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Sparking Bms?

shellstarshellstar Posts: 0 Arc User
edited October 2012 in Venomancer
I've pretty much gotten the hang of sparking the Cleric when BB goes up and sparking the barb before big pulls or when i see him Roar or Invoke, i also spark the BM before they go in to stun the bishops in FC but im wondering if i have a spare spark should i be sparking the BM after i see him/her HF?

I'm also a little bit unsure about if Ironwood Scarab or the other debuff skills come in conflict with the other classes debuffs?

Thanks :)
Post edited by shellstar on
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  • Zvyn - Heavens TearZvyn - Heavens Tear Posts: 71 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    As far as sparking for stuns, Roar of the Pride doesn't take that much chi. If it's followed by Heaven's Flame, yeah, we're empty after that. Using fists makes it easy to get chi back. Personally, I would have the BMs ask for it. Cleric is the only one I never make ask for a spark. Barbs have their own chi gaining skills, so I do think they can manage well on their own. If they need chi terribly badly (which shouldn't happen all that often) they can ask for it.

    Just because my veno is demon my Ironwood is better and whenever it connects it is that much better. Some people, like barbs or clerics, do have their own debuffs and sometimes they have them on a rotation which can overwrite ours. I see that a lot with barbs using Devour.
  • Eccy - HarshlandsEccy - Harshlands Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Personally, when I use to FC I would pass the cleric and that's about it. Others such as bms and barbs would have to ask me, which was less than often. I wouldn't care too much about overriding other pdef debuffs because trust me - No one else is worrying about overcasting yours. It'll be especially annoying to you when people overcast yours if you decide to go demon as the once in every 50 billion times you cast it it'll hit and of course, a cleric will seal right over it b:laugh It's a good DD skill so I'd say spam it as much as possible. No barb is gonna be like "WOULD YOU QUIT IT?!" So go nuts with it, they might even thank you. b:cute
  • Phoenix_Eye - Heavens TearPhoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,681 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    at an FF the prority is the cleric always , spark him after BB , however many clerics have Cloud Eruption and they use it , while telling me not to spark them. Convinient much i could say. Barbs , i spark at bh 69 at pole (Invoke , for obvious reasons) , or Fragrance sometimes (my FF experience with veno isnt that vast).However if i hear sth like , i need chi for Flesh ream i go nuts. FR doesnt need as much skill as others and kitties have their own chi gaining skill . why should i put off my dmg potential (Nova or Double spark) just because they dont have 15-20 chi for flesh ream , i mean seriously ??/

    If blademaster is pure axe (yay for them , tired of Bms that die in 4 hits) then i do spark them after each HF. otherwise i ask them to inform me in case they need chi. That goes with Archers too sometimes.

    As for ironwood , Spam it love it , use it, Who cares if they overwrite it , it's dmg its BIG and thats ur job as a veno , making things faster and easier in a squad. Now ofc if u are Sage , tell them that ur debuff is a 40% so they dont need to seal or use other skills in case theirs are of a lower percent.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    <--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
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  • shellstarshellstar Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Thanks so much for the replies and helplful information :)
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  • Vitenka - DreamweaverVitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    shellstar wrote: »
    Thanks so much for the replies and helplful information :)

    Frankly BMs usually tell me that they make sparks fast enough without my help.

    My priority is cleric then tank then archer or wizard if any.
  • zbzkdazbzkda Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    I don't spark barbs anymore unless they ask. Barbs always have chi, and they have a skill that makes them get chi when they are attacked, and since they're tanking, they're being attacked all the time, so...

    My chi priority is: Cleric -> BM -> Barb. If a psy is in the squad, I PM him to tell him that if he wants chi he can tell me. I'm only lvl92, but when I already have the skill book for Demon Lending Hand, so when I get to lvl99 I'm all set for being a pr0 veno :>
    I seriously wonder: people who don't RPK, if you play the board game "Sorry!" and you roll the dice so that you land on an opponents piece and send it back to the beginning, do you sincerely apologize and ask everyone if you can have a do-over roll so you can give your victim another chance? It's a god damn game..

