What is "Armor Rating"????

where2r1

OK...reviewing the STO Wiki page about Modifiers in the game, you know, for this Re-engineering that is up and coming. And came across this description of the modifier [Pen] :

[Pen] Ignore Armor Rating.....All attacks with this weapon ignore 10 Armor Rating

Is "Armor Rating" the same as "Damage Resistance Rating"?

Why is there 2 (or more) ways to describe the same thing in this game? It gets very confusing when one is looking at details.

Link: https://sto.gamepedia.com/Modifier

Added link....don't eat my post, Vanilla. (Have they fixed this yet??)

where2r1

Some screen shots I thought might bring this together...but it really isn't...

This is from the Skill Tree.... HULL PENETRATION skill:



This mentions Armor penetration is related to this particular skill.
Which points to "Armor Rating" (term used to describe modifier [Pen] on weapons) being related to the hull.
But not if "Armor Rating" is the same as "Damage Resistance Rating" on hulls.


This is from the Ship Status page...under Engineering Skill Based stats:



From where I can see there are a couple of different "Damage Resistance Ratings" associated to hull.

But it does not really tell me if "Armor Rating" that I am seeing on [Pen] on is "Damage Resistance Rating".
Or what the heck??? Is "Armor Rating" for NPCs....and "Damage Resistance Rating" for Players?

(I think I need to quit reading both PvE and PvP "build" info on STO Builds. LOL!)

odinforever20000

where2r1 wrote: »

Some screen shots I thought might bring this together...but it really isn't...

This is from the Skill Tree.... HULL PENETRATION skill:



This mentions Armor penetration is related to this particular skill.
Which points to "Armor Rating" (term used to describe modifier [Pen] on weapons) being related to the hull.
But not if "Armor Rating" is the same as "Damage Resistance Rating" on hulls.


This is from the Ship Status page...under Engineering Skill Based stats:



From where I can see there are a couple of different "Damage Resistance Ratings" associated to hull.

But it does not really tell me if "Armor Rating" that I am seeing on [Pen] on is "Damage Resistance Rating".
Or what the heck??? Is "Armor Rating" for NPCs....and "Damage Resistance Rating" for Players?

(I think I need to quit reading both PvE and PvP "build" info on STO Builds. LOL!)

You are right. There are 2 Damage Res Ratings.. 1 that affects all Energy and the other that affects Kenetic and Physical (this is where sci magics do all the damage)

Armor Pen is the Superior version of Hull pen. So the Pen mod is applied for that weapon only for Hull resistances. Its a hull resistance debuff..Like other resistance debuffs but for weapons only (as opposed to stuff that includes sci damage abilities)

So the Pen mod is enough to overcome 100 points of hull resistance (which I think is 2-5% hull res on my ship)..But Players cycling though Hazard Emitters and other abilities that add Hull res will not be overcome with just the Pen mod. Most PVP players start at 50% All resistance which is going to take alot more than -10 Armor Res to over come.

Just as an example..My Dyson Sci Destroyer hits 87% hull rez when I activate the Advance Metaphasic Shields (+600 All Damage Bonus Resistance Rating)..And around 92% Hull rez when combined with Auxiliary Power Configuration - Defense and the Ablative Generator Console on my Pathfinder for 1500 All Damage Bonus Resistance Rating

Given I do mostly sci damage...Anything that reduces All Damage Resistances and Kenetic or Physical resistances is a benefit to me..Armor Pen Typically benefits Energy and certain Kinetic weapons (when Energy is not clearly stated).

https://sto.gamepedia.com/Skill:_Hull_Penetration

They try to show other items that boost this skill..

disqord

Armor Rating = Damage Resistance Rating.

Thread closed.

odinforever20000

> @disqord#9557 said:
> Armor Rating = Damage Resistance Rating.
>
> Thread closed.

Lol very succinct

postinggum

There was some very detailed maths claiming that pen and damage resistance reduction were not entering the final damage calculation in the same way. A couple of years later and that sort of work testing tends not to be happening.

odinforever20000

... You know those were dedicated players who spent alot of time figuring that stuff out..

Probably on Hiatus or moved on with all that work spent..Its just a game..

postinggum

The point semed to be that on a point for point basis pen was way better than damage resistance reduction, similar to different categories of weapon boost but this time describing the target rather than damage dealer.

where2r1

Sorry....getting all caught up in the Anniversary Farming Event, now.
I have not had time to do any further studying on the video game ships.

This would be twice I have had to put off all this Hull and Resistance stuff. Once due to in game Events taking my time...and once due to Holidays in real life. Oh well... I shall have to get back to understanding the video game, one day.

Understanding how the video game ships work is more interesting than the battles themselves for me. BUT I am still making an effort to learn it. To that effect, I am leveling up new characters and will keep clear of Specializations. Set up the skill tree as simple as possible, turn off traits, lower level gear, etc....so it will be easier to see things happening.

postinggum wrote: »

There was some very detailed maths claiming that pen and damage resistance reduction were not entering the final damage calculation in the same way. A couple of years later and that sort of work testing tends not to be happening.

Did they post this stuff on STO Builds on Reddit? Or on the STO Forums, somewhere?
I know a lot of stuff got posted here when Virusdancer was asking about it back in 2013-14 or so.
I don't know how relevant that stuff is any more, though.

Thanks for your time.

tunebreaker

https://www.reddit.com/r/stobuilds/comments/4br0n1/on_the_subject_of_damage_resistance/

Hopefully this helps you.

postinggum

There was reddit stuff and links to docs.

frtoaster

postinggum wrote: »

The point semed to be that on a point for point basis pen was way better than damage resistance reduction, similar to different categories of weapon boost but this time describing the target rather than damage dealer.

I'm not sure if this is what you're talking about, but years ago, rbaker82 discovered that there were two types of damage resistance debuff. It was very confusing, and I'm still amazed that he was able to reverse-engineer the math. Later, some other players discovered that there was a third type. If I remember correctly, this was all fixed during the skill revamp, so now there's only one type of damage resistance debuff. All of this is explained in the link that tunebreaker posted.

tunebreaker wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/stobuilds/comments/4br0n1/on_the_subject_of_damage_resistance/

Hopefully this helps you.

where2r1 wrote: »

Did they post this stuff on STO Builds on Reddit? Or on the STO Forums, somewhere?
I know a lot of stuff got posted here when Virusdancer was asking about it back in 2013-14 or so.
I don't know how relevant that stuff is any more, though.

Here's the forum thread where rbaker82 first talked about the different types of damage resistance debuff:

http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1156047/damage-resistance-magnitude-debuffs-injuries-and-bonus-resistance

The reddit thread by Talon42 has more updated information.

postinggum

Within that reddit post is a google spreadsheet showing that pen and damage resistance debuff are essentially equal, unless its been changed again.