Remember trapper will benefit from seeker's vengeance just as much so it doesn't make combat immediately better than trapper. At first I didn't agree with the flurry changes but now I'm alright. I think it'll be better for us and hopefully put us above trapper damage wise. Marauder's Rush will be good for rushing down mobs in msp and other mob filled dungeons. The change actually does open up new possibilities.
Remember trapper will benefit from seeker's vengeance just as much so it doesn't make combat immediately better than trapper. At first I didn't agree with the flurry changes but now I'm alright. I think it'll be better for us and hopefully put us above trapper damage wise. Marauder's Rush will be good for rushing down mobs in msp and other mob filled dungeons. The change actually does open up new possibilities.
Trapper will not benefit in any way from SV, because SV will still be a smaller / less reliable damage increase for trapper than AotP + AotS.
This is also why trapper does not care whatsoever that literally all of PF is garbage other than CA and Slasher's Mark -- they don't use at-wills so have room for CA without a trade-off, and they have 2 very clear BiS class features already.
Combat PF can make decent use of Serpent but SV will be substantially better. SW Combat has two "okay" options in Blade Storm and Twin Blade Storm, but SV will probably win over those as well.
Seeker's will benefit everyone, hell even archery. When I was trapper and when seeker's was not broken I used it. The only trapper's who can't use it are those who can't position themselves properly which is very easy. Seeker's vengeance just brings them back to where they were before it was broken. It's not hard to get behind a pack of mobs or a boss. This allows them to drop the pack offhand bonus and go back to serpent offhand bonus for the extra 3% dmg. Simple math brother.
Thank you for the writeup! I was looking for a good HR build for my little elf. I use some of my alts to farm Dread Ring marks. My elf has lower gear score (800ish). But she outperforms my SW and TR who are 10k.
I made a minor change to the feats as I gear up my HR. I used Wild Medicine instead of Warden's Courage. I am not sure how much that impacts my DPS, but I survive easily and top the paingiver in Thrones (I am new at this, so my rotations are not optimized yet).
Shadowclad enchants so cheap now (PC) and are easy way to boost survivability for low gear score.
Remember trapper will benefit from seeker's vengeance just as much so it doesn't make combat immediately better than trapper. At first I didn't agree with the flurry changes but now I'm alright. I think it'll be better for us and hopefully put us above trapper damage wise. Marauder's Rush will be good for rushing down mobs in msp and other mob filled dungeons. The change actually does open up new possibilities.
Trapper will not benefit in any way from SV, because SV will still be a smaller / less reliable damage increase for trapper than AotP + AotS.
This is also why trapper does not care whatsoever that literally all of PF is garbage other than CA and Slasher's Mark -- they don't use at-wills so have room for CA without a trade-off, and they have 2 very clear BiS class features already.
Combat PF can make decent use of Serpent but SV will be substantially better. SW Combat has two "okay" options in Blade Storm and Twin Blade Storm, but SV will probably win over those as well.
Sorry but this is nonsense. If you are a Trapper using AotS and not using At-Wills then you are losing DPS and not playing Trapper to its full benefit. I have been saying this since Mod 5 or whatever and trying to correct people, I am surprised you still think that way.
If you use AotS you will have 2 stacks of it in your buff bar... You use and Encounter, 1 stack left, another Encounter you are at Neutral stacks, your 3rd Encounter takes you to 1 stack of the opposite AotS stack. You are left 1 short unless you use a Daily in every single rotation (melee and Ranged) or you sneak in an At-Will every rotation. If you are using Careful Attack on an enemy you need to put in 2 very quick At-Wills when in Ranged Stance to be certain you overcome the extra stacks from Careful Attack (which is still half bugged).
Hell I am a Trapper and I even have Death Slaad in my Actives, which is At-Will based. At Epic it procs all the time.
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
People used to use the Death Slaad back in the day when its poisonous intent was bugged out and would stack and tick infinitely . It was fix sadly lol was awesome to see the dmg coming from that thing. forward to the 50 sec mark. it was fixed 2 years ago .
Yeah lol I never said the Death Slaad is BiS or anything like that... I use him in my Actives for 2 reasons.
1. His active is a novelty and actually procs all the time, I have so many random hits going off in my attacks this just adds to them. Just a bit of fun instead of just flat damage increases all the time.
2. The main reason I have him there is he has the EXACT same slots as my Summoned Shadow Demon. This allows me to easily swap my Companion equipment over to the Slaad. The Shadow Demon is an absolute beast of a Companion, but his teleport makes him 100% useless against bosses like the Dragon Turtle etc. So easy swapping in those places makes the Slaad one of the best for me.
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
I believe the death slaad to be very good for boss fights but I really need to get a log of some hard fight (like avatar of orcus) to prove its efficiency.