    --LongKnife
  • AnimaBlanc - SanctuaryAnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Keep in mind that with the current uprising of more and more +aps BM's that there is simply no need for them to receive a spark. Any 3 aps and above BM that dares to ask for a spark is a lazy son of a gun and deserves to be spoonfed his own fists...
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

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  • Lythianaa - DreamweaverLythianaa - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,307 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    My priority in sparking is always the cleric. The others, if they ask for one, then I'll spark. But I tended to find myself sparking archers and axe bms more than barbs. :P
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  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Keep in mind that with the current uprising of more and more +aps BM's that there is simply no need for them to receive a spark. Any 3 aps and above BM that dares to ask for a spark is a lazy son of a gun and deserves to be spoonfed his own fists...

    LOL at this.

    Since FF is the main example used... a 3+ aps BM pulls (or just follows the Barb) the second large hall of physical blue mob into the room with the slasher boss and then stuns and HFs as is standard procedure, thus using up two sparks. How exactly is having aps going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack, so as to help bring down this dangerous boss as quickly as possible ?

    You clearly are an idiot.
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    LOL at this.

    Since FF is the main example used... a 3+ aps BM pulls (or just follows the Barb) the second large hall of physical blue mob into the room with the slasher boss and then stuns and HFs as is standard procedure, thus using up two sparks. How exactly is having aps going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack, so as to help bring down this dangerous boss as quickly as possible ?

    You clearly are an idiot.

    Actually, you are the idiot if you think you need to spark to kill the boss, or if you think you need any sort of -int gear to kill the boss. People were doing it long before anyone started fists and -int just fine.
    Main characters
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    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • SashaGray - Heavens TearSashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    LOL at this.

    Since FF is the main example used... a 3+ aps BM pulls (or just follows the Barb) the second large hall of physical blue mob into the room with the slasher boss and then stuns and HFs as is standard procedure, thus using up two sparks. How exactly is having aps going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack, so as to help bring down this dangerous boss as quickly as possible ?

    You clearly are an idiot.

    cloud eruption? besides, if you do mobs then the boss, HF has a 30 second cooldown, so you couldnt do it anyway. why not pull the group onto the boss and HF them both, mobs will be stunned, HF, everyone aoe the boss and mobs, and you wont look like a noob bm asking for sparks.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • BabaORiley - DreamweaverBabaORiley - Dreamweaver Posts: 87 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    I posted a similar request for sparking info a while back:

    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1091201

    For a while afterward I tried sparking Clerics for BB, Barbs and BMs and mostly got requests to b:beatup NOT b:beatup do it unless specifically requested. So then I switched to telling everyone at the start of each run to let me know when/if they need a spark. After doing that for a while (mostly doing FB/BH's 51-59) I never had a taker.

    Once I started doing FB/BH69, a few Barbs have requested spark during the last two mobs.

    It would be helpful if some Barbs and Clerics would help clarify the situation for us.

    As far as debuffs go, You never know what other people are going to do, so I just make it a habit to always debuff (Ironwood for everything and Amp and sometimes Befuddling Mist for BOSSES and elites.) Again this is up to level 76. I don't know how things play out at higher levels.
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  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Actually, you are the idiot if you think you need to spark to kill the boss, or if you think you need any sort of -int gear to kill the boss. People were doing it long before anyone started fists and -int just fine.

    Umm... in my post above, No one said anything about needing aps to kill the Adawolf or any other boss for that matter. Really... what part of "as quickly as possible" did you not comprehend ?

    But if you think pro squads wouldn't mightily prefer the BM to have enough chi (oh right... they are lazy if they ask for it... LOL) to start off that particular boss with an HF which without question will speed things up (as opposed to everyone having to run up and down the room more than once before each "slash")... then I guess the idiot label belongs on you too. b:bye
  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    cloud eruption? besides, if you do mobs then the boss, HF has a 30 second cooldown, so you couldnt do it anyway. why not pull the group onto the boss and HF them both, mobs will be stunned, HF, everyone aoe the boss and mobs, and you wont look like a noob bm asking for sparks.

