Ship gear resisting tractor beams

lordmalak1

Does anyone have any data regarding a ships ability to resist tractoring based on what consoles are installed ? I know powers will break tractors but can a ship be hardened against tractoring by installing certain consoles, and by how much ? Are tractors affected by the attackers ability to target me ?

shookyang

Passives? No, I don't think anything can stop a tractor (maybe the KHG shields).

Consoloes with abilities?

AMS, Barrier Field (if they are behind you), Breen dissipator (lucky AUX disable), Impulse Capicitor Cell (?, if tractors are slows and not holds, you may be able to slowly get out of range?), Mag Overload, Phase Shift Generator?, Photonic Displacer?, and Tipler comes to mind.

lordmalak1

The tooltip for inertial dampeners says "improves the resistance to Hold, Disable, Knock and Slow effects" but it doesn't say how much for each mark or rarity against what level of ability. And the KHG shield doesn't seem to affect tractor resists at all.

I just don't want to pull off field generators to find out if they're effective at all.

borgresearcher

chainning apo, ph, or jamming/scrambling the guy would do it, tractor beam is effective but there are too much ways to disable it, increasing the speed will do it too, keeping yourself arround 5km far from the guy during the battle will give you an advantage too,

there are deflectors with lots of inertial dampers, and there are the inertial dampers science consoles,

AMS, Barrier Field (if they are behind you), Breen dissipator (lucky AUX disable), Impulse Capicitor Cell (?, if tractors are slows and not holds, you may be able to slowly get out of range?), Mag Overload, Phase Shift Generator?, Photonic Displacer?, and Tipler comes to mind.

disabling the guy will brake the tractor beam i think, so photonic shockwave, nadeon detonator and trics shall do it too
khg jamming disables the tractor i think

and note that aux to dampers doesnt give immunity to tractor beams, however, the extra flight speed can help getting out of one

lordmalak1

Chaining powers against tractor mine spammers isn't my first choice.

borgresearcher

those mines are only usefull if timed well, the tractor is super weak, and you can take them out easelly too, i wouldnt concern about tractor beam mines, i would concern about tractor beam builds, which you will be able to counter only if you use 2 copies of apo or at least 1 ph and some inertial dampers

lordmalak1

Would it be safe to assume that a lvl 51 tractor mine hold can be broken with a starship inertial dampener skill of 54+ (Lvl 3) ?

I'm trying to get an understanding of how the numbers relate.

antoniosalieri

I damp in the skill tree is supposed to resist tractors... however I believe it is none functional. Which is pretty comical.

mimey2

I've always kinda noticed that it seems like Dampeners resists the speed part of a tractor more, but I've always never had it resist the turn-rate part of the tractor, I still pretty much fly in a straight line because of those stupid things.

lordmalak1

antoniosalieri wrote: »

I damp in the skill tree is supposed to resist tractors... however I believe it is none functional. Which is pretty comical.

<facepalm>
Figures.

lascaille

blubb, forget it. you asked for an ability

shookyang

lordmalak1 wrote: »

The tooltip for inertial dampeners says "improves the resistance to Hold, Disable, Knock and Slow effects" but it doesn't say how much for each mark or rarity against what level of ability. And the KHG shield doesn't seem to affect tractor resists at all.

I just don't want to pull off field generators to find out if they're effective at all.

The devs awhile ago said that the description was not correct. It pretty much reduces, if I recall, the knockback and disable effects from things like tricobalts.

In any case, it's very useless for the amount of expertise that it costs.

EDIT: Can't find the original post (might have been archived when they merged the accounts), but here's a post on describing what Inertial Dampeners does and does not: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=6687171&postcount=84

I believe it was based off what was said by a Dev.

lordmalak1

Hmmm, OK since Graviton generators say they increase the effects of tractor beam, can I assume that the tooltip for countermeasure system saying it aids placate abilities (i.e. scramble sensors) is true ?

