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ss or MOF

gokuson12345gokuson12345 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
which one does the most damage over all and which one will be more helpful in a dungeon and when you doing a grind

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  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,415 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    which one does the most damage over all

    Spellstorm

    which one will be more helpful in a dungeon

    Spellstorm

    and when you doing a grind

    Spellstorm, except for when there are opportunities to exploit idiot lfg teams looking for a MoF.
    OFcourse after devs completely changed cw so a spellstorm mage to be the only option now you can safely answer without thinking.
  • metalicum1metalicum1 Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    Spellstorm will produce better personal numbers. And it can also serve as primary or even secondary DPS in end game (To9G)
    MoF is not a good DPS, you always play MoF to get a hybrid of sort, it makes no sense to play MoF for personal/primary DPS.

    MoF can be built as a support (because it can produce high numbers of core debuff, it makes sense to focus it further with debuff companion, Drow race, debuff artifact (Vanguard Banner) etc), in which it performs well
    (by well I don't mean best, or "better")
    In dungeons, it depends what dungeon you farm and who's in your party.
    If you are 2 DPS-1 tank-1 cleric + you as a CW, properly built support MoF will be waaaay more useful than spellstorm.

    If you are end game party (to9G) running with Pally tank+ 2DCs + GF DPS, or GWF, or HR+ you, I think Spellstorm might be better, (Except Orcus boss fight I think support MoF outperforms SS by a big margin).
    Aris Meyde CW MoF Renegade

    [PS4] Alliance - House Stargaryen
  • namelesshero347namelesshero347 Member Posts: 2,109 Arc User
    Well, with loadouts, you can have both! I recently switched to a MoF buff build and I find the dps is sufficient even for chult. The build being a bit more durable helps also. My SS, while with a much higher dps, is a glass cannon.
  • metalicum1metalicum1 Member Posts: 200 Arc User

    Well, with loadouts, you can have both! I recently switched to a MoF buff build and I find the dps is sufficient even for chult. The build being a bit more durable helps also. My SS, while with a much higher dps, is a glass cannon.

    No you can't have everything with loadouts. Standard mod12b SS has almost no recovery, and you can't pull out a feasible MoF without at least 10-12k. I mean, play spellstorm if you want to play primary DPS thaum.

    In mod 13, you'll be forced into recovery anyway, as oppressor will most likely outperform Thaum by a big margin.
    Aris Meyde CW MoF Renegade

    [PS4] Alliance - House Stargaryen
  • namelesshero347namelesshero347 Member Posts: 2,109 Arc User


    No you can't have everything with loadouts. Standard mod12b SS has almost no recovery, and you can't pull out a feasible MoF without at least 10-12k. I mean, play spellstorm if you want to play primary DPS thaum.

    Valid point. My MoF is a buffer in feats and boons only. I am still using the same gear from my SS build. So its more of a buffer/dps build. It's okay. I really don't want to be acquiring and swapping gears for loadout changes.
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User

    Well, with loadouts, you can have both! I recently switched to a MoF buff build and I find the dps is sufficient even for chult. The build being a bit more durable helps also. My SS, while with a much higher dps, is a glass cannon.

    CW is very unique that it has 3 builds that can use effectively at end game.

    MoF Buffer
    MoF Hybrid
    SS DPS

    I personally like MoF builds over SS. I play both and play what I need to in content but my favorite build is my MoF DPS build which is now rarely used. And with Mod 13 it will probably retire for a SS Op single target DPS build and my current SS build will be updated for full on add DPS.

    I am going to make a comment that other may or may not agree with, play as you like, it is your character. If you like MoF dps, play as a MoF DPS. If you enjoy playing as a SS Renegade, do that. Play the way you want to as you will get more enjoyment from the game.

  • dupeksdupeks Member Posts: 1,789 Arc User
    I like MoF much better than SS for thematic reasons. Same reason I keep a PF wep enchant around... even though Frost is superior (have that too).