    By the time the Mobs are dead (unless a one-shot kill), 5+ seconds would have gone. Then another 10 -15 seconds waiting for everyone to get organized to go at the boss (not to mention waiting for Slasher to walk back from the other end of the room or run towards him). In general more than enough time for HF's cool down to end.

    As for Hfing the Mobs right on top of the Boss... lol, I'm sure the squishy members of the squad following behind the pull would absolutely love that idea. Sure its viable and I wouldn't mind it in the least. But in the hundred or so FC runs I've been on, never once have I seen that done. The Cleric for one makes sure to set up BB as far away from the boss as possible and that's where the Barb/BM pulls the mobs to.

    And yeah... all BMs (or anyone not a cleric in my experience) are noobs or lazy for daring to ask a Veno for a spark so you and others say. Doesn't matter much I guess since 90 out of the 100 runs I've been on, have turned down or never bothered to ask venos to come along. I wonder why.

    Ironic really since a good veno on a squad is more valuable than adding another aps member by faaar.
  • SashaGray - Heavens TearSashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    By the time the Mobs are dead (unless a one-shot kill), 5+ seconds would have gone. Then another 10 -15 seconds waiting for everyone to get organized to go at the boss (not to mention waiting for Slasher to walk back from the other end of the room or run towards him). In general more than enough time for HF's cool down to end.

    As for Hfing the Mobs right on top of the Boss... lol, I'm sure the squishy members of the squad following behind the pull would absolutely love that idea. Sure its viable and I wouldn't mind it in the least. But in the hundred or so FC runs I've been on, never once have I seen that done. The Cleric for one makes sure to set up BB as far away from the boss as possible and that's where the Barb/BM pulls the mobs to.

    And yeah... all BMs (or anyone not a cleric in my experience) are noobs or lazy for daring to ask a Veno for a spark so you and others say. Doesn't matter much I guess since 90 out of the 100 runs I've been on, have turned down or never bothered to ask venos to come along. I wonder why.

    Ironic really since a good veno on a squad is more valuable than adding another aps member by faaar.

    your 101, now, stop running FF like your 84. a 101 BM shouldnt need a cleric at all for FF, much less for BB if there is a sin in the squad, which there always is. roar + HF + highland, with everyone else getting off one aoe should kill all the mobs, might as well do it on top of the boss, so it gets damaged and debuffed too, and you dont waste more time chi-ing up and rebuffing especially since you rebuffed 2 minutes ago.

    go put cloud eruption on your genie, and stop slowing yourself down by not bringing a veno because your spiteful they dont pass you sparks whenever you arent full.
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  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    your 101, now, stop running FF like your 84. a 101 BM shouldnt need a cleric at all for FF, much less for BB if there is a sin in the squad, which there always is. roar + HF + highland, with everyone else getting off one aoe should kill all the mobs, might as well do it on top of the boss, so it gets damaged and debuffed too, and you dont waste more time chi-ing up and rebuffing especially since you rebuffed 2 minutes ago.

    go put cloud eruption on your genie, and stop slowing yourself down by not bringing a veno because your spiteful they dont pass you sparks whenever you arent full.


    I was really responding more to the SPECIFIC sentiment in this thread being dismissive of BMs "daring" to ask for lending hand as being lazy or noob. Sure I'm 5 aps with 10K+ HP when buffed (who can solo FF at will). But what about those BMs in their 90s with crappy gear running with a similar type squad that just can't wtfpwn bosses and mobs in unison ?

    Most are lucky to get 3.33 aps at lvl 99 but according to "some" here that's good enough to take care of their own chi needs, even when its BLATANTLY obvious that passing a spark on OCCASION to the BM so that he can trigger HF when needed benefits the squad tremendously as a whole.

    And yes I know you mentioned cloud eruption but a Cleric or Barb can put that on their genie as well yet I don't here them being accused of being noob when asking for chi. b:surrender

    Also, most pro- BMs save the cloud erupt for after triple sparking so they can then HF thus taking advantage of the HF debuff with their own increased attack speed and damage.

