How to make money on new update?
Comments
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The F2P players with endgame or near endgame gear now are players that were present during the golden days of farming and were able to farm their gear or accumulate a big enough capital to become successful merchants. My game husband and I used to farm a lot, but now we're living off of merchanting, with some small amounts of CS on occasion for a little boost.
They've directly nerfed a lot of farming sources, some of which were in response to China's problems that don't exist in our version. They've restricted farming instances to keys, all farming to daily quests (Hometead, UP daily, FSP daily etc.) and most materials are bound to the character.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Very much agreed here. And just as a fun little challenge related to this: try making a Level 1 character, and cut them off from all access to funds and other resources from your other characters. What you will experience is:catgirldesu wrote: »The F2P players with endgame or near endgame gear now are players that were present during the golden days of farming and were able to farm their gear or accumulate a big enough capital to become successful merchants. My game husband and I used to farm a lot, but now we're living off of merchanting, with some small amounts of CS on occasion for a little boost.
They've directly nerfed a lot of farming sources, some of which were in response to China's problems that don't exist in our version. They've restricted farming instances to keys, all farming to daily quests (Hometead, UP daily, FSP daily etc.) and most materials are bound to the character.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- Easy mode gear, charms, a mount and flyer given to you - all of which have no value to speak of
- Repair bills that are frequently if not constantly higher than the value of anything you pick up
- No money to speak of from quests
- Ultimately, in many cases lacking even the funds to teleport anywhere outside of the newbie area
This is a recurring pattern that I've noticed with the modern lowgame: the emphasis has been placed on a virtually money-free experience. Very little given, very little required (see also: the removal of coin costs for basic skills). All of which is fine... until you need to buy something with any market value whatsoever. Then suddenly it's ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ from the game and "why aren't you working harder, maybe you shouldn't have bought that single piece of fashion" from the community who, as catgirldesu established, is already firmly enough entrenched that they don't have to care.
So ultimately, it's more than endgame farming that's affected. What we're looking at is a long-term deliberate attempt by the devs to trim coins from the F2P experience in every place they can, and replace them with free junk that ultimately just railroads the experience by restricting your options as a player. The FSP change is a perfect example of this. What if I don't want war avatar C packs? What if I don't care about that and would, up until now, immediately sell those resources to people who do care, in order to buy something I actually do want?
I am very much anticipating Kalyst's communication with the devs and the results of such. Because it's not just FSP farmers that are affected - it's coin in general.Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
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There is no returning point at this stage. As has already been stated, the "I farmed my gear" people are very nice and good, but unless you farmed your character from lvl 1 to whatever state it's currently in, DURING this current patch, it's not applicable to the current state of the game. There have been plenty of ways for people to make money for free previously, but they have methodically been removed from the game over time, or like TT have become so over saturated that nobody needs the mats anymore.0
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I would disagree that there's no returning point. PWI has a lot of problems, and some of them can't be fixed short of making new servers without said problems, but I don't think this is one of them.nightmare201 wrote: »There is no returning point at this stage. As has already been stated, the "I farmed my gear" people are very nice and good, but unless you farmed your character from lvl 1 to whatever state it's currently in, DURING this current patch, it's not applicable to the current state of the game. There have been plenty of ways for people to make money for free previously, but they have methodically been removed from the game over time, or like TT have become so over saturated that nobody needs the mats anymore.
My suggestion? Introduce game mechanics that give a reliable stream of coins to the F2P crowd. As an example of how this could be done: make a daily quest that, when complete, awards a random but significant amount of coin (let's say Triumph Money x5 at 50%, Ecstasy Card x1 at 30%, Ecstasy Card x2 at 10%, Ecstasy Card x3 at 5%, Excitement Card x1 at 5%). The quest would take a reasonable amount of time to complete (say, ~30 minutes) in order to prevent most people from doing it on a dozen alts every day, and there could perhaps be a group requirement. And if you're noticing a similarity between my idea and, say, BH with higher payouts, then rest assured that's not a coincidence.
How would we offset all the new coin for the much-dreaded inflation? Two ways, both of them very simple:
1. Remove Jones and replace it with something better. The point of Jones, I assume, is to provide money for lowbies, right? But your average lowbie doesn't make a dozen characters just for Jones. So, provide (again, significant amounts of) money periodically through the Unique Rewards system instead. This way, newbies can buy what they need and then move on so they don't have to stick around at 79 for weeks just to function... and suddenly, all those Jones accounts that some people abuse will be useless because you can only get the payout once.