    The reality is that SS's better damage is usually more valuable in end-game situations than the MoF utility/debuffs. Even in Mod12, I can feel the difference... and that's with a suboptimal SS build.

    With the Mod13 changes coming... it sounds like MoF will be viable for non-endgame/thematic reasons only. That sucks. Hope the devs take note and make some adjustments. MoF is good fun, it deserves to be viable.

    Which isn't to say you can't play what you want. I still love HAMSTER around with my MoF and thoroughly enjoy the playstyle. That's why I really want MoF to get some love.
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    dupeks said:

    I like MoF much better than SS for thematic reasons. Same reason I keep a PF wep enchant around... even though Frost is superior (have that too).

    The reality is that SS's better damage is usually more valuable in end-game situations than the MoF utility/debuffs. Even in Mod12, I can feel the difference... and that's with a suboptimal SS build.

    With the Mod13 changes coming... it sounds like MoF will be viable for non-endgame/thematic reasons only. That sucks. Hope the devs take note and make some adjustments. MoF is good fun, it deserves to be viable.

    Which isn't to say you can't play what you want. I still love HAMSTER around with my MoF and thoroughly enjoy the playstyle. That's why I really want MoF to get some love.

    Than you are running with the wrong groups. A MoF debuffer is welcomed at end game in my groups. We understand how things stack and if you run a companion that buff or debuffs, well even better.

  • dupeksdupeks Member Posts: 1,789 Arc User


    Than you are running with the wrong groups. A MoF debuffer is welcomed at end game in my groups. We understand how things stack and if you run a companion that buff or debuffs, well even better.

    I think you misread XD
    dupeks said:

    Even in Mod12, I can feel the difference... and that's with a suboptimal SS build.

    *snip*

    I still love HAMSTER around with my MoF and thoroughly enjoy the playstyle.

    Translation: I still play MoF, I love to play MoF, I prefer to play MoF and rarely have issues getting into parties.

    But in "end-game" content, for big bad boss battles, it just makes sense to swap to SS. I can still have RoE and my debuff enchant if I want, but the added damage from SS outpaces the incremental debuffs that MoF adds. It's clearly noticeable in the clear speed (tried on subsequent runs same party).

    Especially if we're already rocking any other support friends who provide debuffs, the modest amount of diminished incremental debuffs can't keep pace with adding more "base" damage that benefits from all of those buffs and debuffs we have floating around.

    MoF is probably my 2nd favorite play-style in this game. I want it to be more viable. I'm worried about mod13. But I also see no benefit in pretending that MoF is not under-performing since the debuff rework.
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,405 Arc User
    There's nobody saying that MoF is bad to the point of being a joke spec. Unlike kits like Damnationlock or Instigator GWF, MoF at least has a kit which functions and has some synergy. The problem with MoF is that MoF is simply overshadowed by much better options, and in a team with merely 5 players, there's going to be a lot of competition for those 5 spots.

    In a BiS endgame party (or even regular endgame party), SS would be more practical than MoF due to the damage output provided by SS being more useful to a team than the MoF's exclusive debuffs.

    Sure, a MoF could add a few extra million to the GWF's IBS or GF's Griffons' hits. However, in order to win, it doesn't matter who does the damage or how high the hits are since your only win condition is to reduce the enemy's HP to zero.

    What matters most is if the damage is done, preferably as fast as possible, and SS excels in that field to a far greater extent than MoF. After all, we know how RNGezus is, so using the law of large numbers in regards to run times helps us alleviate our issues with the rewards.

    The only time you could justify MoF being better than SS is on Avatar of Orcus, because Bloody Death double dips debuffs.

  • dairyzeusdairyzeus Member Posts: 304 Arc User
    I've actually been having surprisingly good success with my debuff/dps build in T9G, to the point where it's become my default loadout for that dungeon. Especially if I've got a strong single target dps with me.