My death slaad is purposely left at rare quality because at epic quality adding a stack when the target already has 5 resets all stacks and deals an AoE attack which is very weak (considering only one target) compared to the DoT done by 5 stacks.
Epic quality would probably be better for AoE damage but single target is all that matters to me.
Keeping 5 stacks constantly running on a boss actually is very easy thanks to careful attack and the heavy use of at-wills of the combat spec.
I gotcha on the novelty. That was the reason why I used to use my Lightfoot theif. Just to watch all the numbers even though the damage miniscule. Makes it look more fun
I've just gotten a log of my damage in ToNG, here are the results for Poisonous Intent (Death Slaad's DoT) : - Avatar of Orcus : 0.49% of the damage done (not counting Bloody Death which comes from the red curse) - Withers : 0.97% - Ras Nsi : 0.53%
So yeah it's pretty bad. Got to replace it.
I have two options available atm : Fire Archon or Erinyes of Belial
Erinyes gives 10% crit severity. I have 134% crit severity and 15% combat advantage bonus.
Considering 100% crit chance (I'm not far) and 100% CA (AotP), Erinyes would give :
10 / 264 = 3.78% more damage
With a vorpal enchantment it would be even worse. (10/314=3.18%)
Fire Archon (with earth and air archons) gives 8% for targets with less than 50% HP and 0.5% for both earth and air.
Considering Fire to be active 50% of the time (which may not be perfectly accurate) and Earth and Air to be always active (which is pretty much the case), Fire Archon would give :
I've just gotten a log of my damage in ToNG, here are the results for Poisonous Intent (Death Slaad's DoT) : - Avatar of Orcus : 0.49% of the damage done (not counting Bloody Death which comes from the red curse) - Withers : 0.97% - Ras Nsi : 0.53%
So yeah it's pretty bad. Got to replace it.
I have two options available atm : Fire Archon or Erinyes of Belial
Erinyes gives 10% crit severity. I have 134% crit severity and 15% combat advantage bonus.
Considering 100% crit chance (I'm not far) and 100% CA (AotP), Erinyes would give :
10 / 264 = 3.78% more damage
With a vorpal enchantment it would be even worse. (10/314=3.18%)
Fire Archon (with earth and air archons) gives 8% for targets with less than 50% HP and 0.5% for both earth and air.
Considering Fire to be active 50% of the time (which may not be perfectly accurate) and Earth and Air to be always active (which is pretty much the case), Fire Archon would give :
So I'm gonna replace the poor Death Slaad by a Fire Archon.
You should also replace the Earth Archon IMO there is way to much aoe and misc damage floating around in ToNG for that to have a decent uptime., I am currently running Fire, Air archon, Siegemaster, Wild Hunt Rider with a Paranoid Delusion as my summoned. I also have a Erinyes of Belial but my crit sev (depending on what food i use, 157/162%) with 100% crit 18.7% + 15% base CA dmg bonus. I'm using Trans Fey for a weapon enchant. So a Erinyes wouldn't do that well for me I think.
Even after the nerf the Wild Hunt Rider is still getting good uptime.
Just ran a quick ToNG with the guild. We had OP tank 12.7k Ilvl alt, AC 16.5k IL main+ DO 15.5k alt DC's was not running hastening light, HB Temp Lock 14k ilvl was his first run, and Myself (SW Combat HR) 16.7k ilvl. I used a Trans Lightning on all the trash packs and on the final boss and I used Trans Fey on Orcus and Weithers. We had zero wipes with very minimal deaths. You could say this setup was/could have been an avg PUG group from /Tong_3k channel, No need to have everyone max out. My Companions are summoned- Paranoid Delusion, then Air Archon, Fire Archon, Siege Master and Wild Hunt Rider.
Sorry for some reason I just cant get a clear image to post so here are some direct links.
I was testing out Lingering Curse in there that run and It seems rather under whelming. 95 hits for a total of 900k dmg with a max hit of 30k but avg hit of 9473.68.
I should have stuck with Trans Fey for Ras I think. It took about a 1 1/2 min longer than usual and my dps was about 400k lower that run on Ras than normal. Over all though not a bad run 4:35 Orcus, 1:56 Weithers, 5:28 Ras.
@eliybeats so 90 mil dmg from Blade Storm for the whole dungeon I do believe SV will add way more than that and if they fixed Executioner's Black Attire thats a sweet 24% more dmg potential will look rather nice in there.
Now this is what I would call an avg group for ToNG atm. I picture we will get a considerable jump in DPS with a max out BIS group for max Powre Share. Then toss in the fixed BtS, FmF and BoB, add to that a fixed SV and Flurry. We will be hard to beat out.
Is SW actually really better for packs of mobs, or there is actually no big difference between SW and PF? And also - what's the power setup with SW? Do I replace Thorn Strike with StS?