2. Increase crafting and imbuing fees for high-powered gear. Most of the "inflation control" methods we have today are terribly regressive and affect F2P people much more than the cash crowd. Increasing fees on crafting for R9 gears and for imbuing high-level (g13+) gems will help remove the money from places where it's, y'know, actually collecting.Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
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What I mean by no return is that the game has become so intrinsically linked with Cash Shopping that there is no feasible way to get it fixed. Yes you can add various ways for f2p players to get gear, and by no means am I saying that's a bad idea (it should be pursued as much as possible). but there is a massive gap that is unable to be cleared by f2p players. Take the recent charge reward as an example. To get a chance for a chance at a nuema portal card (random mind you, not the specific ones that many cashers need) you had to spend 5 grand worth of gold. 5 GRAND! That's absolute insane! And it's for 1 card that for any player, f2p or p2w, is effectively useless without the remaining 5 other cards. But if someone does have nuema portal, there's a massive inherent advantage that they gain from it.
Now I am fully aware there are other much easier (comparatively) card sets in the A tier that you can obtain that will allow you to match up easier against NP people, but there will always be a divide. And since PWC has shown that they're intent on removing f2p options for playing the game, I highly doubt a better method will ever actually come.
EDIT: And just to make a final point after re-reading your post, we had a lovely system that you could get money from, it was called BH. And they removed the money making aspect of it almost entirely. Holding onto this idea that there's gonna be some miracle cure is foolish.0 -
The divide has always been there, in some form. I think we might agree that the divide is inherent in any F2P game. But I would also agree that the gap became irreparably wide, and that happened years ago. This is what I referred to in my previous post as problems that would not be fixed without making a new server sans those problems (i.e. all the power creep in various forms including the quasi-exclusive war avatar sets you mentioned, ocean orbs in boutique, and - just to call a spade a spade - R9 in general).nightmare201 wrote: »What I mean by no return is that the game has become so intrinsically linked with Cash Shopping that there is no feasible way to get it fixed. Yes you can add various ways for f2p players to get gear, and by no means am I saying that's a bad idea (it should be pursued as much as possible). but there is a massive gap that is unable to be cleared by f2p players. Take the recent charge reward as an example. To get a chance for a chance at a nuema portal card (random mind you, not the specific ones that many cashers need) you had to spend 5 grand worth of gold. 5 GRAND! That's absolute insane! And it's for 1 card that for any player, f2p or p2w, is effectively useless without the remaining 5 other cards. But if someone does have nuema portal, there's a massive inherent advantage that they gain from it.
Now I am fully aware there are other much easier (comparatively) card sets in the A tier that you can obtain that will allow you to match up easier against NP people, but there will always be a divide. And since PWC has shown that they're intent on removing f2p options for playing the game, I highly doubt a better method will ever actually come.
EDIT: And just to make a final point after re-reading your post, we had a lovely system that you could get money from, it was called BH. And they removed the money making aspect of it almost entirely. Holding onto this idea that there's gonna be some miracle cure is foolish.
Since this apparently wasn't clear: I'm not holding my breath on enough of the staff (on either side of the pond) allowing this. It would be great if they did, but that's not the kind of game they're running. (and you know I already made that BH joke pre-emptively, right...?)
There are two categories of positive changes around here: things that would actually work but PWE/wanmei will never implement them, and things that are of more limited effectiveness but may actually be doable. I like to think that most of my suggestions fall into the latter category, but that doesn't mean I won't occasionally point out what actually would fix the game even if I know it will never happen.
Let me ask you this - if we agree that the larger problems of PWI in the form of power creep / gear disparity are never going away - do you think there is a way to fix the (comparatively smaller) issue of lack of F2P farming methods? And if so, what would your suggestion(s) be?
On a final note... one does not continue playing PWI in this day and age unless they've made their peace with said broken system. My personal strategy? Play mostly PVE. If you don't care much about PVP, 90% of that stress doesn't apply to you. Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
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I'll be honest and leak how most of the end game players are still"farming"... Most of us have a stupid amount of coin left over from things like tw pay and farming and packs...
The one thing that was possible to farm was Fortune keys but, due to a nerf on drop rates they are no longer viable to even buy.
The only true farm that actually makes a decent amount of gains are homestead alt farms. In 5 days a single homestead can produce 1 dull profaned wood (worth 40-50mill on Twilight temple). Of course this requires an investment of roughly 250-300mill per homestead per alt but in 25 days your coin is returned and honestly once you get up 10 or so alts using the homestead farm the others become basically free to make since the only thing u gotta worry about then are the mats.
Hypothetical you can make 800mill-1bill coin every 5 days but this would require a 5bill+ investment.
This game is no longer free to play it was at one point but due to GM's killing every possible thing to farm whether it's keys or dq points.
If a Mod truly cares about free to play players they would add a sell price for TT mats to NPC's and make a G17 mat farm dungeon like that of TT which drops G17 tradable mats.
But, this is unlikely since pwi is legit focused on $ and $ alone, this last update proves it. Want 105x3 sure just use 4k lucky coins (Phoenix sanctum token) and 4 days of clicking 1 quest. Want Twilight sky 10 sure use 8k+ lucky coins and a vitae buff and get it for free.
GG PWI
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But, this is unlikely since pwi is legit focused on $ and $ alone, this last update proves it. Want 105x3 sure just use 4k lucky coins (Phoenix sanctum token) and 4 days of clicking 1 quest. Want Twilight sky 10 sure use 8k+ lucky coins and a vitae buff and get it for free.