    I'm not saying it's the best loadout for every group (I agree SS is still better in a fully decked out well played team), but for the average endgame groups I'll run with, I've been seeing better times with the hybrid build.
  • neidanman#1423 neidanman Member Posts: 82 Arc User


    In mod 13, you'll be forced into recovery anyway, as oppressor will most likely outperform Thaum by a big margin.

    dupeks said:

    With the Mod13 changes coming... it sounds like MoF will be viable for non-endgame/thematic reasons only.

    Can anyone tell me what changes are coming that are being referred to here? I've read the patch notes but can't see what would cause either of these.
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    The issue with a MoF Buffer is not a CW issue but an issue due to doubling up on DC's. If the devs find a way to make double DC's not a meta than there would be a place in groups at end game for a MoF buffer.

  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,415 Arc User
    edited February 2018

    The issue with a MoF Buffer is not a CW issue but an issue due to doubling up on DC's. If the devs find a way to make double DC's not a meta than there would be a place in groups at end game for a MoF buffer.

    items with debuff and classes with debuff in a diminishing return system.
    if this called normal 50% debuff to come from companions then i want a companion to give for each member 20% buff and stack so we can get rid of buffers too:) .

    items are a big problem.....
    Post edited by mamalion1234 on
  • metalicum1metalicum1 Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    There will be a spot for MoF debuffer build (proper, not Thaum that slots swath) in the 10 people trial, if anything.
    And really, I don't see how being outclassed a little by other classes is a problem. It's not like our party has a Scourge Warlock Fury as a main DPS, oh wait it does. And we still do fine runs in anything we do in this game.
    Is it suboptimal? maybe. but 23-25 min runs, without skipping, in tomb are ok with me. It's not 20, or 15. But it's better than 90% of meta groups out there (speaking from "young" ps4 platform, which probably has the most inexperienced players of all)

    In mod 13 trial, both Templock and MoF will have a place in party imho. Also, MoF dos not suddenly becomes damage-less after going away from SS.

    Aris Meyde CW MoF Renegade

    [PS4] Alliance - House Stargaryen
  • kozi001kozi001 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    SS thaum on trash. CW is still the best trash clearer. (Until ligthning rework)
    Change loadout for Mof thaum on Boss. Helps the other dps with debuff w/o losing much dps.

    If you are alone as dps and no good dps/supports around you than you should stay SS thaum.

    You can try Mof/Renegade in raids. I am unsure its usability in 5-ppl dungeons. Compared to the DC/GF/OP holy trinity. Sadly even Templocks will perform better than Mof/Rene in dungeons imho after mod13.
  • metalicum1metalicum1 Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    kozi001 said:

    SS thaum on trash. CW is still the best trash clearer. (Until ligthning rework)
    Change loadout for Mof thaum on Boss. Helps the other dps with debuff w/o losing much dps.

    If you are alone as dps and no good dps/supports around you than you should stay SS thaum.

    You can try Mof/Renegade in raids. I am unsure its usability in 5-ppl dungeons. Compared to the DC/GF/OP holy trinity. Sadly even Templocks will perform better than Mof/Rene in dungeons imho after mod13.

    Thaum? Why would you play thaum on AoE?
    Thaum will get you Assailing, terrible in AoE, Elemental empowerment, which is mindbogglingly terrible in AoE, and spell twisting which you can easily replace by 8-10k recovery or less. (building up recovery seems to be necessary for mod 13 anyway)

    In Ren tree, on the other hand, you get Big AoE combat advantage (for EVERYTHING), which is a big crit severity boost for you (and secondary DPS) - in my case 40%+ ish (forget getting CA from GF in big AoEs like tomb), Masterful Arcane theft for 45% dmg increase of steal time, and Chaos magic, which is at least 13-15% dmg boost, again for the entire party. (since we know from ACT logs Fury procs much much more than Growth, with rate sometimes over 50%)
    And if you don't like combat advantage or you believe in other classes to provide it (CW has glorious uptime though), you can still take 15% crit severity from phantasmal destruction. Again with very solid uptime.

