan rep.

    https://sto.gamepedia.com/Omega_Adapted_Borg_Technology_Set
    Snag the console from the borg rep, it's just as yummy.

    Roughly this setup will give you a total of 5 beams in the forward arc (3 front regulars and 2 omnis) to pound things with. Broad siding will give you all your arrays. You could go without a torpedo till you can pick up the phaser based torpedo when it pops up again sometime from an event or phoenix box update.

    Like I said it's not perfect but I've made those changes to my tac human on a beam boat and it helped make a difference. Plain Jane red alerts can help you farm up the rep/marks for rep stuff quick.
    Green people don't have to be.... little.
  • vetteguy904vetteguy904 Member Posts: 3,853 Arc User
    it's not just the queues. I'm running a new toon, mk x vr/ur gear in the Chimera. in the cardassin arc, the galors are eating hull thrugh full shields.. a Chimera with 2 heavy cannons rapis fire 3 plus a phaser and a wuant torpedo ts3 and he is eating my hull through shields faster than i am with his shields down. it's like the cardis now have Pen x3 on all ther weapons
    Spock.jpg

  • sennahcheribsennahcherib Member Posts: 2,823 Arc User
    it's not just the queues. I'm running a new toon, mk x vr/ur gear in the Chimera. in the cardassin arc, the galors are eating hull thrugh full shields.. a Chimera with 2 heavy cannons rapis fire 3 plus a phaser and a wuant torpedo ts3 and he is eating my hull through shields faster than i am with his shields down. it's like the cardis now have Pen x3 on all ther weapons

    the galor uses a sci skill, name forgotten but this skil refract your attacks
  • tilartatilarta Member Posts: 1,798 Arc User
    coldnapalm wrote: »
    Fun fact...they can't shoot protomatter torps when they are destroyed.

    Yes, when they are destroyed.
    Up until that moment they'll keep producing protomatter torpedoes.
    And since the torpedoes are an independent object, I assume they'll keep going towards the planet even if the ship that produced them is no longer around.

    Which is what confused me, there were at least 3 other ships focussing on the final Dreadnaught and it wasn't getting removed fast enough to stop the stream of torpedoes I was chasing.

    Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
    Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad :'(
  • echattyechatty Member Posts: 5,914 Arc User
    Listen to coldnapalm, he may sound harsh, but he speaks the truth.
    Now a LTS and loving it.
    Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
    I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything. :D
  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 10,918 Arc User
    edited July 2018
    I did use A2Batt for a while, but didn't find it made much of a difference to anything.

    I could tell you why that is. Because you said you weren't running any Duty Officers.

    All the A2B power does is take your aux power and route it to your other 3 systems. By itself it's an ok ability just for keeping power up, but it's real power comes from having 3 Technicians on your active space roster. When these are slotted, clicking on Aux2Bat lowers your cooldown on ALL bridge Officer abilities. Aside from giving you power, it makes every single bridge officer ability (Tactical, Engineering, and Science) all cool down faster. If you have 3 purple ones (which you can get for free from B'Tran Cluster) every click of Aux2Bat lowers cool down by 30%. With 2 copies of Aux2Bat slotted, you keep everything at global (15 second) cool down. That means you never have to wait more then 15 seconds for any bridge officer ability. That sir, is very powerful.

    Then if you go even further and slot the 'Cold Hearted' trait from the Breen Plesh Tral Heavy Raider then everytime you use Aux2Bat it also debuffs and weakens your enemies. You get power, you get cooldown reduction, and you get a damage boost to your enemies. This is why Aux2Bat is currently so desirable.

    The key is using it at the right time to keep a constant rotation of abilities. So when you enter combat, you hit emergency power to weapons, then your attack pattern, tac team, kemocite/distributed targeting if applicable, and any other offensive rotation buffs like Override Subsystem Safeties, whatever. Once you have your powers chained, hit Fire At Will/Scatter Volley to spread it all around and then the very last thing you do is hit Aux2Bat. You want to do it as the last step in your rotation so that you reduce the cooldown on everything you just used. Once powers start to come off cooldown, you trigger them again, followed by Aux2Bat.. that's an example of a power 'rotation.' In my case, I mix in Emergency Power to Shields as Napalm mentioned for the Shield Hardness buff so every other rotation I swap between Weapons/Shields. You can also swap powers on rotation like Cannon Scatter Volley for large groups or if you're facing one bigger opponent use Rapid Fire instead.