GG PWI
TBH, those 2 things are pretty neat I gotta admit. If I ever wanna roll another char combined with the possibility of farming both bloods in UCH now..you can get your toon ready for PvP in a month, without spending too much money on it. I like this.0 -
Let's try not to default to that old "PWI is greedy" chestnut, ok? It's been used since time immemorial and has never once been more true of PWI than any other F2P game out there. It's assumed that people who cash will have an advantage over people who don't, but there was a time when that advantage could be overcome by superior skill (or so I've heard, as I didn't personally participate in PVP before things went downhill in that area). And while breaking that balance was one of the worst missteps they ever made, I'd like to direct you to Hanlon's Razor (tl;dr: they're stupid, not malicious or in this case greedy). This is especially the case with more recent changes like the FSP thing, given that I'm still at a loss as to what the benefit of that change was supposed to be.If a Mod truly cares about free to play players they would add a sell price for TT mats to NPC's and make a G17 mat farm dungeon like that of TT which drops G17 tradable mats.
But, this is unlikely since pwi is legit focused on $ and $ alone, this last update proves it. Want 105x3 sure just use 4k lucky coins (Phoenix sanctum token) and 4 days of clicking 1 quest. Want Twilight sky 10 sure use 8k+ lucky coins and a vitae buff and get it for free.
GG PWI
And while yeah, adding NPC values to TT mats would be one way to fix the problem, they'd probably be more likely to remove NPC values from, say, warsong molds next. This, too, would serve no purpose, but again - stupidity, not greed.Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
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Attributing the trend of PWI to choose cash based options over free options to stupidity is wholly incorrect. Have there been some stupid ideas? Sure. But PWI is a business and at the end of the day their top priority is earning money. That's all well and good but when it comes at the cost of players who can't afford/don't want to spend money and their ability to effectively earn income in-game, that's greed. I have seen free to play games that are not pay to win. Granted, 90% of them are not based around PvP games as the end-game (indeed pretty much all of them are not MMORPGs but more stuff like LoL and Warframe), but the system has precedent. Instead PWI has chosen to release an increasing weight of cash related items that get more expensive as time goes on.
Let me give you an example, I started playing around end of 08 or the beginning of 09. I've seen the game (regardless of whether I was there for release or not) through just about every update from Tideborn onwards. If you told some of the top tier players that in just 8 years time there'd be a contest that required you to spend 5,000 gold to get the top tier rewards, they'd laugh you off for lying. That kind of expenditure would've been lunacy! And yet here we are, 8 years later and such a contest came through, and there was (at least from what I saw) only one post about it that got a few comments and people just moved on. And while that is an extreme, just think about rank 9 for a moment. When I last played, the cost of rank 9 was somewhere in the ballpark of 800mil-1.5bil or about 600-700 gold total. And realistically speaking, the only way you can get rank 9 is if someone bought the tokens and MoGs necessary for it in the first place. Farming it from the ground up in-game would take YEARS. But it's just a part of the game now. Nobody cares about the fact that the top tier gear is locked behind a paywall, because "Well I farmed for my r9 for free, so can you". Except they can't. And because they can't, this game is very very unlikely to get new players. And new players are needed, because the economy will eventually crash without them. There's only so much coin that can be earned without people buying armor and weapons. Sure stuff like apo and the like will always have some sort of a market, but too many people selling them and that market crashes. It's what happened with TT, nobody needs the gear anymore so there's 50 catshops by the Archo forges just sitting there doing nothing half the time.
To sum this up, regardless of whether it's Kalyst, the people in charge of PWE, or the people in charge of PWC, someone has had their focus on releasing content that is behind a paywall for years. And that will not change because people continue to buy items, charge gold, and spend their time silently catering to the idea that this is normal and perfectly fine behavior.0 -
IMO they need to loosen the cap non pve farming so we can have an actual running economy again between f2p and cash shoppers. Halve the drop rate of UP/FSP/Glyphs, and make the mechanics based more on time + skill rather than straight overgearing and nuking everything.
Prices for UP/FSP/glyphs should go up because most item prices I see tend to settle on ~50% of gold value/hour. That means the average farmer will make roughly 1 gold every 2 hours, but with no cap on earnings.
This would really depend though on how little gold/hour a farmer would be willing to accept before deciding it isn't worth it though. I don't think people will farm if the average is less than 1 gold/2 hours so it sounds reasonable.
Uncap gold prices so that there is more of an incentive for gold sellers to sell through AH, and keep the current system of spend promos to keep gold demand high. This should provide an avenue for f2p players to farm up to endgame, with only a basic investment in getting up to R9 gears.
PWI would probably lose some revenue but in-game activity and player participation would go way up, which I think is better for the game overall.