    Bottom line.

    BM who constantly pesters Veno for Chi just so he can triple spark or toss aoes multiple times = Noob

    Veno who refuses/ignores BM who requests a spark when its BLATANTLY obvious said BM needs it and instead blindly tosses it to the Barb or cleric who didn't even ask for it = Noob and (possibly) useless.
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Umm... in my post above, No one said anything about needing aps to kill the Adawolf or any other boss for that matter. Really... what part of "as quickly as possible" did you not comprehend ?

    But if you think pro squads wouldn't mightily prefer the BM to have enough chi (oh right... they are lazy if they ask for it... LOL) to start off that particular boss with an HF which without question will speed things up (as opposed to everyone having to run up and down the room more than once before each "slash")... then I guess the idiot label belongs on you too. b:bye

    Speed isn't everything. The boss is not dangerous if you actually know what you are doing. It's quite easy to solo the thing on any class. My way of doing things regardless of the character I'm on is to play like there is no one to give you sparks. You have to only use them at key moments or you won't have them later.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Fistol - Raging TideFistol - Raging Tide Posts: 260 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    just ask?

    Whoever needs it more gets it.. simple as that really.

    no need to argue about useless or not.
    if the tank and cleric doesn't need it.
    bm or a DD does
    and veno has lending hand to spare.. whats wrong with helping out the bm?

    b:chuckle
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  • Hazumi_chan - SanctuaryHazumi_chan - Sanctuary Posts: 1,264 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    I always hand a spark to the cleric when she's in BB. Cleric has the first priority. May stuff go wrong the cleric can always put it up again then if necessary. During bosses the bm get's priority for hf. I do always ask them to tell me when they're gonna hf so I cam amp thoughb:chuckle
    At bosses like pole I lend the barb once he invokes.
    If there's no bm on a boss and the barb doesn't need chi.. I'm just lending the first who uses a triple spark... I'm kinda doing that automatically...
    I'm even searching my seeker's skill list sometimes for lending hand b:embarrass
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    I always hand a spark to the cleric when she's in BB. Cleric has the first priority. May stuff go wrong the cleric can always put it up again then if necessary. During bosses the bm get's priority for hf. I do always ask them to tell me when they're gonna hf so I cam amp thoughb:chuckle
    At bosses like pole I lend the barb once he invokes.
    If there's no bm on a boss and the barb doesn't need chi.. I'm just lending the first who uses a triple spark... I'm kinda doing that automatically...
    I'm even searching my seeker's skill list sometimes for lending hand b:embarrass

    The Veno of my dreams. b:dirty b:heart
  • AnimaBlanc - SanctuaryAnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    LOL at this.

    Since FF is the main example used... a 3+ aps BM pulls (or just follows the Barb) the second large hall of physical blue mob into the room with the slasher boss and then stuns and HFs as is standard procedure, thus using up two sparks. How exactly is having aps going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack, so as to help bring down this dangerous boss as quickly as possible ?

    You clearly are an idiot.

    A) If you are so set on speed and killing a boss within a certain timeframe with DD's (in your defence BM's in general) AND you happen to have a cleric with you just for those "whoopsadaiseee" moments, who do you think is going to need those sparks moreso than a BM? -The cleric,
    Reason? ;Where the hell does a cleric at that time he is not dd'ing have the time to build 2 sparks to keep your spasmic *** alive? exactly point in case. Unless your one of those BM's that expect a cleric to fork out every penny they have on getting spark apoth pots, mana food AND try and keep up with 5 trigger happy DD's ?

