Poor Catalyst - 20 TW's This weekend
ZSin - Harshlands
Posts: 20 Arc User
I dont know if anyone else has posted the Harshlands Tw map for 1/27/12 but when i got on this afternoon i was like lol. Check it out, they are going to have a fun weekend.
http://imageshack.us/f/815/20120127165842.png/
http://imageshack.us/f/815/20120127165842.png/
Post edited by ZSin - Harshlands on
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post a pic of the aftermath too please after the weekend is over
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Will do
I wonder if this has happened before. In all the years ive been here ive never seen a tw on this scale before.0 -
they'll defend em all gracefully, they are currently the most organised group of people you can have for tw in that server. gl to the other factions.b:bye[SIGPIC]www.spades.tw[/SIGPIC]
b:cute0 -
Theres 7 factions that they might have to worry about (considering they have 4-5 tws at a time), its a shame that crimson didnt bid on them.0
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See, this is what makes me wonder how a territory can hold the whole map. Its easy to get blitzed by multipul factions and be unable to defend all the territories.0
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hiddenmonkey wrote: »See, this is what makes me wonder how a territory can hold the whole map. Its easy to get blitzed by multipul factions and be unable to defend all the territories.
You can have at most 3 wars going on at once. With so many bad guilds sometimes a single party is all you need (in antihero's case 1 person). If you want to take down a guild it's probably better to have only the best 3 guilds bid to stack the wars.0 -
Berserker_ - Dreamweaver wrote: »they'll defend em all gracefully, they are currently the most cash shopped group of people you can have for tw in that server. gl to the other factions.b:bye
Fixed that for you.
They're not "organized". It's the same op'd geared people as it was the LAST time the map was already taken over. This time our two (second) largest TWing factions were so **** hurt over past conflicts they failed to do anything about it until the problem became too large to handle.
I see this week's TW sort of like this---
Dear Catalyst,
~removed~
Love, Harshlands
EDIT: Z, some ingenious individual up in the Crimson chain of command decided it would be a wonderful idea to ally with Catalyst...because it worked SO well for Kylin, I mean. [/sarcasm]They made fun of me because I wasn't a R8 Psychic...and then came third cast. It's not funny anymore.
Reason 88 to buy a makeover scroll:
gomba: "Your butt looks like an eggplant."
Q_Q0 -
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_Petal_ - Harshlands wrote: »Fixed that for you.
They're not "organized". It's the same op'd geared people as it was the LAST time the map was already taken over. This time our two (second) largest TWing factions were so **** hurt over past conflicts they failed to do anything about it until the problem became too large to handle.
I see this week's TW sort of like this---
Dear Catalyst,
~removed~
Love, Harshlands
EDIT: Z, some ingenious individual up in the Crimson chain of command decided it would be a wonderful idea to ally with Catalyst...because it worked SO well for Kylin, I mean. [/sarcasm]
y u so mad and idiotic?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
it really doesn't matter how many factions "stack" catalyst the max tw at a single time is three and i doubt any three of them are gonna be any harder than lets say a crim tw. When you have all the best geared people in a single faction vs a server with mediocre gear..really no chance at the moment.0
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Yeah, Catalyst are terrible players with no organization and have just been getting lucky the past 3 years. (Under different names, ofc)_Petal_ - Harshlands wrote: »Fixed that for you.
They're not "organized". It's the same op'd geared people as it was the LAST time the map was already taken over. This time our two (second) largest TWing factions were so **** hurt over past conflicts they failed to do anything about it until the problem became too large to handle.
I see this week's TW sort of like this---
Dear Catalyst,
~removed~
Love, Harshlands
EDIT: Z, some ingenious individual up in the Crimson chain of command decided it would be a wonderful idea to ally with Catalyst...because it worked SO well for Kylin, I mean. [/sarcasm]Unban me.0 -
Born_Free, I'm sorry but I beg to differ.
Cata/Zulu Imo are the most organized faction that has existed on HL
At the end of this weekend my bet is that the map will look the same except without the attacking symbols, cata will defend every territory.
It is my opinion that the reason cata is so sucesssful with the map is NOT because of the way they are geared but the way they coordinate themselves during TW and their overall level of skill. Most of them are old players and many only even log on for TW. Sure the gear helps but it isnt what makes them good.
