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  • lardesonlardeson Member Posts: 374 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    Apart from above comments stating how encounter from one paragon and another lack synergy (IT and Conduit being in different paragons makes little to no sense) and that fact that the CD on most of our encounters just look ridiculous for a squishy class like the CW.

    Regarding damage, and some encounters not having bonus on spellmastery, im gonna think those are bugs and hopefully thats the case. INT doesn't add to magic damage as it should.

    Also there are a few changes i find pretty weird. like spelltwisting used to add CD reduction, now only gives 4% AP? i know u guys are trying to cut off all sources of AP and CD reduction but seriously? 4% out of 100%? compared to the previous 30% CD reduction it had?

    Another thing to point out that is abit unrelative to Cw, but may aswel point it out anyway as it was part of my build. The snail Leg Mount giving 10% Ap gain, while every other mounts keep their exact same equip bonuses? Seriously? is that some joke?

    Ok, read the devs comment after posting this. May I ask what criteria you chose for the powers that have special effects on spellmastery?
    Lardeson CW not Mage. Where's my fireball and my thunderbolt?
  • baronstragenbaronstragen Member Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    I see people refer to Fanning the Flame as an AOE. It IS NOT. At the moment, it is a single target and the flames do not spread to anyone else. It is a single target spell at the moment, whether it is in the mastery tab or not.

    https://youtu.be/k4ACw93WSrU
    Post edited by baronstragen on
    Varric the Cursed Dwarven cursed to be Tiefling CW
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  • gnomeandsland#6149 gnomeandsland Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    I understand that the dev team is committed to elimating buffs, but that is a terrible idea. Buffs and debuffs enable group play by players with varying IL. A 13k CW can still be very useful to an IL 15k party by applying smolder & ray. In this new system, a 13k CW is...a waste of a party slot for a group at IL 15k. This will generally be unfriendly to newer and ftp players.
  • theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User

    I understand that the dev team is committed to elimating buffs, but that is a terrible idea. Buffs and debuffs enable group play by players with varying IL. A 13k CW can still be very useful to an IL 15k party by applying smolder & ray. In this new system, a 13k CW is...a waste of a party slot for a group at IL 15k. This will generally be unfriendly to newer and ftp players.

    The problem with the old system is that virtually *every* class had debuffs, which meant that instead of "weak guy over there debuffs so he can contribute" you had "let's run 4 supports and one primary DPS."

    Now, if "Weakened" was just a flat binary state, and multiple debuffs don't stack, and using a debuff power precludes using other better DPS, then a debuff support could work.
  • vorphiedvorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User

    I understand that the dev team is committed to elimating buffs, but that is a terrible idea. Buffs and debuffs enable group play by players with varying IL. A 13k CW can still be very useful to an IL 15k party by applying smolder & ray. In this new system, a 13k CW is...a waste of a party slot for a group at IL 15k. This will generally be unfriendly to newer and ftp players.

    A slight tangent, but it's a mistake to assume that "ftp" automatically = impoverished and/or unskilled. I know players who amass and sustain high levels of wealth with minimal or no real money investment. Purchasing Zen with cash definitely accelerates the process of getting rich in Neverwinter, but it doesn't guarantee either future wealth or actual skill at playing the game.

    All of that aside I can't truly disagree with your point, but I think exclusion of comparatively lower ilvl characters is already very much alive and well in the current build. Sure, that skilled 13k Devo can do its primary job adequately compared to an 18k one, but public groups will overlook it because they know they can get a more tricked-out one. As for the 13k CW, public groups won't touch it with a 10ft pole regardless of its possible group utility.

    On the other hand, friendly guild and alliance groups will likely continue to support their up-and-coming players and continue to invest time with them regardless of buff/debuff capability or lack thereof. If anything this new design of deflating buff/debuff stacking will hopefully help newer players be included more than before since specific classes and builds may no longer have group slots on virtual lockdown. Too soon to tell how the new meta will play out in real play post level 80, but we'll see.

    Sacrilege - Warlock
    Contagion - Cleric
    Testament - Wizard
    Pestilence - Ranger
    Dominion - Paladin

    NIGHTSWATCH

  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    edited March 2019

    I see people refer to Fanning the Flame as an AOE. It IS NOT. At the moment, it is a single target and the flames do not spread to anyone else. It is a single target spell at the moment, whether it is in the mastery tab or not.

    https://youtu.be/k4ACw93WSrU

    It is an AoE.