    B) IF you are so set on killing a boss within a certain alotted time, +3 Aps gives you MORE than enough time to build up enough chi for your skills and sparks. As above mentioned reason YOUR the one wanting that kind of a pace and YOUR the one capable of what you are. It is YOUR character and regardless of the fact you are in a squad (and the fact a veno poops out golden spark eggs) YOU have to cater to YOUR character first instead of expecting everyone else will.
    Unless your one of those BM's that doesn't invest chit in even the smallest apoth goodie (a.k.a a spark pot or a genie skill (cause hey, you expect clerics to do it, why should YOU? and veno's can so all their base belongs to us?) NO) and only care about saving up for that one extra piece of gear that makes you go bigger badder stronger

    C) Why.. O why, silly BM do you even consider bringing up the slasher boss when me and my husband and I, as a veno, solo'd that damn boss well under 3 minutes. Now, regardless of the fact that aint "pro" AND i am 101 if you have a well balanced squad you shouldn't take more on that boss than 4 minutes tops ANYWAY. And if 4 minutes is even too slow for you on a regular squad i suggest you start rearanging your priorities cause you spend more time taking a **** than killing that boss.

    D) How is he having APS going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack ? well you know... -points at reason B- You kinda... spaz and you attack like... 3 times a second.. you know and.. like... that's fast ? o.o herpderp -.- and last i checked, anyone needs chi as well to get their so called spark back because they spark attacked? so wouldn't making that alittle useless with you HFing again when everyone else is still regaining chi as well? (unless ofcourse your going to assume any other class regains chi with the speed of light?)

    And as a final E) If you have a 3+aps squad member reasonable DD's AND a veno, Amp and 1 HF at the start should give you more than anough to crank the boss's HP down AT LEAST 20%, Untill the moment you like... spaz and regain chi, Amp is off cooldown + your HF, herpderp, you repeat faceroll and lookiedoo...

    TL:dr and On a sidenote, Hex. The reason APS is so brilliant is because it does more within littlest time, thus also regaining chi. Bottom line is, NON APS classes still regain chi the old ways. ANY class that doesn't build chi like an APS character does gets it first, period. and if you as an aps class do not know how to keep your spark happy APS toon in check on chi, something is off. either your being lazy or a mooch; take your pick.

    idiot.b:bye
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

    Lag; You think yours is bad ? It took Jesus 3 days to Respawn !
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  • Phoenix_Eye - Heavens TearPhoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,681 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    LOL at this.

    Since FF is the main example used... a 3+ aps BM pulls (or just follows the Barb) the second large hall of physical blue mob into the room with the slasher boss and then stuns and HFs as is standard procedure, thus using up two sparks. How exactly is having aps going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack, so as to help bring down this dangerous boss as quickly as possible ?

    You clearly are an idiot.

    First of all , BM should always inform when he HFs so everyone can spark Before HF (due to spark delay). Also it is wrong to expect sparks all the time. lending hand has 60 sec CD , and noone can force a veno to get demon/sage version. Also , why would u ever need to spam HF at slasher , and why exactly he is considered dangerous ???? It is just the noob close tange classes who pretend to be pro and want to take the dmg when they have only 5k-6k cause they want to wear fists and not adding vit.

    there is a skill called Cloud Eruption too . many use it , try it too.
    Pure axe BMs should be sparked , Fist Bms , once in a while , other classes need chi too.

    Venos have to learn that they are not chi slaves , they have to leave chi for themselves to use Nova or Triple spark. Being 3.33+ aps and asking for sparks is proof of being too lazy , not synchronised with ur squad or a big idiot.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    A) If you are so set on speed and killing a boss within a certain timeframe with DD's (in your defence BM's in general) AND you happen to have a cleric with you just for those "whoopsadaiseee" moments, who do you think is going to need those sparks moreso than a BM? -The cleric,
    Reason? ;Where the hell does a cleric at that time he is not dd'ing have the time to build 2 sparks to keep your spasmic *** alive? exactly point in case. Unless your one of those BM's that expect a cleric to fork out every penny they have on getting spark apoth pots, mana food AND try and keep up with 5 trigger happy DD's ?