Look at back right after the map reset, Valhalla were first off the ball and got the bottom half of the map, for those of you that don't play HL, Valhalla at the time were the most CSing fac on the server and had a buttload of r9s. Cata only really started after Valhalla had taken a good third of the map and at the time much of Cata was still in r8. They forced Valhalla off the map and eventually geared up to the standard of gear they are at atm. But at the time the gear in Valhalla was a buttload better than Cata and yet Cata never lost a TW to them.0 -
The only real problem is getting enough people online for all the wars on all the days.
Even if they do successfully defend all of them this time, they can't do it forever.
It will be interesting to see the aftermath though.I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0 -
Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »The only real problem is getting enough people online for all the wars on all the days.
Even if they do successfully defend all of them this time, they can't do it forever.
It will be interesting to see the aftermath though.
Nobody's REALLY expecting cata to actually lose any lands. Most of the stacks are advantageous for Cata since half of the guilds are just fake bids. We know they're going to log themselves on for every single one of those wars, because that's what they've always done. Despite their claims I see more cata actively playing than any other faction.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I replied to the 7th topic on the 1st page of mystic forums, and got reported for necro. Plz save mystic forums.0 -
it would have been poor catalysts if frankielies checked their whole faction and sees 60% 105s in 2-3 weeks and than actually did something about it. 3 tws at the same time vs nab factions aint much...0
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get 28+ guilds to attack at once, there is only 27 slots over the 3 days, i wonder what happens0
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I believe you get 4 attacks in a slot if there are more attacks than the 3 attack/slot allows.
The real test will indeed be whether those people will get tired of defending repeatedly. This will be an annoyance especially for European players.Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
The thing is, this entire time we've been talking about how triple stacks just end up in crystal rushes for almost every single battle. These stacks aren't fun, it's just a waste of time and flat out annoying, but Cata insists and wants this to be the ONLY way for Harshlands to change anything, as evidenced by their frequent requests for stacks (even though we know it's not really viable on this server atm).
TBH I miss the battles between Mayhem and Afterlife, and Kylin vs Crimson (before half of Kylin quit). They were genuinely fun.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I replied to the 7th topic on the 1st page of mystic forums, and got reported for necro. Plz save mystic forums.0 -
Kylin hasnt quit they go inactive from dec-march every year then their core comes back and they start to rebuild.
Its a larger amount of Tws than I have seen on an active guild, so definately a step in the right direction for the server, as honestly the only way the server can win is to want to TW against us, and then forge together into a few guilds and try to win.
The problem being as we currently do not want more lands than we have you either need a guild that can 1v1 and win or 2 guilds who can both win on stacked wars or we will hold even every week on land numbers.0 -
Michael - Harshlands wrote: »Kylin hasnt quit they go inactive from dec-march every year then their core comes back and they start to rebuild.
Damn Asians and their hibernation.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Closing this for excess letter Q's" - hawk0 -
Michael - Harshlands wrote: »Kylin hasnt quit they go inactive from dec-march every year then their core comes back and they start to rebuild.
Its a larger amount of Tws than I have seen on an active guild, so definately a step in the right direction for the server, as honestly the only way the server can win is to want to TW against us, and then forge together into a few guilds and try to win.
The problem being as we currently do not want more lands than we have you either need a guild that can 1v1 and win or 2 guilds who can both win on stacked wars or we will hold even every week on land numbers.
Ok, how about this:
Doesn't it seem stupid that we have to go through a bunch of boring, crystal rush stacking bull**** just to get to what we really want: decent, evenly matched, fun TW's?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I replied to the 7th topic on the 1st page of mystic forums, and got reported for necro. Plz save mystic forums.0 -
hiddenmonkey wrote: »See, this is what makes me wonder how a territory can hold the whole map. Its easy to get blitzed by multipul factions and be unable to defend all the territories.
The other day an old Zulu who happens to be in CJr and ALSO happened to be there during Zulu's spartan week were reminiscing about how awesome that week was. That week, Zulu had a bid on practically every land possible (so more bids than Catalyst now) and only ~17 people (though for Stalkers I think we managed 21 or 22) stayed in guild and attempted to defend them just for the hell of it.