    Aux2Bat makes quite a difference, you just have to understand how to use it. Like anything in STO it's a technique that takes practice. ColdNapalm has given you some really good advice, there will always be reasons to say 'I can't,' but if that's the case then that's ok, but you need to understand that you will always struggle in combat. If altering your build requires you to divert resources from pouring everything into your fleet, then you would be best served to do that temporarily. Build up your ship in an A2B setup with a solid rotation and you will have a better experience in combat and you'll be able to earn better rewards quicker. Divert resources now, so that you can gain faster later. The build you have is honestly a dead end, and you're going to continue to struggle and get frustrated. Games take time by design, if you're going to improve your setup it's going to take time and effort. There is no answer that makes you better right now today, for free. It's either going to cost you time or money. The advice given on this forum is almost always designed toward time as very few of us encourage trying to fix issues by throwing money at the issue. You just have to put in the time and you'll reap the rewards. Grab a few Green Technicians off the exchange and give it a shot, you have nothing to lose. :smile:
    Insert witty signature line here.
  • echattyechatty Member Posts: 5,914 Arc User
    If you think Mk XII is a difference, wait till you can get them to Mk XIV or XV. That jump of a few Mk points, even at VR, is very noticeable.

    I was skeptical of this until I actually took the time to upgrade one of my favorite toons and saw how well he fared after that. All of his gear is still Mk XIV UR or Epic with some VR mixed in, and he can swim through most content.
    Now a LTS and loving it.
    Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
    I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything. :D
  • vetteguy904vetteguy904 Member Posts: 3,853 Arc User
    annnnnd doublecheck that the game did not unload your traits.
    Spock.jpg

  • echattyechatty Member Posts: 5,914 Arc User
    Oh, most definitely! I have to check my traits sometimes. And they would be unslotted and I'd have to slot them back up.
    Now a LTS and loving it.
    Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
    I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything. :D
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,569 Arc User
    My Jem'Hadar Gamma Recruit had all Ground and Space Personal Traits unloaded after I had that forced Respec.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 10,918 Arc User
    I check my traits on a regular basis.. more then once I have had them unslotted for no apparent reason. Recently, the Cold Hearted trait likes to deselect itself on 2 of my alts.. very handy 'feature.' :smiley:
    Insert witty signature line here.
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    coldnapalm wrote: »
    Hehe...traits unloading is not nearly as fun as having you keybind toolbars get scrambled.
    Which, unfortunately, happens every time you get a new ship. :frowning:
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User

    I could tell you why that is. Because you said you weren't running any Duty Officers.

    All the A2B power does is take your aux power and route it to your other 3 systems. By itself it's an ok ability just for keeping power up, but it's real power comes from having 3 Technicians on your active space roster. When these are slotted, clicking on Aux2Bat lowers your cooldown on ALL bridge Officer abilities. Aside from giving you power, it makes every single bridge officer ability (Tactical, Engineering, and Science) all cool down faster. If you have 3 purple ones (which you can get for free from B'Tran Cluster) every click of Aux2Bat lowers cool down by 30%. With 2 copies of Aux2Bat slotted, you keep everything at global (15 second) cool down. That means you never have to wait more then 15 seconds for any bridge officer ability. That sir, is very powerful.

    Then if you go even further and slot the 'Cold Hearted' trait from the Breen Plesh Tral Heavy Raider then everytime you use Aux2Bat it also debuffs and weakens your enemies. You get power, you get cooldown reduction, and you get a damage boost to your enemies. This is why Aux2Bat is currently so desirable.

