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Lostmauth Falls , Orcus Rises ?

syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
edited April 2016 in The Library
Hey Peeps,

I am currently not sure wich set i should change into
I do not want the valindra set as it is worthless at the moment, Black ice seems worthless to if i read the forums.


What i do wonder if it is worth it to dump my Lostmauth Set, and get me an Orcus set ? (Purely for Damage)

As a CW, what will you do with your lostmauth set ?

Post edited by syxoooo on
Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato

Comments

  • thefabricantthefabricant Posts: 4,641Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Keep cloak and horn, swap belt to valindra.
  • bingbong1233333bingbong1233333 Posts: 4Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    Keep cloak and horn, swap belt to valindra.

    Not greater owlbear? +4 int vs. +2 int +2 cha
    Your Friendly Neighborhood CW Jingle Billy

    Aurora
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2016
    Well i think im going Orcus , The +2 STR gives me another 2% Stamina Regen increase wich is not bad after all.
    And better than the 2% dex i get from LM.
    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • raydrootraydroot Posts: 110Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    I will swap my elol belt with the Valindra's and run ACT to get the stats. In the preview server the elol nerfed set performed marginally better than the swapped Valindra's belt of the same rank.
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Posts: 997Member Arc User
    syxoooo said:

    Well i think im going Orcus , The +2 STR gives me another 2% Stamina Regen increase wich is not bad after all.
    And better than the 2% dex i get from LM.

    You're trolling, right? Right?
    True Neutral
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    syxoooo said:

    Well i think im going Orcus , The +2 STR gives me another 2% Stamina Regen increase wich is not bad after all.
    And better than the 2% dex i get from LM.

    You're trolling, right? Right?
    Nah i went orcus lel , i like it!
    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • keruptxxkeruptxx Posts: 157Member Arc User
    @thefabricant answered your question in the first reply. I'd trust his judgment

    Kerupt [The Legendary Outlaws]
    - Leader
    - CW Class Officer


    XBOX GAMER TAG: Kerupt Shunn
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2016
    keruptxx said:

    @thefabricant answered your question in the first reply. I'd trust his judgment

    Rather have a set bonus than nothing at all, besides the set is awesome!
    And im a Thauma Pure Dps so this set is best for me.

    Believe it or not whatever u like.

    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • romotheoneromotheone Posts: 729Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    syxoooo said:

    keruptxx said:

    @thefabricant answered your question in the first reply. I'd trust his judgment

    Rather have a set bonus than nothing at all, besides the set is awesome!
    And im a Thauma Pure Dps so this set is best for me.

    Believe it or not whatever u like.

    @syxoooo You seem to be new in this community, also probably new/inexperienced in the game? @thefabricant has tested them all and has math to prove that what he suggested to you is the best combination.
    You asked what would be wise to do, you received an answer but it seems like you've made up your mind before even creating the topic. Why are you here?
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2016
    I think u might want to reconsider what you just said.
    I do have experience, but i wanted to know what you guys think of it.

    Funny thing is my ACT shows that my Orcus Set is good.
    And again as i said in an earlier topic, i dont like to walk in a line like everyone else behind the puppet.
    Same as that bonding thing u guys adore, strip you from it and lets see what your worth.

    Experience > Math :smile:

    While you guys where doing your "math" i was bussy PLAYING the game!
    Might wanna redo your "math".

    But ye who am i to tell ya.... :wink:

    Greetings,
    Syxo
    Owner of Pure Evil

    Post edited by syxoooo on
    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2016
    1 word -> Puppet
    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Posts: 997Member Arc User
    You're literally the only Control Wizard who said this with a str8 face :

    "The +2 STR gives me another 2% Stamina Regen increase"

    That almost made me angry.

    Seriously, you can get a boon that increases this by 10% (and more later on, I think there're more boons like that one).

    Getting a Belt that gives you Primary and Secondary skill in terms of DPS is a must for a CW who primes the Thaum build.

    I don't see Orcus set being used properly on anything besides super-HP rich bosses and you wearing some very, very glass-canony set of the old days, such as High Vizier.

    Even in the terms of Wizard NUKE builds, that one is probably one of the riskiest build options ever made.

    I mean, ok, ok, I get it, you want hp-differential of the set. But then again you'd be better of with a WIS build constantly spamming Disintegrate and RoE since the boss' HP won't stay on the top at all times and prior to that GWF/SW/TR have a much bigger single-target DPS than a CW, for it to REALLY matter that you take the Orcus set.

    Not only that, but you'd actually make a CW build that yet still depends upon the actual set bonus, which is a very poor combination and makes it a trap and a repeated mistake of taking the set "to be strong" yet again with the Lostmauth's venegance scenario.