He pointed out that, to our knowledge, not a single guild we actually TRIED to defend actually beat us. Some guilds got free passes (3-4 guilds were made by Zulus themselves so Nurfed gave the word to let them win, a German guild asked me if they could have a land) and others we didn't attend, but still, 17 people and every single war we attended, we won. There was even a day where we had three wars and only three people to defend, and like total G's, we defended them solo. I wish I could remember the other two who were with me that day cause they deserve credit, but all I remember is there was a barb and an archer soloing the other two wars.
Long story short, experience is the most important part of TW, no matter what anyone says, and unfortunately Catalyst does have the most. I believe that with time and practice, a stack attempt like this could be very effective, but it may be a while before a single land is lost.
I mean, let's put it this way: CrimsonJr and DEMACIA had a war. CrimsonJr represents alts and people from EVERY guild on the server (not all, but many of course), DEMACIA was exclusively Catalyst alts. The result? A tie. A mother****ing tie; a three hour war where neither could touch the other resulting in a win for defense. Keep in mind that 90% of the players on the field are alts, so this isn't like they outgeared us. I believe iamiffy was their only r9 and we also had a r9 wiz, so pretty balanced, gear-wise. I think that should speak volumes about how people should REALLY drop the "all gear, no skill" argument.I
AGOREY0 -
Euros should love morning / afternoon wars. All Ive heard for years is how hard it is for them to show up to regular TWs b/c of of the timing. AM / Afternoon wars should be a pleasant change Id think.0
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Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »The other day an old Zulu who happens to be in CJr and ALSO happened to be there during Zulu's spartan week were reminiscing about how awesome that week was. That week, Zulu had a bid on practically every land possible (so more bids than Catalyst now) and only ~17 people (though for Stalkers I think we managed 21 or 22) stayed in guild and attempted to defend them just for the hell of it.
He pointed out that, to our knowledge, not a single guild we actually TRIED to defend actually beat us. Some guilds got free passes (3-4 guilds were made by Zulus themselves so Nurfed gave the word to let them win, a German guild asked me if they could have a land) and others we didn't attend, but still, 17 people and every single war we attended, we won. There was even a day where we had three wars and only three people to defend, and like total G's, we defended them solo. I wish I could remember the other two who were with me that day cause they deserve credit, but all I remember is there was a barb and an archer soloing the other two wars.
Long story short, experience is the most important part of TW, no matter what anyone says, and unfortunately Catalyst does have the most. I believe that with time and practice, a stack attempt like this could be very effective, but it may be a while before a single land is lost.
I mean, let's put it this way: CrimsonJr and DEMACIA had a war. CrimsonJr represents alts and people from EVERY guild on the server (not all, but many of course), DEMACIA was exclusively Catalyst alts. The result? A tie. A mother****ing tie; a three hour war where neither could touch the other resulting in a win for defense. Keep in mind that 90% of the players on the field are alts, so this isn't like they outgeared us. I believe iamiffy was their only r9 and we also had a r9 wiz, so pretty balanced, gear-wise. I think that should speak volumes about how people should REALLY drop the "all gear, no skill" argument.
While its true Catalyst has many skilled players and good TW leaders, I guess most people just disagree with the claims they are the best of the best. I would say KY had TW leaders as good as Catalyst and still has. Now we got to admit that when it comes to skill of working in teams(NOT individual), there is no guild that was as good or better than Zulu/Catalyst when Zulu era started.
To be honest its still possible to create a guild of that level, if we could get the TW leaders of KY + the best players(skillwise) of Crimson/Kylin(too bad many good players in there quit or joined cata/other guilds over the time)/Valhala/Afterlife/+some fodder guilds, we could get a guild that can rival Cata, but that still would take time cuz players would need to know each other better and learn how to play with each other. Although if they were really good, that wouldnt take more than 2 weeks to be honest. Plus, even if they achieved that in a short amount of time, then gears would come into play.
In other words, the map is doomed as long as catalyst is alive.0 -
Longie you didnt mention that you guys outnumbered us 2-1 (as we had 25-30 and you guys had 50+) and the only reason we actually managed to pull through the full 3hrs is because me and happy perditioned alot, even while I was pulling catas.