    Fanned Flame and Gathering Flame are the AoE portion. To apply them, you first need to apply smoulder to a target. Maybe a basic reading of the tooltip followed by actually trying to do what it says would show you this.
  • vorphiedvorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User
    edited March 2019

    I see people refer to Fanning the Flame as an AOE. It IS NOT. At the moment, it is a single target and the flames do not spread to anyone else. It is a single target spell at the moment, whether it is in the mastery tab or not.

    https://youtu.be/k4ACw93WSrU

    It is an AoE.




    Fanned Flame and Gathering Flame are the AoE portion. To apply them, you first need to apply smoulder to a target. Maybe a basic reading of the tooltip followed by actually trying to do what it says would show you this.

    Some changes coming for the next update based on the feedback here:

    Encounters Repel and Chill Strike have been swapped.
    Feats Icy Veins and Frigid Winds have been swapped.
    Arcane Bolt we are going to look into taking off the induction charge which will speed it up a little bit. The final attack of the combo will grant arcane mastery and the damage has been adjusted to align with the change in speed.

    Fireball is something we can look into, but there are no promises that would be added into the class.

    Piggypacking on thefabricant's suggestion, I don't suppose we could model Cataclysm after something like the massive lightning-beam-cannon-thing that some of the Red Wizard enemies are fond of using? The current flaming blue flatulence and seemingly short cone AoE are extremely underwhelming.
    Sacrilege - Warlock
    Contagion - Cleric
    Testament - Wizard
    Pestilence - Ranger
    Dominion - Paladin

    NIGHTSWATCH

  • rysiek86rysiek86 Member Posts: 145 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    After running some more tests on Fanning the Flame and acording to Mr. Calculator diagrams i must appologize for what i wrote about FtF. It is working as the tooltip says. Im really sorry for missinformation.
    The primary hit and the dot afterwards (that are single target dmg) create the "take and spread" additional damage effect ( gathering flame and fanned flame) that without smoulder on other targets wouldnt exist. I agree with Mr. Calculator that FtF is an AoE encounter. Using his diagram Gather and Fanned do 3%+3% AoE dmg and FtF itself does 2% dmg that overall gives 8% that is, id say, quite effective.
    This encounter relays on synergys in build which is fantastic. To achive maximal values from the skill you must apply smoulder first to all targets, Than FtF the toughest enemy so u can squeeze all the ticks from Gathering Flame and Fanned Flame. As a single target skill is weak as hell, but in group fights it steps to other dimention.


  • eregerogeregerog Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 47 Arc User

    Some changes coming for the next update based on the feedback here:

    Encounters Repel and Chill Strike have been swapped.
    Feats Icy Veins and Frigid Winds have been swapped.
    Arcane Bolt we are going to look into taking off the induction charge which will speed it up a little bit. The final attack of the combo will grant arcane mastery and the damage has been adjusted to align with the change in speed.

    Fireball is something we can look into, but there are no promises that would be added into the class.

    First of all, thanks for listening, implementing and responding to some of our feedback, it is really appreciated.
    I would like to know if you are currently considering re-adding some spell mastery effects to powers like Chill Strike, Entangling Force etc, as suggested by various people in the thread.

    Furthermore, as a follow-up to @thefabricant 's evaluation of the feats I'd like to propose some changes to improve the worse ones:

    I like the idea behind alacrity in using your daily once all encounters are on CD. However it could use a slight buff.

    Empowering flames should cause damage in an aoe (and perhaps less of it) when its working. This makes the comparison between it and shatter strike harder and gives each a purpose: One for AoE, one for single-target.

    When compared to Elemental Reinforcement's potential 30% damage increase (once the aforementioned bug is fixed),
    Rimefire Weaving is underwhelming with it's potential 10% damage increase. This is why I recommend to increase the damage bonus to at least 15%, given that it is easier to proc.

    Speaking of Elemental Reinforcement: It's already quite strong, but perhaps as a nice bonus it could convert Imprisonment's 15/25% arcane damage bonus into a 10/15% damage bonus from all your elemental attacks, since the feat already encourages using multiple elements.