..since Inertial dampeners tooltip is wrong ?

...Sorry guys, I had no idea how broken some of this equipment actually is. Maybe I should just turn and vap they guys aux power system and be done with it. (snicker: viral matrix)

virusdancer

Somebody actually made the claim in OPvP the other day that 9 in Inertial actually increases the Repel of PSW... not sure if they were trying to pull somebody's leg, but they were making a pretty convincing argument based around how Cryptic redid the skill trees and very little has been quite what one would expect in many circumstances...

guriphu

anything that boosts Inertial Dampeners, the KHG shield, and antimatter spread will all help against tractor beams.

bareel

I'm surprised no one uses TBR for that purpose. Should work well against denoobs unless of course if the tractor still holds even if you get distance which I actually think it might not positive.

lordmalak1

guriphu wrote: »

anything that boosts Inertial Dampeners, the KHG shield, and antimatter spread will all help against tractor beams.

Are you sure ?
At this point I'm not sure the ID skill works and nobody had confirmed that the ID item has any real relation to the ID skill.

I wonder how well those threat scaling ID consoles are selling at the embassy store.

rmy1081

bareel wrote: »

I'm surprised no one uses TBR for that purpose. Should work well against denoobs unless of course if the tractor still holds even if you get distance which I actually think it might not positive.

I sometimes use TBR on my MVAE; however, if someone uses APO while tractoring you, TBR is almost useless. PSW is nice against tractors also, but it dosnt seem to have the range to get ones at the edge of a tractor's range.

shookyang

lordmalak1 wrote: »

Hmmm, OK since Graviton generators say they increase the effects of tractor beam, can I assume that the tooltip for countermeasure system saying it aids placate abilities (i.e. scramble sensors) is true ?

..since Inertial dampeners tooltip is wrong ?

...Sorry guys, I had no idea how broken some of this equipment actually is. Maybe I should just turn and vap they guys aux power system and be done with it. (snicker: viral matrix)

To be specific, Graviton Generators works with increasing the Slow amount on Tractor Beams (it's not an actual hold ability, it's a speed and turn debuff). http://www.stowiki.org/Tractor_Beam

My fleet mate has tons of points into Graviton Generators, and he actually overcomes my APO1. Very annoying.

As far as I know, Inertial Dampeners is the only ability that has an incorrect text information. If Inertial Dampeners was working, the amount it reduces the Slow amount is very minor. Not nearly enough to reduce the amount that you're being hit with.

lordmalak1

shookyang wrote: »

To be specific, Graviton Generators works with increasing the Slow amount on Tractor Beams (it's not an actual hold ability, it's a speed and turn debuff). http://www.stowiki.org/Tractor_Beam

My fleet mate has tons of points into Graviton Generators, and he actually overcomes my APO1. Very annoying.

As far as I know, Inertial Dampeners is the only ability that has an incorrect text information. If Inertial Dampeners was working, the amount it reduces the Slow amount is very minor. Not nearly enough to reduce the amount that you're being hit with.

Hmmm, that does make sense since the tractor beam is in effect a graviton projector device but it's rather disheartening to know that an unslotted device (tractor beam) can be augmented by a slotted device (Graviton generator), operated by a DOFF with tractor skills, all multiplied by the captains skill in gravitons and can't be countered or mitigated except by debuff strip performed by a DOFF (presumably operating an unslotted, non-existing device) or some other attack on the tractoring ship that knocks their targeting computers offline as a side effect.

I think it's more likely that the ID tooltip is correct and that the device isn't working as the devs intended and they're using the old 'tooltip is wrong' excuse to avoid fixing it, like the [borg] suffix to all the weapons in the old STF store.

shookyang

lordmalak1 wrote: »

Hmmm, that does make sense since the tractor beam is in effect a graviton projector device but it's rather disheartening to know that an unslotted device (tractor beam) can be augmented by a slotted device (Graviton generator), operated by a DOFF with tractor skills, all multiplied by the captains skill in gravitons and can't be countered or mitigated except by debuff strip performed by a DOFF (presumably operating an unslotted, non-existing device) or some other attack on the tractoring ship that knocks their targeting computers offline as a side effect.