    B) IF you are so set on killing a boss within a certain alotted time, +3 Aps gives you MORE than enough time to build up enough chi for your skills and sparks. As above mentioned reason YOUR the one wanting that kind of a pace and YOUR the one capable of what you are. It is YOUR character and regardless of the fact you are in a squad (and the fact a veno poops out golden spark eggs) YOU have to cater to YOUR character first instead of expecting everyone else will.
    Unless your one of those BM's that doesn't invest chit in even the smallest apoth goodie (a.k.a a spark pot or a genie skill (cause hey, you expect clerics to do it, why should YOU? and veno's can so all their base belongs to us?) NO) and only care about saving up for that one extra piece of gear that makes you go bigger badder stronger

    C) Why.. O why, silly BM do you even consider bringing up the slasher boss when me and my husband and I, as a veno, solo'd that damn boss well under 3 minutes. Now, regardless of the fact that aint "pro" AND i am 101 if you have a well balanced squad you shouldn't take more on that boss than 4 minutes tops ANYWAY. And if 4 minutes is even too slow for you on a regular squad i suggest you start rearanging your priorities cause you spend more time taking a **** than killing that boss.

    D) How is he having APS going to help him regain the chi needed to immediately HF once again on adawolf right after the start of everyone else's spark attack ? well you know... -points at reason B- You kinda... spaz and you attack like... 3 times a second.. you know and.. like... that's fast ? o.o herpderp -.- and last i checked, anyone needs chi as well to get their so called spark back because they spark attacked? so wouldn't making that alittle useless with you HFing again when everyone else is still regaining chi as well? (unless ofcourse your going to assume any other class regains chi with the speed of light?)

    And as a final E) If you have a 3+aps squad member reasonable DD's AND a veno, Amp and 1 HF at the start should give you more than anough to crank the boss's HP down AT LEAST 20%, Untill the moment you like... spaz and regain chi, Amp is off cooldown + your HF, herpderp, you repeat faceroll and lookiedoo...

    TL:dr and On a sidenote, Hex. The reason APS is so brilliant is because it does more within littlest time, thus also regaining chi. Bottom line is, NON APS classes still regain chi the old ways. ANY class that doesn't build chi like an APS character does gets it first, period. and if you as an aps class do not know how to keep your spark happy APS toon in check on chi, something is off. either your being lazy or a mooch; take your pick.

    idiot.b:bye

    LOL... tried to read your wall of text but couldn't get past all the "herpderps", "lookiedoo" and "whoopsiedaisies" thrown in every two sentences above for no reason than trying to show "how coolz you are".

    I'll Simply say this... if you still feel that any fist aps BM who asks for lending hand at at any time no matter what the circumstance is lazy and (per your previous post) deserves to have their fists shoved up "you know where", then keep your chi. I'll gladly take along in Nirvana/FF/whatever squads "helpful" venos like Hazumi_chan above and leave Venos like your @$$ out. That way, everybody's happy. b:bye
  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    First of all , BM should always inform when he HFs so everyone can spark Before HF (due to spark delay). Also it is wrong to expect sparks all the time. lending hand has 60 sec CD , and noone can force a veno to get demon/sage version. Also , why would u ever need to spam HF at slasher , and why exactly he is considered dangerous ???? It is just the noob close tange classes who pretend to be pro and want to take the dmg when they have only 5k-6k cause they want to wear fists and not adding vit.

    there is a skill called Cloud Eruption too . many use it , try it too.
    Pure axe BMs should be sparked , Fist Bms , once in a while , other classes need chi too.

    Venos have to learn that they are not chi slaves , they have to leave chi for themselves to use Nova or Triple spark. Being 3.33+ aps and asking for sparks is proof of being too lazy , not synchronised with ur squad or a big idiot.

    You know... you could have saved yourself some keyboard banging by reading my subsequent post where I said and I quote:
    Bottom line.

    BM who constantly pesters Veno for Chi just so he can triple spark or toss aoes multiple times = Noob

    No one expects the Veno to constantly spam lending hand at the BM. But at the same time, if you as a veno reaaally thinks that an aps BM should never be given a spark on occasion... even if no one else has asked for one... then way to go, "team player"... LOL.