    On a more unrealistic note, Rimefire Weaving could also convert all of the available arcane powers into either cold or fire powers: For instance, Magic Missiles, Ray of Enfeeblement and Oppresive Force would deal fire damage and apply smoulder, and the other powers would deal cold damage and apply chill. Additionally, you would no longer be able to gain stacks of Arcane Mastery. While probably a lot of work, this change could allows you to create a unique build around only dealing cold/fire damage. It also reinforces the feats core theme of alternating between fire and cold spells and fixes the issue of not wanting to use arcane powers with this feat since they provide/receive no damage bonus as is.
  • gildriadorgildriador Member Posts: 231 Arc User

    Some changes coming for the next update based on the feedback here:
    Encounters Repel and Chill Strike have been swapped.
    Feats Icy Veins and Frigid Winds have been swapped.

    Thanks for listening to our feedback,
    For Chill Strike do you will change it for is AoE version or bring back the possibility to be AoE in mastery slot or it will stay single target?
    With those changes, Snap Freeze will be in Arcanist path, are you open to remove it and bring back an old feats to be more in line with the Arcane theme?
    “He raised his staff. There was a roll of thunder. The sunlight was blotted out from the eastern windows; the whole hall became suddenly dark as night. The fire faded to sullen embers. Only Gandalf could be seen, standing white and tall before the blackened hearth.”
    ― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Two Towers
  • dariandelforddariandelford Member Posts: 45 Arc User
    Has anyone actually tested a brand new CW from the ground up, no equipment no nothing?
    Darian Del'Ford
    AKA Taco Brotherhood of Pathfinders
    Old Neverwinter Nights AOL Launched it all!
  • sekosek#5740 sekosek Member Posts: 120 Arc User
    Can someone inform us about how Directed Flames work with other two feats: Smoldering Recovery and Glowing Flames. They rely on dealing damage over time with smolder but Directed Flames removes the dot effect. So if we take Directed Flames, do these 2 feats dont work at all ? Or do they work like they apply all the dot stacks in one hit ?
  • rysiek86rysiek86 Member Posts: 145 Arc User
    edited March 2019

    Can someone inform us about how Directed Flames work with other two feats: Smoldering Recovery and Glowing Flames. They rely on dealing damage over time with smolder but Directed Flames removes the dot effect. So if we take Directed Flames, do these 2 feats dont work at all ? Or do they work like they apply all the dot stacks in one hit ?

    Directed Flames change Damage over Time to 1 hit with 75%dmg of overall DoT dmg. Effect of smoulder stays on target (if im not wrong for 4sec.) but does no damage anymore. After you deal another damage that can apply smoulder or rimfire it gives 1 hit with 75% value and refreshes the duration of smoulder/rimfire
    As I saw rest of the feats work as in the tooltips.
    Correct me please if im wrong.
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    edited March 2019

    Has anyone actually tested a brand new CW from the ground up, no equipment no nothing?

    I have. 5 times for the past 5 weeks, after every patch. It is getting a little tiring.

    Can someone inform us about how Directed Flames work with other two feats: Smoldering Recovery and Glowing Flames. They rely on dealing damage over time with smolder but Directed Flames removes the dot effect. So if we take Directed Flames, do these 2 feats dont work at all ? Or do they work like they apply all the dot stacks in one hit ?

    They do work, here is a log showing Smoldering Recovery for example, it is very good:


    It will trigger off the single tick of Smolder. Glowing Flames will tick once for 20% of the 75%.
  • theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    Speaking of Directed Flames (that's the instant smolder one, right?)-

    Doesn't it kind of undercut the entire concept of Smolder to turn it from a DoT to an instant damage effect? I feel like those are two radically different play styles of DPS, so if you're going to give someone a chance to be either DoT or instant (and I prefer the instant) it makes more sense to make that binary choice the FIRST not the LAST choice for the build. Otherwise a player runs around being all like "gotta keep up my DoTs" until BOOM now it's "gotta layer on as much instant damage as possible!"

    Still not sure how FtF works with the instant smolder damage.
  • sylverhawkesylverhawke Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    I look at using directed flames as follows. The dots happen but at an accelerated rate so it is multiple dots all at once. All effects related to the dot also trigger at that accelerated rate making it possible for smouldering recovery to work.

    The instant dot part of the feat is more for quick trash kills. Do as much damage at once. If you want to play the long fight, bosses, then got with the full dot effect.