As bad as APS was, that APS/nirvana era was amazing in terms of player activity and the game was pretty fun back then because people actually played the game and supplemented pve income with some light spending, which is how a f2p game should work imo. There were still whales back then but they didn't impact the game nearly as much (for example seeing Catalyst completely destroy a CS faction like Valhalla on Harshlands).0 -
IMO they need to loosen the cap non pve farming so we can have an actual running economy again between f2p and cash shoppers. Halve the drop rate of UP/FSP/Glyphs, and make the mechanics based more on time + skill rather than straight overgearing and nuking everything.
Prices for UP/FSP/glyphs should go up because most item prices I see tend to settle on ~50% of gold value/hour. That means the average farmer will make roughly 1 gold every 2 hours, but with no cap on earnings.
This would really depend though on how little gold/hour a farmer would be willing to accept before deciding it isn't worth it though. I don't think people will farm if the average is less than 1 gold/2 hours so it sounds reasonable.
Uncap gold prices so that there is more of an incentive for gold sellers to sell through AH, and keep the current system of spend promos to keep gold demand high. This should provide an avenue for f2p players to farm up to endgame, with only a basic investment in getting up to R9 gears.
PWI would probably lose some revenue but in-game activity and player participation would go way up, which I think is better for the game overall.
As bad as APS was, that APS/nirvana era was amazing in terms of player activity and the game was pretty fun back then because people actually played the game and supplemented pve income with some light spending, which is how a f2p game should work imo. There were still whales back then but they didn't impact the game nearly as much (for example seeing Catalyst completely destroy a CS faction like Valhalla on Harshlands).
Unfortunately there's no way they're going to change any mechanics to make them more grind friendly. Anything they change has to be for both the China server and the PWI servers. And sadly because the chinese playerbase is very different in how much they play from us (at least I assume that's still true, I haven't heard any news about that changing), any changes made to the way loot is obtained that would make it more "f2p friendly" is only going to cause problems in PWC. And as has been shown time and time again, the devs make the game with PWC in mind, not PWI.0 -
Guys let me make one thing clear , there's a reason it's called free to play . There's also a choice to spend but see that's if you want to be maxed out gear wise. Although I have to agree with you all on the fact your making less profit from in game, and yes that is a problem because it makes it harder to get new players to stay ( unless they charge), unfortunately though this is how it goes with free to play games & what ends up happening is the cs users are what's left. It's a curse & blessings in a free to play game . What I can say is just be nice to each other and share every once in awhile & not greed over items ,help a player in need.
Also as a side note - I have played both types of games . My pay to play game was FF14 ( Monthly fee but no cash shop) , how's that work out you say? , Well plenty' of grind and team play to get gears. It had amazing graphics but I stopped because of the monthly fee and still lacked on the social aspect which you guys have so greatly over here. ( That's your strong point)
So bottom line just help each other out , cs user or not your all in this together at the end of the day.
Sorry I made this longer than I wanted.
Also please don't say this game is dead , it's not even close yet.
PS: don't blame the game - the players make the prices non cs.Post edited by deceitsoul on--/**Ticket- Support**\----/**Rules of Conduct**\-->
----/**Administrator of Mod team**\-->
Inquires or questions inbox here
Or reach me in-game
Ouln -Etherblade Server0 -
Dead? No the game's not dead. It's been in a very slow dying state for years though. If PWI is only supposed to be played by people that can cash shop, then that's fine. But don't call it free to play then. Because it's not. It's free to download, free to install, free to make a character. But not free to play.
And to the point that you don't "have" to spend, that's simply not the case anymore. Few years ago? Sure. Not anymore.
EDIT: I will very much blame the game because players did not put the highest tier of gear in the cash shop, players did not make the game pay 2 win. At least not directly. Are they only making it worse? Sure they are! But it is and always has been on the developers who put the chance packs and the r9 gear mats in the cash shop in the first place that caused the game to spiral out of control.0 -
nightmare201 wrote: »IMO they need to loosen the cap non pve farming so we can have an actual running economy again between f2p and cash shoppers. Halve the drop rate of UP/FSP/Glyphs, and make the mechanics based more on time + skill rather than straight overgearing and nuking everything.
Prices for UP/FSP/glyphs should go up because most item prices I see tend to settle on ~50% of gold value/hour. That means the average farmer will make roughly 1 gold every 2 hours, but with no cap on earnings.
This would really depend though on how little gold/hour a farmer would be willing to accept before deciding it isn't worth it though. I don't think people will farm if the average is less than 1 gold/2 hours so it sounds reasonable.
Uncap gold prices so that there is more of an incentive for gold sellers to sell through AH, and keep the current system of spend promos to keep gold demand high. This should provide an avenue for f2p players to farm up to endgame, with only a basic investment in getting up to R9 gears.
PWI would probably lose some revenue but in-game activity and player participation would go way up, which I think is better for the game overall.
As bad as APS was, that APS/nirvana era was amazing in terms of player activity and the game was pretty fun back then because people actually played the game and supplemented pve income with some light spending, which is how a f2p game should work imo. There were still whales back then but they didn't impact the game nearly as much (for example seeing Catalyst completely destroy a CS faction like Valhalla on Harshlands).