    But as I mentioned in my other recent post, we all get to squad with who we like. Good thing that at end game I as a 5 aps BM have a choice of not having to squad with venos with that point of view.
  • AnimaBlanc - SanctuaryAnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    LOL... tried to read your wall of text but couldn't get past all the "herpderps", "lookiedoo" and "whoopsiedaisies" thrown in every two sentences above for no reason than trying to show "how coolz you are".

    I'll Simply say this... if you still feel that any BM who asks for lending hand at at any time no matter what the circumstance is lazy and (per your previous post) deserves to have their fists shoved up "you know where", then keep your chi. I'll gladly take along in Nirvana/FF/whatever squads "helpful" venos like Hazumi_chan above and leave Venos like your @$$ out. That way, everybody's happy. b:bye

    Exactly, And thats where you only read what you want to read/see.
    the text in red is just plain WRONG
    IF you had even bother to read what i posted, never mind the way i wrote it cause hey diversity is a *****, get used to it. You would have actually got the point that i wasn't talking about a bm in general but per your post trying to explain how 3+aps is more than enough to keep your own chi in check.

    And FYI, i DID give you a TL:dr cause i already expected you'd be too lazy to actually read what i wrote and even THAT summed up exactly what i meant.

    That being 3+APS doesn't deserve every spark thats available and will only get one when there's a SPARE. Cause in your defence apparently HF and a sparking APS toon is more important than anything else. and as you can see alo of veno's disagree with you for various reasons.
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

    Lag; You think yours is bad ? It took Jesus 3 days to Respawn !
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "Current games aren't -games- anymore, just light shows operated by win buttons, lol."
    "ah sh*t, were gonna die!.... but it's still cool!" -INTMDATOR
  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Exactly, And thats where you only read what you want to read/see.
    the text in red is just plain WRONG
    IF you had even bother to read what i posted, never mind the way i wrote it cause hey diversity is a *****, get used to it. You would have actually got the point that i wasn't talking about a bm in general but per your post trying to explain how 3+aps is more than enough to keep your own chi in check.

    And FYI, i DID give you a TL:dr cause i already expected you'd be too lazy to actually read what i wrote and even THAT summed up exactly what i meant.

    That being 3+APS doesn't deserve every spark thats available and will only get one when there's a SPARE. Cause in your defence apparently HF and a sparking APS toon is more important than anything else. and as you can see alo of veno's disagree with you for various reasons.

    HA HA ! so now its, "when there is a SPARE"

    Well you know... I would never have bothered getting into this hub bub (or should I say herpderp instead ? b:lipcurl ) with you if you had actually used the word "SPARE" in your opening post. But here, let me remind you exactly what you DID say:
    Keep in mind that with the current uprising of more and more +aps BM's that there is simply no need for them to receive a spark. Any 3 aps and above BM that dares to ask for a spark is a lazy son of a gun and deserves to be spoonfed his own fists...

    Well gee... doesn't sound like there was any compromise at all in whether an (aps) BM deserves lending hand or not.
  • AnimaBlanc - SanctuaryAnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    Well gee... doesn't sound like there was any compromise at all in whether an (aps) BM deserves lending hand or not.

    And there isn't either. My brutally honest opinion is that every character should be self sufficient in the first place. that being pots, apoth and the spark pots if need be.
    Of course that doesn't mean I completely frown upon lending anyone a spark, absolutely not.

    Reason i gave you that wall of text is because i gave you explaination why APS, where spark lending was concerned, is a very last priority in comparison to speed and the regen of chi of other classes.

    Simplest thing you used as an example with the mob pull and runewolf. Where the hell do you need the spark for to immediately HF again if you say everyone else spark attacked too.
    If you want to get the max out of your DD and debuffs/amping doesn't make HFing alittle useless if everyone else is still regaining chi yet your already ready with your HF and no one has the spark to sparkburst.
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

    Lag; You think yours is bad ? It took Jesus 3 days to Respawn !
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "Current games aren't -games- anymore, just light shows operated by win buttons, lol."
    "ah sh*t, were gonna die!.... but it's still cool!" -INTMDATOR
  • Hexalot - DreamweaverHexalot - Dreamweaver Posts: 871 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    And there isn't either. My brutally honest opinion is that every character should be self sufficient in the first place. that being pots, apoth and the spark pots if need be.
    Of course that doesn't mean I completely frown upon lending anyone a spark, absolutely not.