    That’s my 2c anyway. I’m not into number crunching like Sharp though but I use his and others info. So thanks Sharp and other testers. Appreciate it.
  • noworries#8859 noworries Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 651 Cryptic Developer

    Some changes coming for the next update based on the feedback here:

    Encounters Repel and Chill Strike have been swapped.
    Feats Icy Veins and Frigid Winds have been swapped.
    Arcane Bolt we are going to look into taking off the induction charge which will speed it up a little bit. The final attack of the combo will grant arcane mastery and the damage has been adjusted to align with the change in speed.

    Fireball is something we can look into, but there are no promises that would be added into the class.

    I don't suppose I can convince you to change the name from Sudden Storm to Lightning Bolt?

    Also thanks for taking the Fireball issue seriously-I get that even doing something like repurposing a power that exists elsewhere is still a game balance concern, but I'd say there's a significant contingent of the player population that wants it.
    Renaming can always happen, if it isn't also a request to rebuild the power.

    I also forgot to include that I added back in a multi-target mastery version of Chill Strike as well.
  • theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User

    Some changes coming for the next update based on the feedback here:

    Encounters Repel and Chill Strike have been swapped.
    Feats Icy Veins and Frigid Winds have been swapped.
    Arcane Bolt we are going to look into taking off the induction charge which will speed it up a little bit. The final attack of the combo will grant arcane mastery and the damage has been adjusted to align with the change in speed.

    Fireball is something we can look into, but there are no promises that would be added into the class.

    I don't suppose I can convince you to change the name from Sudden Storm to Lightning Bolt?

    Also thanks for taking the Fireball issue seriously-I get that even doing something like repurposing a power that exists elsewhere is still a game balance concern, but I'd say there's a significant contingent of the player population that wants it.
    Renaming can always happen, if it isn't also a request to rebuild the power.

    I also forgot to include that I added back in a multi-target mastery version of Chill Strike as well.
    I could have swore you HAD mentioned that.

    If there was an existing AOE that was "just" an AOE direct damage, I'd say just change the damage type to fire and call it Fireball. But all the AOEs also have a control effect attached, so that's admittedly more of a challenge.
  • noworries#8859 noworries Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 651 Cryptic Developer



    I could have swore you HAD mentioned that.

    I thought I did too, maybe I'm just going crazy.
  • ralf1835ralf1835 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 18 Arc User
    Arcanist
    powerful pure damage is great for me, use arcane and lightning this element is characterized by quick killing enemies and also new daily what gives us personal buff add to this Imprisonment with additional buff to wizard is amazing, because it focuses arcane power on itself.

    Imprisonment the solution is brilliant because I only use it for trolling people on chult to catch rare moobs and they say “lol its bugged” and leave this moob and on BHE for the same reason and also on CODG to catch cubes because some blind dps wants to kill all opponents.
    Arcanist is pure magical damage and self buff to increase the damage dealt is
    good for person who wanna be a dps

    Thaumaturge
    one of the best aoe damage using cold and fire element, cold element applies to opponent stacks of chill to take more damage and smolder that radiates to enemies for additional aoe damage.
    But why there is no such things as a “bitter cold” and “frigid winds” to increase damage for all sources. After all the ice weakens and controls the opponents this is normal for this element, also fire element has the same properties on targets.

    I understand that you want to reduce buff and debuff on NW but you created two “hollow” DPS path, where is this wizard, old wizard from before mod 16, which has additional effects on TAB, with the possibility of weakening opponents using the elements of ice and fire, you removed what was unique for this class someone can say that the elements are unique in wizard, it's just like a Hunter’s bow or dagger on Rogue, someone can say when you want to play support change class on DC or OP i can say to him when you want to play DPS change to HR or TR these two classes are better than Wizard someone wrote on the forum about 10%.

    This post is directed to people who only consider damage on the mage. I do not know how you can only think like that, how can you see only the numbers, and where’s the uniqueness ?? What about people who like to cast magic while the same time want to support the group? Because you are listen to two or three people in forum or yt that are telling you this is the only way and you cry on NW forum: what I’ll do after nerf of chilling presence and spell storm back in mod 14/15.
  • zimxero#8085 zimxero Member Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    (removed out-dated skill suggestions)
    Post edited by zimxero#8085 on
  • theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User

    My overall impressions on MOD 16 have changed from horror over the stat system, to great optimism. The companion system is much improved. The anti-stats are implemented in a decent way, that is bland to me, but keeps all stats relevant. I will greatly miss recovery.. and hope they find ways to incorporate more encounter speed options in future mods. Lots complaining on test server about how hard it is now. I believe it is about right but needs tweaks. Most players on test server dont even have their guild boons running. This adds a LOT of power/defense. Quick testers are also usually not optimizing their new pets and pet gear which is also a huge difference in power.