    I would choose Rene over Thaum every single time. In my view it's not even a competition. SS and MoF. Even if alone.
    But let's be clear, Even 13k pala tank can do dmg, and 15% increase + CA is solid, better than Assailing (which is like 4% of your dmg output), or the dots from elemental, which are terrible. Plus, at low levels your Chaos Nexus Actually does something.

    Aris Meyde CW MoF Renegade

    [PS4] Alliance - House Stargaryen
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    edited February 2018

    kozi001 said:

    SS thaum on trash. CW is still the best trash clearer. (Until ligthning rework)
    Change loadout for Mof thaum on Boss. Helps the other dps with debuff w/o losing much dps.

    If you are alone as dps and no good dps/supports around you than you should stay SS thaum.

    You can try Mof/Renegade in raids. I am unsure its usability in 5-ppl dungeons. Compared to the DC/GF/OP holy trinity. Sadly even Templocks will perform better than Mof/Rene in dungeons imho after mod13.

    Thaum? Why would you play thaum on AoE?
    Thaum will get you Assailing, terrible in AoE, Elemental empowerment, which is mindbogglingly terrible in AoE, and spell twisting which you can easily replace by 8-10k recovery or less. (building up recovery seems to be necessary for mod 13 anyway)

    In Ren tree, on the other hand, you get Big AoE combat advantage (for EVERYTHING), which is a big crit severity boost for you (and secondary DPS) - in my case 40%+ ish (forget getting CA from GF in big AoEs like tomb), Masterful Arcane theft for 45% dmg increase of steal time, and Chaos magic, which is at least 13-15% dmg boost, again for the entire party. (since we know from ACT logs Fury procs much much more than Growth, with rate sometimes over 50%)
    And if you don't like combat advantage or you believe in other classes to provide it (CW has glorious uptime though), you can still take 15% crit severity from phantasmal destruction. Again with very solid uptime.

    I would choose Rene over Thaum every single time. In my view it's not even a competition. SS and MoF. Even if alone.
    But let's be clear, Even 13k pala tank can do dmg, and 15% increase + CA is solid, better than Assailing (which is like 4% of your dmg output), or the dots from elemental, which are terrible. Plus, at low levels your Chaos Nexus Actually does something.

    If you are going off (not my image, i'm assuming @oria1 doesn't mind if I repost it) this log it is very easy to calculate that the rate from this sample size is 846/(618+327+846)*100=47.236%. This is less than the "expected" value if you assume all the different combinations can proc, which would be 4/7*100=57.142% but that is because not all outcomes are equally likely (which you can also see from the difference in proc numbers).

    Anyhow on the topic of thaum vs rene you raise an interesting point, although if you are in a party with a good GF id argue CA uptime is close to 100%, the point about MAT and PD is good. The main "advantage" of going Thaum is you can take Spell Twisting and Icy Veins for trash however, if you stacked some recovery (which you would want for an Oppressor Loadout anyhow) you could take IV regardless. IV is a huge dps boost vs trash and is kind of mandatory imo for a trash clear loadout.
  • metalicum1metalicum1 Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    edited February 2018

    kozi001 said:

    SS thaum on trash. CW is still the best trash clearer. (Until ligthning rework)
    Change loadout for Mof thaum on Boss. Helps the other dps with debuff w/o losing much dps.

    If you are alone as dps and no good dps/supports around you than you should stay SS thaum.

    You can try Mof/Renegade in raids. I am unsure its usability in 5-ppl dungeons. Compared to the DC/GF/OP holy trinity. Sadly even Templocks will perform better than Mof/Rene in dungeons imho after mod13.

    Thaum? Why would you play thaum on AoE?
    Thaum will get you Assailing, terrible in AoE, Elemental empowerment, which is mindbogglingly terrible in AoE, and spell twisting which you can easily replace by 8-10k recovery or less. (building up recovery seems to be necessary for mod 13 anyway)

    In Ren tree, on the other hand, you get Big AoE combat advantage (for EVERYTHING), which is a big crit severity boost for you (and secondary DPS) - in my case 40%+ ish (forget getting CA from GF in big AoEs like tomb), Masterful Arcane theft for 45% dmg increase of steal time, and Chaos magic, which is at least 13-15% dmg boost, again for the entire party. (since we know from ACT logs Fury procs much much more than Growth, with rate sometimes over 50%)
    And if you don't like combat advantage or you believe in other classes to provide it (CW has glorious uptime though), you can still take 15% crit severity from phantasmal destruction. Again with very solid uptime.