Unfortunately there's no way they're going to change any mechanics to make them more grind friendly. Anything they change has to be for both the China server and the PWI servers. And sadly because the chinese playerbase is very different in how much they play from us (at least I assume that's still true, I haven't heard any news about that changing), any changes made to the way loot is obtained that would make it more "f2p friendly" is only going to cause problems in PWC. And as has been shown time and time again, the devs make the game with PWC in mind, not PWI.
Thre's only 2 changes China needs to do for our version to fix that issue.
1. Make FSP/UP/Glpyh quests repeatable.
2. Halve the drop rate of those items + chests.
Both of those are pretty simple changes that hopefully won't even require any coding - just change the variables associated with those items.
Then again, considering China couldn't even be bothered to check the actual proc rate of purify in our version or the drop rate of skulls in DUP, it could very well be that those items are hard-coded and buried in an obscure spot under lines of code, or even have code modifying previous code to fix something else due to laziness.0 -
nice pwi.... op people CAMPING HASPON NOW. hahaha way to go pwi. better way to make people who don't really need glyphs be able to get glyphs that easy.
idk if PWE/ ARC is Chinese-owned. they are pretty clear when Chinese Devs says NO its NO.
then when you have free time try to install a different region of pw and look @ what stuff are they selling on their boutique. and keys drops,
GOLD Foil present here ... not there. hahaha.
you will see the reason why don't need CODES to appease its players.
@dregenfox i rather not have FSD repeatable but same rewards as before but with a difference.
before when can get our aptitude for free @ 15.00 aptitude now its gone.
maybe change rewards to not choice but complete receive the following.
FSD:
105 coins
astrobana level 1-3
astropira level 1-3
2 star seeker powder
5 nebula dust orb
FSJ
210 coins
astrobana level 4
astropira level 4
5 starseeker powder
10 nebula dust orb
bringing the starchart items here. will make people want to run FSD,and FSJ which means we will have a healthy number of players doing it.
remove the FLOWING SILVER TOKEN. if you accidentally dc or leave the dungeon it will fail sorry LIFE. u wasted 30 to 1 hr of your life. BRING back the FS ghost NPC.
REMOVE THE GOLDEN SPLENDOR THAT ITEM IS ABOMINATION!
NO R8 mats ty. nobody uses r8. oh well if your talking about that r8 hat .. idk.
"LESS CASH SHOP EVERYTHING and ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME TO GET SOMETHING. PLEASE PWI DONT COMMIT SUICIDE PLEASE.
TELEACOUSTICS DON'T LIE.
a significant number of players are gone what will you do pwi to help me form squad daily and not spend 20 tele trying to form one.Post edited by nub29#0863 on0 -
@greenfire312 the cause of INFLATION IS THE NOT JONES, NOT THE OTHER THINGS.
BUT THE GOLD FOIL ITSELF.
THINGS included in the foil got it price raised coz people gets 250m, 400m on them which must not be the case. and merchants want to get more than their stuff they price these stuff to be almost half the reward on this foils
so you get my drift?
NO FOILS no INFLATION.
LESS CASH -SHOPPING MORE PLAYING THE GAME TO GET STUFF.
btw NOBODY does jones. who have time in the world to login gazillion of toons.
better do arc quest than jones. much efficient.0 -
This is only in PWI. In the rest of the world, r8rr with Warsoul recast weapon is still an endgame set, an cheap alternative to r9. Because Nirvana g16 is unique to PWI. In short, only the PWI is an exception to the rule.nub29#0863 wrote: »NO R8 mats ty. nobody uses r8. oh well if your talking about that r8 hat .. idk.
About the changes that destroyed farm methods, I agree. That sucks.
It looks like the devs really want to bury the game...
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This game is no longer free to play it was at one point but due to GM's killing every possible thing to farm whether it's keys or dq points.
The GMs don't have anything to do with what the developers put into the game. Hell, the GMs are trying to HELP us.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial0 -
Try seeing if you can find a DHD squad that will take you, if you can get in there. You can sell the lvl 1 glyphs or the lvl 4s if you are lucky and get a lvl 4! It's about the only intance that you can make real money at.kalystconquerer#0876 wrote: »Hello!
Seems that generally, the thread gave you a good jumping off point! I'm not sure if farming herbs/mats even fits anywhere in this...(it's been so long since I sold in those markets, I'm not sure how it looks now. Also the amount of hours I sunk into it...we don't talk about that).
As far as farming instances is concerned, I've been working on something I want to propose to the devs, but we'll see what they think!
Nope, herbs take more time to farm then you get coin for, so if you don't have a lot of time to farm, as with the Opening post, then it's not a good farming endeavor! Hmm, though I know some people use a "bot" to farm herbs in Heaven and Hell, I do believe that's a no-no, right?
TT mats are selling a very low rate, not much demand for those mats since we don't get many new players.