Nice @dragonsbane3 . I can't wait myself to unlock it. Didn't know you already had gotten your lightning enchant. Will definitely have to test you out and can't wait for sv and ba fix myself. Already know my rotations and playstyle for when it's back on. @wizardlvl80#5963 at very high level gameplay it's not as big of a difference but there's definitely difference. In order for me to keep up with @dragonsbane3 I have to play even more aggressive than usual on my pf combat when it comes to mobs. N yes, thorn strike isn't needed in sws rotation. Throw caution all the way.
Is SW actually really better for packs of mobs, or there is actually no big difference between SW and PF? And also - what's the power setup with SW? Do I replace Thorn Strike with StS?
Yes SW is fundamentally better at AoE than PF for a few reasons. ATM SW uses AoTP and Bladestorm for its class features, Bladestorm gets a lot of hate but it can provide some nice burst and sustain free dmg for you. Also SW has Throw Caution which really boosts our dmg and we have it with 100% uptime.
The major difference between SW and PF setups are, SW has better AoE ie with Blade storm and throw caution, PF has slightly better single target potential ie with thorn ward debuff in their rotation and Careful Attack, PF has a major movement advantage over SW ie being able to slot a 2nd daily that is worth while slashers mark and being able to pick either Fleet Stance or Readied Stance as more quality of life improvements.
As SW I use AoTP/Blade Storm, StS/TC, CoA/PG, LS/GW, SS/SS, (AS/AS or ES/CtG) depending if I want extra AoE or a single target dot, and finally Forrest ghost as our only viable Daily.
As PF I use AoTP/AoLW or AoTS if you want to micro manage stacks, TW/TS, CoA/PG, LS/GW, SS/SS, HT/CA, Forrest Ghost/Slashers Mark.
Nice dmg, I see you stuck with lightning enchant for the whole dungeon. Do you prefer that or just use it for the CDR?
To be honest, lightning is the only enchantment I have. But it certainly isn't great for bosses, lightning burst deals almost no damage (even if it was fixed it probably wouldnt be all that great) even the CDR isn't useful since it only works with arcs and with OP's and DC's around it does very little.
I don't have much to invest in another enchantment but maybe I could try and get a perfect vorpal. That would give me roughly 18% more damage, so a lot more than lightning.
Question, I have mythic Wheel of Elements, Eye of the Giant, and Lantern of Revelation in a (Meta BiS group) which do you guys think is better to run as the primary artifact? I've been using the wheel but I'm thinking the debuff from lantern may be better.
Wheel. Since debuffs have diminishing returns and you'll already have dcs/CW's debuffing wheel is better. Especially if you're doing 1-2 dps groups. You don't need to help anybody else benefit. Personally I like eye since I don't have to worry about getting which buff. Helps with the rotation and proccing artificers.
Comments
This is also why trapper does not care whatsoever that literally all of PF is garbage other than CA and Slasher's Mark -- they don't use at-wills so have room for CA without a trade-off, and they have 2 very clear BiS class features already.
Combat PF can make decent use of Serpent but SV will be substantially better. SW Combat has two "okay" options in Blade Storm and Twin Blade Storm, but SV will probably win over those as well.
Nvm. Just saw the other thread.
I made a minor change to the feats as I gear up my HR. I used Wild Medicine instead of Warden's Courage. I am not sure how much that impacts my DPS, but I survive easily and top the paingiver in Thrones (I am new at this, so my rotations are not optimized yet).
Shadowclad enchants so cheap now (PC) and are easy way to boost survivability for low gear score.
If you use AotS you will have 2 stacks of it in your buff bar... You use and Encounter, 1 stack left, another Encounter you are at Neutral stacks, your 3rd Encounter takes you to 1 stack of the opposite AotS stack. You are left 1 short unless you use a Daily in every single rotation (melee and Ranged) or you sneak in an At-Will every rotation. If you are using Careful Attack on an enemy you need to put in 2 very quick At-Wills when in Ranged Stance to be certain you overcome the extra stacks from Careful Attack (which is still half bugged).
Hell I am a Trapper and I even have Death Slaad in my Actives, which is At-Will based. At Epic it procs all the time.
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
1. His active is a novelty and actually procs all the time, I have so many random hits going off in my attacks this just adds to them. Just a bit of fun instead of just flat damage increases all the time.
2. The main reason I have him there is he has the EXACT same slots as my Summoned Shadow Demon. This allows me to easily swap my Companion equipment over to the Slaad. The Shadow Demon is an absolute beast of a Companion, but his teleport makes him 100% useless against bosses like the Dragon Turtle etc. So easy swapping in those places makes the Slaad one of the best for me.
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
My death slaad is purposely left at rare quality because at epic quality adding a stack when the target already has 5 resets all stacks and deals an AoE attack which is very weak (considering only one target) compared to the DoT done by 5 stacks.