    I would choose Rene over Thaum every single time. In my view it's not even a competition. SS and MoF. Even if alone.
    But let's be clear, Even 13k pala tank can do dmg, and 15% increase + CA is solid, better than Assailing (which is like 4% of your dmg output), or the dots from elemental, which are terrible. Plus, at low levels your Chaos Nexus Actually does something.

    If you are going off (not my image, i'm assuming @oria1 doesn't mind if I repost it) this log it is very easy to calculate that the rate from this sample size is 846/(618+327+846)*100=47.236%. This is less than the "expected" value if you assume all the different combinations can proc, which would be 4/7*100=57.142% but that is because not all outcomes are equally likely (which you can also see from the difference in proc numbers).

    Anyhow on the topic of thaum vs rene you raise an interesting point, although if you are in a party with a good GF id argue CA uptime is close to 100%, the point about MAT and PD is good. The main "advantage" of going Thaum is you can take Spell Twisting and Icy Veins for trash however, if you stacked some recovery (which you would want for an Oppressor Loadout anyhow) you could take IV regardless. IV is a huge dps boost vs trash and is kind of mandatory imo for a trash clear loadout.

    In the question of IV vs. ER with Rene capstone, I can only provide close to worthless personal experience, that Elemental R. loadout consistently performs better in terms of overall clear time and personal dmg output.
    (also, in the same way, Rene outperforms Thaum in terms of clear time, or course, It cannot (EDIT:it can, though the difference is harder to spot and calculate) outperform Thaum in personal overall paingiver number because of CA buff and Chaos are not personal, while Thaum capstone or IV are).
    Though that personal experience has too many variables, that making any general conclusion would be a mistake. That is why I try to argue numbers.

    I also have to say, to be as honest as possible, that my view of GF CA specifically (even unconscious bias) is radically influenced by ps4 GF population, which has very little to none of good end game players currently (my time zone anyway). That is something anyone reading this should know.
    Post edited by metalicum1 on
    Aris Meyde CW MoF Renegade

    [PS4] Alliance - House Stargaryen
  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,415 Arc User
    edited February 2018

    kozi001 said:

    SS thaum on trash. CW is still the best trash clearer. (Until ligthning rework)
    Change loadout for Mof thaum on Boss. Helps the other dps with debuff w/o losing much dps.

    If you are alone as dps and no good dps/supports around you than you should stay SS thaum.

    You can try Mof/Renegade in raids. I am unsure its usability in 5-ppl dungeons. Compared to the DC/GF/OP holy trinity. Sadly even Templocks will perform better than Mof/Rene in dungeons imho after mod13.

    Thaum? Why would you play thaum on AoE?
    Thaum will get you Assailing, terrible in AoE, Elemental empowerment, which is mindbogglingly terrible in AoE, and spell twisting which you can easily replace by 8-10k recovery or less. (building up recovery seems to be necessary for mod 13 anyway)

    In Ren tree, on the other hand, you get Big AoE combat advantage (for EVERYTHING), which is a big crit severity boost for you (and secondary DPS) - in my case 40%+ ish (forget getting CA from GF in big AoEs like tomb), Masterful Arcane theft for 45% dmg increase of steal time, and Chaos magic, which is at least 13-15% dmg boost, again for the entire party. (since we know from ACT logs Fury procs much much more than Growth, with rate sometimes over 50%)
    And if you don't like combat advantage or you believe in other classes to provide it (CW has glorious uptime though), you can still take 15% crit severity from phantasmal destruction. Again with very solid uptime.