Lunar mats same as TT although some people do farm for the EOD for g16/t3 gear but again not a big seller there, most people just go farm for themselves, again not many new players so low demand.
Warsong, well yes people do farm that but lots of people farm this instance so you have to find people to buy your crafting service. And idk about other but I would rather farm my own then trust someone to craft stuff for me and not cheat me. (I'm not a trusting soul!) You could make the gear to sell but on this server at least there are a lot of catshop selling g16 and it's not selling.
I'm glad to hear you trying to help the F2P players, we really do need a way to make some coin. And 1m really hardly is enough to get a head on with things selling in the billions. (Want to thank the GM that came on for the catshop event thing you guys did, CoM was selling at 1-1.5bil until you put it for 2bil in your catshop. All the sudden everyone is selling for 2bil and up now. Nice job jacking up the price on this server. =/)
I do hope you can make the game a bit more free to play friendly or you will see a lot of us leave. Just saying.
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> @kenshin151 said:
> nub29 nub29#0863
>
> wrote: »
>
> NO R8 mats ty. nobody uses r8. oh well if your talking about that r8 hat .. idk.
>
>
>
> This is only in PWI. In the rest of the world, r8rr with Warsoul recast weapon is still an endgame set, an cheap alternative to r9. Because Nirvana g16 is unique to PWI. In short, only the PWI is an exception to the rule.
>
> About the changes that destroyed farm methods, I agree. That sucks.
> It looks like the devs really want to bury the game...'
lol got rage from adding i to pw lel.
there are about 5 to 6 regions of pw
pw china (old server with population that caters to rich middle class of china)
pw br(idk about this but this is still alive. got a pretty healthy population)
pw ph (a bit older than pwi got a healthy population, stuff gets fixed fast, cheaper stuff, they really put a lot of thinking into their events.)
pw southeast asia(playpark... this got merged with pw ph)
btw pwph have g16. lel. different name ofc they are named to their literal chinese translations.
example of event from pwPH(this is now whole south east asia)
http://perfectworld.levelupgames.ph/main/2017/09/08/9288/
note*'
translations
5 star dragon ball = orb 5*
and so on.. the names translated literally to their Chinese names.
well arc kinda made the translation of pwi different. so its different from others.
details:
You can now upgrade your bounded items by getting the Upgraded Weapons.
Mechanics:
1.) Players can trade their 5-Star Dragon Ball to +8, +9 or +10 Weapon.
Rate:
1x 5-Star Dragon Ball to +8 Blood Snow
2x 5-Star Dragon Ball to +9 Dance of the Black Wind
3x 5-Star Dragon Ball to +10 Double Dragon
this names are r9 weapons.
2.) You can trade to any amount of DB5 every transaction.
currently this is the only PW region that offers this insane exchange.
1000 gold here cost about = 100 php - 2 USD - in pwi 1g = 1 usd
war avatar treasure box x 50 = 500 php - 10 USD - idk the exchange here.
war avatar catalyst x 100 = 1k php = 20 usd ... in pwi - 1 catalyst = 40 silver 0.4 usd each
currently pwph have much better population than pwi combined servers.
idk y they have these kind of events but pwi doesnt. ... idk prolly capitalism is taking over or something.
also they dont need CODES on their region.
i can't play this version coz i already started on this one.0 -
@sensualsoul hahah that event...
well prices on TT started to change around the time they started doing that.
COM used to be 1b
now some NPC buys it @ 2b so people will try to sell it much higher than 2b.. lol
these things also the reason com prices changed on Tideswell.0 -
I would hope that if you've played that long (as I also have), then you would be well aware that no one except wanmei, and to a much lesser extent PWE, is making design decisions of any kind.nightmare201 wrote: »Attributing the trend of PWI to choose cash based options over free options to stupidity is wholly incorrect. Have there been some stupid ideas? Sure. But PWI is a business and at the end of the day their top priority is earning money. That's all well and good but when it comes at the cost of players who can't afford/don't want to spend money and their ability to effectively earn income in-game, that's greed. I have seen free to play games that are not pay to win. Granted, 90% of them are not based around PvP games as the end-game (indeed pretty much all of them are not MMORPGs but more stuff like LoL and Warframe), but the system has precedent. Instead PWI has chosen to release an increasing weight of cash related items that get more expensive as time goes on.