    The key is using it at the right time to keep a constant rotation of abilities. So when you enter combat, you hit emergency power to weapons, then your attack pattern, tac team, kemocite/distributed targeting if applicable, and any other offensive rotation buffs like Override Subsystem Safeties, whatever. Once you have your powers chained, hit Fire At Will/Scatter Volley to spread it all around and then the very last thing you do is hit Aux2Bat. You want to do it as the last step in your rotation so that you reduce the cooldown on everything you just used. Once powers start to come off cooldown, you trigger them again, followed by Aux2Bat.. that's an example of a power 'rotation.' In my case, I mix in Emergency Power to Shields as Napalm mentioned for the Shield Hardness buff so every other rotation I swap between Weapons/Shields. You can also swap powers on rotation like Cannon Scatter Volley for large groups or if you're facing one bigger opponent use Rapid Fire instead.

    Aux2Bat makes quite a difference, you just have to understand how to use it. Like anything in STO it's a technique that takes practice. ColdNapalm has given you some really good advice, there will always be reasons to say 'I can't,' but if that's the case then that's ok, but you need to understand that you will always struggle in combat. If altering your build requires you to divert resources from pouring everything into your fleet, then you would be best served to do that temporarily. Build up your ship in an A2B setup with a solid rotation and you will have a better experience in combat and you'll be able to earn better rewards quicker. Divert resources now, so that you can gain faster later. The build you have is honestly a dead end, and you're going to continue to struggle and get frustrated. Games take time by design, if you're going to improve your setup it's going to take time and effort. There is no answer that makes you better right now today, for free. It's either going to cost you time or money. The advice given on this forum is almost always designed toward time as very few of us encourage trying to fix issues by throwing money at the issue. You just have to put in the time and you'll reap the rewards. Grab a few Green Technicians off the exchange and give it a shot, you have nothing to lose. :smile:

    What a great sum up of the aux2bat mechanic. It is really funny that such an easy to implement mechanic for universal cooldown of bridge officer ability is back in 2018 big time. Among the performance player almost everybody seems to be using it at the moment.

    Hope you follow this advice @colonelmarik.
    animated.gif
    Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,569 Arc User
    Yeah, last night I ran 'Home' again for the Weekly on my Gamma Recruit. After getting clobbered quite a few times, I checked my Traits. All Ship Mastery and Personal Ground and Space Traits had been unloaded. I was stuck until the Episode completed.

    My fault, I had respeced again earlier in the Week and neglected to verify this again. Not that I should have to, but such is as it is.

    And I know I could have left the Episode, respeced and continued. I really didn't want to go through that ground portion again.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    Just do Borg and Tholian Red Alerts, get them done in about 10 mins combined and convert the marks to whatever item you need. More marks, nearly instant queues and they actually get completed.

    This here is, in my opinion, exactly the point.

    "Are players incapable of fighting the Tzenkethi in space?" - no, not in all cases. However, I maintain the opinion that 'capability' isn't really the issue.

    Unpopular as this opinion may be, so long as queues such as CCA and ISA offer generous rewards for little effort (and no queue wait time) nothing else is going to 'stick' in any meaningful way.

    What a surprising move to bridge the OP’s difficulty to acquire Tzenkethi elite currency to your despise of ISA and CCA being popular maps.

    Lol yep that’s it! One way or the other ISA and CCA, which both don’t reward Protomatter Containers by the way, need to go.

    Then all problems players at the Tzenkethi front may encounter will come to an end.

    Simple logic. :D
    animated.gif
    Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 10,918 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    Just do Borg and Tholian Red Alerts, get them done in about 10 mins combined and convert the marks to whatever item you need. More marks, nearly instant queues and they actually get completed.

    This here is, in my opinion, exactly the point.

    "Are players incapable of fighting the Tzenkethi in space?" - no, not in all cases. However, I maintain the opinion that 'capability' isn't really the issue.

    Unpopular as this opinion may be, so long as queues such as CCA and ISA offer generous rewards for little effort (and no queue wait time) nothing else is going to 'stick' in any meaningful way.

    What a surprising move to bridge the OP’s difficulty to acquire Tzenkethi elite currency to your despise of ISA and CCA being popular maps.

    Lol yep that’s it! One way or the other ISA and CCA, which both don’t reward Protomatter Containers by the way, need to go.

    Then all problems players at the Tzenkethi front may encounter will come to an end.

    Simple logic. :D

    Agreed, an all to familiar rant that has really gotten old.
    Insert witty signature line here.
This discussion has been closed.