    Reason i gave you that wall of text is because i gave you explaination why APS, where spark lending was concerned, is a very last priority in comparison to speed and the regen of chi of other classes.

    Simplest thing you used as an example with the mob pull and runewolf. Where the hell do you need the spark for to immediately HF again if you say everyone else spark attacked too.
    If you want to get the max out of your DD and debuffs/amping doesn't make HFing alittle useless if everyone else is still regaining chi yet your already ready with your HF and no one has the spark to sparkburst.

    The rune wolf example was used because it's a classic case of a BM (at lower gear and aps levels anyway) using two HFs in succession. The first on the blue mobs pulled into the boss room. The second HF, to take part in the attack on the slasher boss himself so as to maximize the damage of everyone else. And while the Sins in the group can use their skills to regain chi and triple spark on the boss almost immediately after the initial mobs are dead. The poor "aps" BM has to instead wack at the boss multiple times in order to regain the chi needed to HF thus missing out on most of the Sins initial triple spark. And he has to do that because when asked, Veno in the group has decided that she has better uses for that spark (pew pew scarabs or nova on boss, anyone ? b:surrender ).

    Now does the aps BM absolutely NEED two HFs to kill the mobs and Slasher that way ?

    Of course not. But does the veno absolutely NEED to tell the aps BM to go to hell if he dares ask for the spark required for the above scenario ?

    Huh... seems so.

    But once again... each to their own. No one can force a veno to give lending hand (with the attitude displayed here, pretty ironic name for that skill) to anyone. Just as a veno with that attitude can't force anyone to squad with them either.
  • Hazumi_chan - SanctuaryHazumi_chan - Sanctuary Posts: 1,264 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    The Veno of my dreams. b:dirty b:heart

    ur playing on the wrong server sir b:cute b:chuckle b:avoid
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • AnimaBlanc - SanctuaryAnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited June 2011
    The rune wolf example was used because it's a classic case of a BM (at lower gear and aps levels anyway) using two HFs in succession. The first on the blue mobs pulled into the boss room. The second HF, to take part in the attack on the slasher boss himself so as to maximize the damage of everyone else. And while the Sins in the group can use their skills to regain chi and triple spark on the boss almost immediately after the initial mobs are dead. The poor "aps" BM has to instead wack at the boss multiple times in order to regain the chi needed to HF thus missing out on most of the Sins initial triple spark. And he has to do that because when asked, Veno in the group has decided that she has better uses for that spark (pew pew scarabs or nova on boss, anyone ? b:surrender ).

    Now does the aps BM absolutely NEED two HFs to kill the mobs and Slasher that way ?

    Of course not. But does the veno absolutely NEED to tell the aps BM to go to hell if he dares ask for the spark required for the above scenario ?

    Huh... seems so.

    So, just for the sake of 1 DD and a triple spark you'd want a spark for HF?
    Whats stopping the sin from waiting till everyone is sparked up?
    What's stopping you from seeing the whole picture ?
    And honest to what ever deity you believe in stops you from just accepting the fact that non aps DD's get first priority.

    Fine my first remark was far from tactical but as i have stated before Diversity is a **** get over it.
    If you want to go compare scenario after scenario and prove to the whole forum why a BM shoud and must get a spark to HF EVERYtime be my guest. odds are 50% will agree and 50% will disagree.

    I'm done talking to a brick wall.

    Edit: And ONCE flippen more, Whats stopping that bm in that particular situation to rely on his own recourses (genie, apoth goodies) yet instead expect someone else will supply him ?
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

    Lag; You think yours is bad ? It took Jesus 3 days to Respawn !
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "Current games aren't -games- anymore, just light shows operated by win buttons, lol."
    "ah sh*t, were gonna die!.... but it's still cool!" -INTMDATOR
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