Let me give you an example, I started playing around end of 08 or the beginning of 09. I've seen the game (regardless of whether I was there for release or not) through just about every update from Tideborn onwards. If you told some of the top tier players that in just 8 years time there'd be a contest that required you to spend 5,000 gold to get the top tier rewards, they'd laugh you off for lying. That kind of expenditure would've been lunacy! And yet here we are, 8 years later and such a contest came through, and there was (at least from what I saw) only one post about it that got a few comments and people just moved on. And while that is an extreme, just think about rank 9 for a moment. When I last played, the cost of rank 9 was somewhere in the ballpark of 800mil-1.5bil or about 600-700 gold total. And realistically speaking, the only way you can get rank 9 is if someone bought the tokens and MoGs necessary for it in the first place. Farming it from the ground up in-game would take YEARS. But it's just a part of the game now. Nobody cares about the fact that the top tier gear is locked behind a paywall, because "Well I farmed for my r9 for free, so can you". Except they can't. And because they can't, this game is very very unlikely to get new players. And new players are needed, because the economy will eventually crash without them. There's only so much coin that can be earned without people buying armor and weapons. Sure stuff like apo and the like will always have some sort of a market, but too many people selling them and that market crashes. It's what happened with TT, nobody needs the gear anymore so there's 50 catshops by the Archo forges just sitting there doing nothing half the time.
To sum this up, regardless of whether it's Kalyst, the people in charge of PWE, or the people in charge of PWC, someone has had their focus on releasing content that is behind a paywall for years. And that will not change because people continue to buy items, charge gold, and spend their time silently catering to the idea that this is normal and perfectly fine behavior.
The fact is that two key decisions (Anniversary Packs in 2009, and R9 gear sales in 2010) have caused much of the P2W power creep we have today. Where you and I disagree is on whether the devs and/or PWE deliberately did this out of greed (which to me implies malice, hence my use of Hanlon's Razor), or out of stupidity.
But as you correctly point out, the ecosystem of casher vs. F2P must be maintained, and the latter must have reliable farming methods instead of being railroaded into a low-coin existence. I would assume, hopefully, that PWE and wanmei understand this. But do they? Were they aware in 2009/10 that those two decisions would cause long-term stability problems? If yes, then the motive is closer to greed, because that would imply that PWI was never expected to have a shelf life beyond 2-3 years, like a number of other short lived games which became nakedly P2W early into their run and existed mostly to "cash out" their playerbase.
Buuuut... here we are, 9 years into PWI's run. And I'll admit to being as surprised as anyone about that. If the aim was to "cash out" and give PWI a deliberate expiration date, then they failed miserably. Did they know back then that the game could survive such blatant cash-grabbing? I mean, maybe they hoped it would, but when was the last time you saw such a remarkable display of clairvoyance? Ultimately, the powers that be simply aren't that competent. It was ballsy... but stupid.
Breaking it down into the simplest possible terms: if you want long-term stability, then changes like this FSP change are directly counter to your aims. I say this, of course, being still at a loss as to what PWE/wanmei hoped to accomplish with it. But if we assume that PWE/wanmei desires long term stability, then this change was terrible from any realistic standpoint even on their end. And that, to me, says "stupidity" rather than "greed."
Not too long ago, I knew a guild leader who openly admitted to having at least 25 jones alt accounts, which he would login daily to pick the initial coin reward. It happens. Quite often, in fact. On Etherblade server there are several characters in factions which clearly designate them as Jones characters only (like they literally have "Jones" or "Jolly" in the faction name) - clearly someone's alt farming squad.nub29#0863 wrote: »@greenfire312 the cause of INFLATION IS THE NOT JONES, NOT THE OTHER THINGS.
BUT THE GOLD FOIL ITSELF.
THINGS included in the foil got it price raised coz people gets 250m, 400m on them which must not be the case. and merchants want to get more than their stuff they price these stuff to be almost half the reward on this foils
so you get my drift?
NO FOILS no INFLATION.
LESS CASH -SHOPPING MORE PLAYING THE GAME TO GET STUFF.
btw NOBODY does jones. who have time in the world to login gazillion of toons.
better do arc quest than jones. much efficient.
Kindly explain what you're talking about with this "foil?" Surely you don't mean the one item in the game with Foil in the name, which NPCs for 1k and has literally no other use. It sounds like you're talking about a specific item, and while it's true that inflation on specific items can occur, I'm talking about the entire game economy here. We have on many occasions been told by staff that coin sinks need to occur in order to control inflation, and frankly, I'm beginning to doubt that's the case at all. If we do need coin sinks, then we need to stop making them so regressive and penalizing for F2P players in particular.Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
Etherblade server0 -
They mean the items from keys. These to be exact:
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52158
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52155
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52156
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52157
Each one consumes the items listed plus the foil and gives the number of 10mil Big Notes in exchange.
0 -
greenfire312 wrote: »Kindly explain what you're talking about with this "foil?" Surely you don't mean the one item in the game with Foil in the name, which NPCs for 1k and has literally no other use. It sounds like you're talking about a specific item, and while it's true that inflation on specific items can occur, I'm talking about the entire game economy here. We have on many occasions been told by staff that coin sinks need to occur in order to control inflation, and frankly, I'm beginning to doubt that's the case at all. If we do need coin sinks, then we need to stop making them so regressive and penalizing for F2P players in particular.
For example, Goldfoil: Eon Ore ( http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52157 ) gives 25 big notes for some WS mats. There are 3 other foil items, 2 giving 40 big notes for some higher end pack items and one giving 6 for lower tier pack items basically. These things arent all that uncommon, resulting into pretty absurd amounts of coin being thrown into economy.0 -
Idk why people are still complaining about these the main packs containing them are currently nerfed in both drop rate and price...