We were heavily undermanned on the ranged DD department and EPs (2 EPs in the whole war), hoping we get that sorted before the next time we attack crimjr as I dont like using 3 hp charms for 1 war lol.0 -
Michael - Harshlands wrote: »
The problem being as we currently do not want more lands than we have you either need a guild that can 1v1 and win or 2 guilds who can both win on stacked wars or we will hold even every week on land numbers.
Do not want more lands than you already have??????
Then why did Catalyst attack and take away land from Dumass?0 -
Michael - Harshlands wrote: »Kylin hasnt quit they go inactive from dec-march every year then their core comes back and they start to rebuild.
Its a larger amount of Tws than I have seen on an active guild, so definately a step in the right direction for the server, as honestly the only way the server can win is to want to TW against us, and then forge together into a few guilds and try to win.
The problem being as we currently do not want more lands than we have you either need a guild that can 1v1 and win or 2 guilds who can both win on stacked wars or we will hold even every week on land numbers.
Mike, I hate to disagree with you, but I'm disagreeing with you.
The (not fake) guilds who have the balls to bid up on Catalyst will not merge. Those of us who have decided on some issues here and there have ultimately made up our minds that a merger simply isn't possible--there's too many 'characters' and too much ego, and someone is going to be butthurt if they don't get a position...ect.
It's not an issue that other guilds are too weak, but that Catalyst itself is too strong to fight. You have guilds recruiting 100+ with groups of 60 or more players fighting against maybe around half that number...and they last no more than 10 minutes, if that.
I loathe the way I'm wording this, but we ought to take a lesson from Lost City--these enormous factions of mega-geared people aren't making TW fun...for either side, really.
I personally can't see how they can stand 7 minute crystal runs--and everybody else is sick and tired of TW not being as challenging as it was back in the day.
It's possible we could still do this if we simply agree to disagree--the subject of one major guild constantly being in control is getting old. The server really needs to figure out a way to keep (certain, I won't mention names,) people split up so this doesn't happen again...and we need to agree on that. We have the ability to make TW entertaining and challenging again--we don't need a reset to change things if we talk about it and work something out amongst ourselves.
That's what LC did....and aren't we supposed to be better than them?[SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=10327322011&dateline=1325171479[/SIGPIC]
Challenge Accepted. b:scorn0 -
Michael - Harshlands wrote: »Longie you didnt mention that you guys outnumbered us 2-1 (as we had 25-30 and you guys had 50+) and the only reason we actually managed to pull through the full 3hrs is because me and happy perditioned alot, even while I was pulling catas.
We were heavily undermanned on the ranged DD department and EPs (2 EPs in the whole war), hoping we get that sorted before the next time we attack crimjr as I dont like using 3 hp charms for 1 war lol.
Because I honestly can't say if you were. You say for example you only had 2 clerics, I'm not sure if we HAD a cleric. Think Bella was there, but can't remember cause it's been a while but pretty sure she was. 90% sure we had her and one (or two) cata barbs though, both below 100. I also don't bother looking how many we have cause...yeah CJr isn't the most serious guild. If I had to estimate I'd say we had 4x, but a lot of people left early. Either way, I have no clue how many of those were even level 100 so it's not like you can get a good measurement of the odds. Felt pretty even in my opinion though, considering we both lacked important parts. (we had no catas, you had no magic DDs)
As for your lack of magic DDs, I go back to my initial reaction: It's great you guys want to fight us and have fun, but MAYBE leaving when you know that your alts encompass almost our entire cata squad while leaving our defense squads basically untouched isn't the wisest idea. Any idiot can tell you a purely offensive TW guild vs. a purely defensive one sounds like a recipe for a 3 hour war. And sure enough, it was. b:laughI AGOREY0 -
MaidenChina - Harshlands wrote: »Mike, I hate to disagree with you, but I'm disagreeing with you.
The (not fake) guilds who have the balls to bid up on Catalyst will not merge. Those of us who have decided on some issues here and there have ultimately made up our minds that a merger simply isn't possible--there's too many 'characters' and too much ego, and someone is going to be butthurt if they don't get a position...ect.
It's not an issue that other guilds are too weak, but that Catalyst itself is too strong to fight. You have guilds recruiting 100+ with groups of 60 or more players fighting against maybe around half that number...and they last no more than 10 minutes, if that.