    I would choose Rene over Thaum every single time. In my view it's not even a competition. SS and MoF. Even if alone.
    But let's be clear, Even 13k pala tank can do dmg, and 15% increase + CA is solid, better than Assailing (which is like 4% of your dmg output), or the dots from elemental, which are terrible. Plus, at low levels your Chaos Nexus Actually does something.

    If you are going off (not my image, i'm assuming @oria1 doesn't mind if I repost it) this log it is very easy to calculate that the rate from this sample size is 846/(618+327+846)*100=47.236%. This is less than the "expected" value if you assume all the different combinations can proc, which would be 4/7*100=57.142% but that is because not all outcomes are equally likely (which you can also see from the difference in proc numbers).

    Anyhow on the topic of thaum vs rene you raise an interesting point, although if you are in a party with a good GF id argue CA uptime is close to 100%, the point about MAT and PD is good. The main "advantage" of going Thaum is you can take Spell Twisting and Icy Veins for trash however, if you stacked some recovery (which you would want for an Oppressor Loadout anyhow) you could take IV regardless. IV is a huge dps boost vs trash and is kind of mandatory imo for a trash clear loadout.
    Conduit of ice from far 5 chills easily terain meelee range freeze + for sure mobs will get the nightmare wizardry. Also a strong wizard playing with a very good team do not need more than 1 rotation to rely to spell twisting ( at least in aoe case).
  • oria1oria1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 263 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    I would suggest is better to examine everything under the concept of time rather as No of procs.

    For example we have 846 procs, divide by 5 members = 169 procs of fury. Each proc lasts 10 sec so *10/60 = 28.1 minutes uptime. Now there if a chance that fury would proc in a middle of a fight so we can say that there are average 14 group and boss fights in tomb. Since fury could proc at the end or the beginning of a fight so its 1 to 10 sec uptime we can think of an average of 5 sec wasted per fight. so 14 X 5 sec = 70 sec possible waste is a 1690 sec (28.1m) uptime.

    The specific combat log was 2 runs in tomb, both done in 40m. so we have 28m uptime in 40m runs or about 70% uptime.

    Also we need to remember that each proc is not individual but 2 can coexist most of the time even tho they don't fire up at the same time. How do we know that? The combined procs were 618+846+327 = 1791 procs /5 members = 358 procs *10 sec /60sec per minute = 60m rounded which would exceed the actual 40 min run.

    Since fury is the dominant proc by far, it's safe to assume that fury proced a lot more often concurrently with either nexus or growth rather then nexus and growth together. My calculations show its 88% of the double (or triple) procs had fury in them and 12% didn't, but I'm still working on that to make it more accurate in the limited time I have due to work.

    I also want to add here that, this is not absolute and it does fluctuate but nevertheless in 85+ act recordings as renegade I keep seeing fury mostly 1st and growth always last.

    Again don't take the above as absolute but rather as a good indication of how chaos magic works in a dungeon fight. Don't try this at dummies, when dummies go to zero hp(die), there are several issues with procs happening.

    As always open to any corrections or suggestions.





  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    oria1 said:

    I would suggest is better to examine everything under the concept of time rather as No of procs.

    For example we have 846 procs, divide by 5 members = 169 procs of fury. Each proc lasts 10 sec so *10/60 = 28.1 minutes uptime. Now there if a chance that fury would proc in a middle of a fight so we can say that there are average 14 group and boss fights in tomb. Since fury could proc at the end or the beginning of a fight so its 1 to 10 sec uptime we can think of an average of 5 sec wasted per fight. so 14 X 5 sec = 70 sec possible waste is a 1690 sec (28.1m) uptime.

    The specific combat log was 2 runs in tomb, both done in 40m. so we have 28m uptime in 40m runs or about 70% uptime.

    Also we need to remember that each proc is not individual but 2 can coexist most of the time even tho they don't fire up at the same time. How do we know that? The combined procs were 618+846+327 = 1791 procs /5 members = 358 procs *10 sec /60sec per minute = 60m rounded which would exceed the actual 40 min run.