Epic quality would probably be better for AoE damage but single target is all that matters to me.
Keeping 5 stacks constantly running on a boss actually is very easy thanks to careful attack and the heavy use of at-wills of the combat spec.
- Avatar of Orcus : 0.49% of the damage done (not counting Bloody Death which comes from the red curse)
- Withers : 0.97%
- Ras Nsi : 0.53%
So yeah it's pretty bad. Got to replace it.
I have two options available atm : Fire Archon or Erinyes of Belial
Erinyes gives 10% crit severity. I have 134% crit severity and 15% combat advantage bonus.
Considering 100% crit chance (I'm not far) and 100% CA (AotP), Erinyes would give :
10 / 264 = 3.78% more damage
With a vorpal enchantment it would be even worse. (10/314=3.18%)
Fire Archon (with earth and air archons) gives 8% for targets with less than 50% HP and 0.5% for both earth and air.
Considering Fire to be active 50% of the time (which may not be perfectly accurate) and Earth and Air to be always active (which is pretty much the case), Fire Archon would give :
0.5 / 106.5 + 0.5 / 105.5 + 0.08 / 2 = 4.94% more damage
So I'm gonna replace the poor Death Slaad by a Fire Archon.
18.7% + 15% base CA dmg bonus. I'm using Trans Fey for a weapon enchant. So a Erinyes wouldn't do that well for me I think.
Even after the nerf the Wild Hunt Rider is still getting good uptime.
Sorry for some reason I just cant get a clear image to post so here are some direct links.
Paingiver
https://imgur.com/FsMBNFk
ACT whole group over all
https://imgur.com/mNX9TKF
My dmg over all
https://imgur.com/RdGlh2J
Avatar of Orcus 3.28 mil dps
https://imgur.com/wLvnn7j
Weithers 2.06 mil dps
https://imgur.com/IqrdKm2
Ras 897k dps. my highest was 1.6 mil dps so not really sure what I did wrong that run other than using Trans Lightning.
https://imgur.com/5EL6C8I
I was testing out Lingering Curse in there that run and It seems rather under whelming. 95 hits for a total of 900k dmg with a max hit of 30k but avg hit of 9473.68.
I should have stuck with Trans Fey for Ras I think. It took about a 1 1/2 min longer than usual and my dps was about 400k lower that run on Ras than normal. Over all though not a bad run 4:35 Orcus, 1:56 Weithers, 5:28 Ras.
@eliybeats so 90 mil dmg from Blade Storm for the whole dungeon I do believe SV will add way more than that and if they fixed Executioner's Black Attire thats a sweet 24% more dmg potential will look rather nice in there.
Now this is what I would call an avg group for ToNG atm. I picture we will get a considerable jump in DPS with a max out BIS group for max Powre Share. Then toss in the fixed BtS, FmF and BoB, add to that a fixed SV and Flurry. We will be hard to beat out.
Is SW actually really better for packs of mobs, or there is actually no big difference between SW and PF? And also - what's the power setup with SW? Do I replace Thorn Strike with StS?
Here are the results I had yesterday with 2 DC's, an OP and a GF.
Avatar of Orcus
Withers
Ras Nsi
I also updated a few things and added comments for pets and mounts.
The major difference between SW and PF setups are, SW has better AoE ie with Blade storm and throw caution, PF has slightly better single target potential ie with thorn ward debuff in their rotation and Careful Attack, PF has a major movement advantage over SW ie being able to slot a 2nd daily that is worth while slashers mark and being able to pick either Fleet Stance or Readied Stance as more quality of life improvements.
As SW I use AoTP/Blade Storm, StS/TC, CoA/PG, LS/GW, SS/SS, (AS/AS or ES/CtG) depending if I want extra AoE or a single target dot, and finally Forrest ghost as our only viable Daily.
As PF I use AoTP/AoLW or AoTS if you want to micro manage stacks, TW/TS, CoA/PG, LS/GW, SS/SS, HT/CA, Forrest Ghost/Slashers Mark.
I don't have much to invest in another enchantment but maybe I could try and get a perfect vorpal. That would give me roughly 18% more damage, so a lot more than lightning.
Salvatore's Stats
I would love to swap to PF and do some testing in ToNG. Sadly I got rid of my Trans Vorpal and Trans Fey is to buggy for PF Combat to be effective.
Question, I have mythic Wheel of Elements, Eye of the Giant, and Lantern of Revelation in a (Meta BiS group) which do you guys think is better to run as the primary artifact? I've been using the wheel but I'm thinking the debuff from lantern may be better.
I usually use vanguards in the big dungeons, its a buff/debuff few ppl have. Giant eye for the small stuff. Used to have a wheel, but always hated it.
I'll probably swap vanguard for the seer arti next mod, the stats are similar and 50% buff will be nice.