I loathe the way I'm wording this, but we ought to take a lesson from Lost City--these enormous factions of mega-geared people aren't making TW fun...for either side, really.
I personally can't see how they can stand 7 minute crystal runs--and everybody else is sick and tired of TW not being as challenging as it was back in the day.
It's possible we could still do this if we simply agree to disagree--the subject of one major guild constantly being in control is getting old. The server really needs to figure out a way to keep (certain, I won't mention names,) people split up so this doesn't happen again...and we need to agree on that. We have the ability to make TW entertaining and challenging again--we don't need a reset to change things if we talk about it and work something out amongst ourselves.
That's what LC did....and aren't we supposed to be better than them?
Even if Catalyst split up into 2 guilds, the same thing would happen. Its almost impossible to have 2 guilds equally strong in the top of the server right now. If Catalyst split, what about the rest of the guilds that could potentially take over like Crimson or maybe Valhala and Kylin? Thats the main problem, people would constantly leave from guild to guild and greed would make one of them get too strong and eventually take over the map like Catalyst is doing it. The only way we could balance the TW scene, is if all the strong guilds established some kind of agreement. Something like this:
All the top 4 guilds leaders and officers get together into a vent or some kind of place to talk.
Then in there, the 4 of them decide on ways to balance power of all the 4 guilds, like how many R9 each of them can have, some kind of limit to r9s.
Whoever gets more than that and break the rules, gets ganked by all other 3 and eventually kicked out of the map and whoever is the 5th strongest guilds, get the chance to also discuss with those 3 about the rules needed to keep a certain balance in the TW scene.
None of this 4 guilds gank each other, but some other guild outside those top 4 dogs can help one of those 4(So we can start making alliances have a meaning in the server). Its unfair for 2 or more of them to gank one of the other 2 unless they break the rules.
If a 5th guild as strong as those 4 emerges(different from the 5th strongest which should be CLEARLY weaker than all of those 4) and whoever it is attacking is one of those 4, once one of them is wiped out of the map, they can just get into those top4 talks.
The strongest guild should always be the one bringing everyone else together, they are some kind of presidents of the agreement.
If one of the 4 guilds happens to have players getting rank9 while they are already inside, the other 3 can have the possibility of getting a new r9 through recruitment or maybe invest guilds funds to help a player get R9 to balance things out. But if one guild gets more than 1 player that was already there without r9, to gain r9, they will need to get rid of one of them, they can just send one of their r9s to other guild(whichever of the 3 they think obtaining a r9 would benefit them or they can just send it to their allies, etc).
In the rare possibility that 2 guilds as strong as the top4 dogs appears, the talks can become between top6 instead. But if one of the top4 starts getting weaker and losing players due to that and eventually destroyed, the remaining 3 can discuss betweem themselves into helping another guild get as strong as them since with 3 left, it will be an handicap situation which isnt allowed.
Ofc more rules can be established, as long as they keep the TW scene balanced between the 4 top guilds. If a 5th as strong as those 4 emerges, the R9 requirement can be increased slightly. It doesnt matter if the R9s are full or not, it all will come down to each leader to decide the classes, how many R9s pieces, etc of those they let him. Will add some kind of excitement for the leaders and it will be more entertainning like that.
This is all just theory, I dont know if thats totally possible but would definitely bring some kind of new fun to the server and I think players in general would get more excitement from it. Although it takes too much work to do this, so Im not sure the leaders of Catalyst would go forward with this idea, but it certainly would make the TWs much more entertainning for them and you wouldnt have to use your alts to do competitive TWs. The map will never be taken by any particular guild like this since the balance in power will be similar.
Ofcourse having r8+12, ir similar gears that stand below R9 will have some kind of effect. But this will surely be a challenge for any kind of guild leader, being able to organize a guild with the necessary types of classes and people with certain types of gears that potentially be helped by the guild to give them the upper edge in TW. We will also be able to see which guilds are truly good at TW too. Instead of always complaining that the game is fked as it is, the players at the top that need TW and need to use their characters to what they built it for more efficiently, its important to make an effort towards something like this0 -
Or, you know, the devs could grow some brains and make all def wars on the time slot. This naturally ensures colorful map as well as fun TWs.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Closing this for excess letter Q's" - hawk0
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