A couple of good buds which I spam opened with during the first introduction of keys have confirmed this lower drop rate as have I. In the old keys you seemed to be guaranteed a gold foil worth 250mill+ within 400 keys (200 packs worth) keys where 750k each for 100 @18 gold. This is where your major profit came from get 250mill guranteed from 1 item, as well as roughly 3-4 60mill foils and 2 ish dot/dod total.
These packs where basically a lottery table that was rigged so you always win granted you put in the x amount first. The loss came when PWI jebaited you with fancy items like sot,bead or Jaden crystal.. I spent a total of 100mill for my Jaden crystal which translated into 6bill from the insane amount of profit I made from keys... I was dumb af and spent the total 6bill to open every single last chest 9/10 missed and the last chest was 3bill on its own.
So yes profit was stupid ez with the original keys which resulted in a lot more players cash shopping to abuse keys as well. So yes 6bill was a stupid amount to spend for Jaden crystal but eh it was the last piece I needed to finish my end game gear things so why not just print and abuse keys to get a Jaden crystal + more for a total of 100mill down.
Since this update keys drop much more garbage and less items worth something and with a 30 gold sell price for 100, 12 gold above the original price, even for nerfed keys is a rip...
They overkilled keys cause of the QQ from players and less cash coming in due to the coin coming from keys.
I'm just glad I managed to get my sotx3 bead and Jaden crystal as well as 30ish matchless wings and 6bill coin (from an investment of 100mill) before these packs got nerfed to death.
Professional pack hoe, Prespire/Duckblades
So in recognition of my key spam...
Duke shouts let it be known that Prespire has recently acquired (Matchless Wings).0 -
Idk why people are still complaining about these the main packs containing them are currently nerfed in both drop rate and price...
A couple of good buds which I spam opened with during the first introduction of keys have confirmed this lower drop rate as have I. In the old keys you seemed to be guaranteed a gold foil worth 250mill+ within 400 keys (200 packs worth) keys where 750k each for 100 @18 gold.
Since this update keys drop much more garbage and less items worth something and with a 30 gold sell price for 100, 12 gold above the original price, even for nerfed keys is a rip...
They overkilled keys cause of the QQ from players and less cash coming in due to the coin coming from keys.
I'm just glad I managed to get my sotx3 bead and Jaden crystal as well as 30ish matchless wings and 6bill coin before these packs got nerfed to death.
Professional pack hoe, Prespire/Duckblades
I havent seen any major changes in droprates for foils. Granted am only bout 5k openings post price change, which isnt exactly enough to say anything with certainty.0 -
For example, Goldfoil: Eon Ore ( http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52157 ) gives 25 big notes for some WS mats. There are 3 other foil items, 2 giving 40 big notes for some higher end pack items and one giving 6 for lower tier pack items basically. These things arent all that uncommon, resulting into pretty absurd amounts of coin being thrown into economy.
Thanks for that. I wasn't aware of them, but then I tend to avoid packs like the plague. However, given that we've been hearing this "inflation" scaremongering for years, I'd say my point about coin sinks stands - especially if these foils put more coins in the hands of fewer (i.e. mostly cashers). There are only so many more coins they can "sink" from the F2P crowd. At some point you can't keep squeezing blood out of a stone.They mean the items from keys. These to be exact:
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52158
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52155
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52156
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52157
Each one consumes the items listed plus the foil and gives the number of 10mil Big Notes in exchange.Mains: Miugre / LigerKing
Etherblade server0 -
try to buy keys @ 1b .
eventually you will get about 8-10 foils with ur 1b
assuming its 400m . u get 4b = win. even if its 200 is still a win.
99% of the time. people who open packs already got the item for the foils so its easier for them to finish it.
WE ALREADY HAVE A LOT OF COIN SINKS.
Homestead? r9? r9 2nd cast? r9 3rd cast? r9 nw cast?
ridiculous 20m citrine, ridiculous 50m drakeflame, josd 250m or so,
3m for lunar? charms when u do UP. repair for ur r9 armors and weap.
war avatar catalyst
and now
starchart items = coin sink.. . really. 11m for astropira pearl lvl 3 . if its not a coin sink what is?
for a measly 0.01 add on starchart. WORTH it right?
cash shopper coins dont sink.
thats y they have big foils on their inventory. wish it drops on pk . idk. i havent seen 1 drop yet. hahaha
as if a 25 jolly will make you rich wtf. if it did im already rich coz i have 35 jolly @ the moment. not gonna increase them.
try to login these within 30 mins. you will see the dread of jolly.0 -
btw in order to not stay away from the topic.
the current fastest money maker is the changeling haspon (wrong spelling right?)
currently i didnt find anyway for g16 squad to kill this fast.
but r9 people can nuke this. as long as they don't buy their way out of this. literally.0
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