    The new classes look and play OK. It is noteable, that all the skills were scaled down to level-1 tier. For damage skills this is not that big of a deal because tier 2,3, & 4 usually just added 10% damage. For other skills that are not so damage based, like Enfeeble, they are left very impotent. The Arcane Mastery feature gives 5% encounter speedup and 1% extra damage per arcane stack to non-arcane skills. Really? No one will use that.

    With less skills to choose from, it is imperative that each one is at least viable in some situations, or it is wasting pixel space. The new boon system has NO variety or decision making to a character who has completed all campaigns. Nearly every boon gets selected. Since some of the boons are total trash.. we get all the boons. I recommend they pull the 8 boons that give 1-5 offense/defense versus a monster type and replace them with other boons. In case you dont know... the guild enchantments that give +5/+10/+15 % offense/defense to monster types should simply be fixed. Currently only the +5 enchantments are working. The +10% and +15% enchantments cause no extra damage at all. Just fix that... and gives us some more interesting boon choices.


    Orb of Imposition (Class Feature): Nobody uses this now. They still wont. It increases the duration of your control powers by 20%.. which adds no noticeable effect when slotted. Please add 20% control resistance to the buff. Also add 2% debuff to all targets you control. Now it will get slotted once in awhile.

    Shard of the Endless Avalanche (Encounter): Again, no one uses this now, except for giggles. Its damage is crazy hard to control and not that high. The Arcane stack it gives while sitting idle (one every 4 seconds) is nice... but is negligible at the end of the day. Please add a 25 magnitude damage burst 15' from the orb every 4 seconds to coincide with the Arcane stack. This will at least give it more utility.

    Icy Rays (encounter): Now that Mastery no longer gives Chill Strike an AoE effect, Chill Strike & Icy Rays are almost clone skills, except that Icy Rays has to be tapped twice. I suggest spicing it up somehow. Maybe... give it three click effect useable on one or multiple targets.

    1st click: 250 magnitude damage, 500 magnitude if target unaffected by chill.
    2nd click: adds one chill stack
    3rd click: Removes all chill stacks and deals 100 magnitude damage per chill stack removed to target and surrounding enemies whithin 15'.

    For whatever it's worth, there was talk of readding AOE to Chill Strike.
  • miotest#5683 miotest Member Posts: 29 Arc User



    Are cooldowns supposed to be higher than what it is on live for LOW recovery characters?

    I don't believe that any of the Wizard's base cooldowns were increased in these changes.





    I would like to give one example where it failed: ICY TERRAIN - I think you have forgotten to count the RANK 4 modifier for cooldown (for EF it's okay)
  • ralf1835ralf1835 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    Arcanist
    Alacrity (feat paragon) Speed up the cooldown rate of your powers by 1% for each stack of Arcane
    because the arcanist is based on arcane mastery, he should make the most of this power and the connection with Astep Above Mastery we have very good combination

    it would be a great help to solve the problem with cooldown of encounter but I still have the feeling that cooldown on Icy Terrain, Shard of the Endless, Steal Time, Fanning the Flame it's too big, cut only for 2 seconds it is not so much but it doesn't hurt your eyes

    Fanning the Flame I understand that it has very large damage on aoe, but main hit is two times weaker or more than his DOT it's kinda weird

    Orb of Imposition (Class Feature) yes it is useless maybe we can change to: Increase Control Bonus and Resist by 20% and
    your controled powers have a X% chanse on use to control immune target


    for example :
    stack of chill can frozen immune targets
    rapel and steal time can stun immune targets
    wizard would become somehow unique in the team and not just "hollow" dps
  • nabidi2nabidi2 Member Posts: 10 Arc User
    try a little bit every day and 16 makes me feel like my pet died. wish i could have just not known it was coming and used the last 2 months of 15 to have fun playing instead of looking for my next game.
  • nova#2306 nova Member Posts: 152 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    Went to change my Paragon Path, and this happened
    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2evf5uq&s=9#.XIIm-ShKiUk
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    Nova - Thaumaturge Wizard
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