    Since fury is the dominant proc by far, it's safe to assume that fury proced a lot more often concurrently with either nexus or growth rather then nexus and growth together. My calculations show its 88% of the double (or triple) procs had fury in them and 12% didn't, but I'm still working on that to make it more accurate in the limited time I have due to work.

    I also want to add here that, this is not absolute and it does fluctuate but nevertheless in 85+ act recordings as renegade I keep seeing fury mostly 1st and growth always last.

    Again don't take the above as absolute but rather as a good indication of how chaos magic works in a dungeon fight. Don't try this at dummies, when dummies go to zero hp(die), there are several issues with procs happening.

    As always open to any corrections or suggestions.

    An easier way to check this would be to go afk at dummies with a low damage weapon and just have your toon spam chilling cloud for a few hours. I was planning to do it myself at some stage, if you do it on preview at a SH dummy with a toon name like, "go away im testing" you are unlikely to be disturbed during the process. You could even leave your game running overnight like that for a better sample size.
  • oria1oria1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 263 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    I agree but problem is... that's not how you get double procs sadly. You need a kinda of specific procedure that involves encounters. Also that would not simulate what is really happening inside a run.

    I'm making a specific parser to be honest that will read the saved combat logs and calculate the start/end of fights and the proc of each chaos as well as concurrent procs and show the uptime and proc rate in actual combat over several combats to be more accurate.




  • ravnazrael1ravnazrael1 Member Posts: 36 Arc User
    Ive been wanting to make a strong mof dps build for some time but every time I tried it just seems lackluster compared to spellstorm. Really wish there were some other options for CW dps builds. If anyone has some insight would be appreciated.
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    edited February 2018
    oria1 said:

    I agree but problem is... that's not how you get double procs sadly. You need a kinda of specific procedure that involves encounters. Also that would not simulate what is really happening inside a run.

    I'm making a specific parser to be honest that will read the saved combat logs and calculate the start/end of fights and the proc of each chaos as well as concurrent procs and show the uptime and proc rate in actual combat over several combats to be more accurate.

    I agree that dummies never translate into real world results.

    The devs of a prior game I played made all of the class do equal damage within X amount of time at the sparring targets. End result is that some of the classes were so bad that they became usesless in the game many player quit the game due to that.

    Results need to be conducted in dungeons to be properly compared.

    I have ran my CW Buffer now through T9 a few times and without a DO. Our runs are just as fast, if not faster, than me on my DC as a DO. My DC typically does 85% of the damage our the OP Tank I run with but my CW does 50% more damage than the Tank; the extra damage I produce on my CW outweighs the extra buffs that a DO provides.

    I formed a group and many DPS kept leaving as we were not running with a 2nd DO. I had to reach the bottom barrel of the DPS world to get through my first T9 as a buffer with just 1 DC. The DPS were barely 14k. We beat T9 in under 45 minutes. When we got our regular group with me on my CW Buffer we did T9 one minute longer than our average run on my DO and we even wiped on the last boss where we did not wipe with my DO. Let me state that again, we wiped on the last boss on my CW run.

    This tells me that the Meta should not include a DO but a CW MoF buffer.

    We run a OP, 2 DC, a GWF and a GF or a HR in our runs. Our run times average around 26-35 minutes. If we go with a GF our times drop to the 26-30 minute mark vs 30-35 with a HR. Our regular group runs it in around 33 minutes. With me on my CW we did it in 34 minutes and we had to wipe due to one of the DPS falling off about half way through the last boss fight. Our regular group time would have been below our average.

    The run I consider best t9 for me was on my GF, my friend on his AC/DC build, a MoF Buffer, a SW and a HR. It did take longer than most other runs due to lag on my end. It was my favorite run due to it having a CW and a SW in there instead of a GWF and a 2nd DC. It also provides you can complete the dungeon just fine not using a meta. The time for that run was under an hour and we wiped a few times on the last boss because the CW was not paying attention and kept failing off the edge.

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