I think it's more likely that the ID tooltip is correct and that the device isn't working as the devs intended and they're using the old 'tooltip is wrong' excuse to avoid fixing it, like the [borg] suffix to all the weapons in the old STF store.

It's certainly possible that the tooltip is actually correct, and Graviton Generators:Inertial Dampeners is not a 1:1 ratio.

ocp001

IIRC, 9 ranks in ID is supposed to produce a 50% resist in the slow component of TB1. However in practice people tend to get multi-tractor beamed negating any benefit from the skill.

There is a spreadsheet in the ship building thread sticky that breaks down the benefits based on a test nebula. It's not 100% for every scenario but it's a pretty good base.

Alsoif you've got the engineer slots, you can chain aux to ID for complete tractor/repel immunity, but like aux2batt builds it has it's downsides (minimal aux.)

There is also a DOFF that adds an additional amount of ID when using EptE.

seakrakken

It would seem that using PH1 is the most practical solution.:(

virusdancer

seakrakken wrote: »

It would seem that using PH1 is the most practical solution.:(

There was a nifty discussion about it in the shuttle thread that was obliterated...even though the information there was irrefutable.

mimey2

ocp001 wrote: »

Alsoif you've got the engineer slots, you can chain aux to ID for complete tractor/repel immunity, but like aux2batt builds it has it's downsides (minimal aux.)

Actually I'd like to say that notion is false. Aux to ID doesn't drain your aux power like A2B does.

It does provide immunity to disable and repels though. Presuming it's working that is.

shookyang

Looking at it closer, APO1 is supposed to resist movement debuffs for 15 seconds.

However, my fleet mate's tractor beams (with as much gear as possible to increase Graviton Generators) overcome my APO. Not sure how this is possible, unless APO1 doesn't have a movement debuff resistance and it is only APO3 that does (like the wiki says).

ocp001

mimey2 wrote: »

Actually I'd like to say that notion is false. Aux to ID doesn't drain your aux power like A2B does.

It does provide immunity to disable and repels though. Presuming it's working that is.

Which is why I gave it a IIRC in the beginning. :rolleyes: But thanks for the correction. The biggest downside as I somewhat eluded to is that you get much better DPS with aux2bat and technicians than the immunity from auxID. Although if you're perhaps building a heal boat then cycling auxID could be very useful to prevent getting pushed out of range or stuck. The minor boost to turn rate is also a bonus.

I may have to try this with a fleet galaxy or star cruiser. HE, ET3, TSS, ES3 (or some-such).

lostusthorn

Well, maybe it is a sign how bad this set is,
but the Breen set does provide tractor resits.

p2wsucks

Regarding gear the KHG engines have a restart off a engine disable, I don't know if TBs count as such or if it works.

KHG shields placat proc may do it.

Romulan Rep placate proc may do it assuming you have high crit value and volume of hits/time.

Regarding TBR as pet TB counter, it depends how much spam is in the area. In spam heavy matches it's not dependable since TBR has a limit of how many things it'll push.

High engine power preset/Eng batt w/evasives should do it unless you're movement is subjected to other stacking debuffs. There are times high engine power is enough depending on the velocity of tackler vs your velocity they can overun you (they can reapply it if they catch up again though).

A decently buffed CVS1 usually will clear the pets that spam TBs, again depending on how many spammers are in the match it may not be enough by itself.

Aux drains/disables are another alternative.

lordmalak1

I didn't notice any tractor resist ability on the KHG shield tho it may simply make the slow a little less effective. Was hoping to get tractored last night to test the antimatter spread but nobody would. I sure hate to carry that panic button but the PH option on a raptor isn't practical if it means giving up HE.