    At this point the CW community wants to see changes on the class in terms of CC options, in terms of DPS options and in terms of being more useful to the entire team by not having to get 2 or 3 wizards to do a job of one.

    So, wizards shouldn't be "viable" simply because of the set bonuses, but because of the actual skill, feats and powers used.


    For instance the synergy with the OP class is terrible. OPs now after the nerf will totally scatter the mobs around in order to get AP-gainand that's reasonable, yet what should a CW do? Take the entangling force on Tab and do practically nothing much?
    There are no many arcane-based boosts to the spells. Only one or two. So that makes Entangling force not viable.
    True Neutral
  • thefabricantthefabricant Posts: 4,641Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2016
    syxoooo said:

    keruptxx said:

    @thefabricant answered your question in the first reply. I'd trust his judgment

    Rather have a set bonus than nothing at all, besides the set is awesome!
    And im a Thauma Pure Dps so this set is best for me.

    Believe it or not whatever u like.

    So here is the explanation:

    Valindra/2 piece elol:

    Stats:
    Power: 2692
    Crit: 1060
    Armour Penetration: 1530
    Recovery: 530
    Intelligence: 2
    Charisma: 2

    Orcus Set:

    Stats:
    Power: 2692
    Critical Strike: 1060
    Deflection: 1060
    Movement: 1000
    Strength: 2
    Constitution: 2

    So, just off of the stats, you lose the following offensive stats: (discounting recovery)
    Armour Penetration: 1530
    Intelligence: 2
    Charisma: 2

    For a total damage loss of:
    15% resistance ignored = ~3% damage boost from power ~ 4% crit chance (assuming you fixed your arp issue by changing stats elsewhere because having an arp deficiency is stupid.)
    2% damage (from int, not counting learned spellcaster)
    2% crit chance (from cha)
    2% CA damage (from cha)

    For a total constant dps loss of:
    10% constant dps loss

    How does the orcus set work?
    |(Your HP% - Their HP%)|/5

    Which means that in an ideal world assuming perfect circumstances, its a 15% dps gain (assuming you at low HP at the start of combat and at high HP at the end), which should make it equal or better than the above right? Well, no. Why? Because there are a few things you have to take into consideration:
    1) You will NEVER get the 20% damage bonus, as you cannot damage an enemy at 0 HP.
    2) Outside of dungeons, you will 1 shot monsters at full life, meaning no dps boost at all.
    3) Inside of dungeons, you will 1 shot monsters from half life, meaning that the last point you can realistically count is 50% up vs your 100%
    4) CW is a melee caster, which means you will take damage, which means your HP will also jump around, which means the bonus will jump around.

    All in all, the above factors make the Orcus set bonus average to a 6-7% dps bonus, which is 3-4% less than the above listed stat distribution, which makes it worse for dps.

    Of coarse, all the above is just theory, have I actually tested it? Yes and I find it to be a dps loss.

    Now, you have likely already made up your mind and aren't here to be convinced otherwise so much as to argue with people. So an easier solution is this: My CW is specced purely for dps, meet me in game and lets see how our CWs compare.
  • syxoooosyxoooo Posts: 18Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Okay sure lets compare

    Leader of Pure Evil, Sword Guild in the Primacy Alliance.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
  • mckibben#9750 mckibben Posts: 4Member New User
    Please tell the rest of us who has the bigger epeen after you compare
  • romotheoneromotheone Posts: 729Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited May 2016

    Please tell the rest of us who has the bigger epeen after you compare

    @mckibben#9750
    @syxoooo not coming back to the forums and bragging about the outcome explains it. Despite being far better geared, he only did about 3/4 of what @thefabricant was doing.
  • mckibben#9750 mckibben Posts: 4Member New User
    Hahaha. Figures! Is the recommendation to switch lostmauth belt to valindra still valid ? I'm only about 2.6 IL and 61% crit running thaum + oppressor. I have both belts, but was trying out lost and can't tell a difference between it and valindra. Any thoughts ?
  • thefabricantthefabricant Posts: 4,641Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    Hahaha. Figures! Is the recommendation to switch lostmauth belt to valindra still valid ? I'm only about 2.6 IL and 61% crit running thaum + oppressor. I have both belts, but was trying out lost and can't tell a difference between it and valindra. Any thoughts ?

    It is.
  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Posts: 4,942Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    Please tell the rest of us who has the bigger epeen after you compare

    @mckibben#9750
    @syxoooo not coming back to the forums and bragging about the outcome explains it. Despite being far better geared, he only did about 3/4 of what @thefabricant was doing.
    Did you do a combined run, or two runs? One with each CW? I think that's the more telling difference, as too much of a person's playstyle also accounts for how much total damage they'll do.

    If someone plays very fast and aggressively (and can walk the razor's edge between dying and DPSing), they'll generally end up doing a lot more damage than someone who otherwise has a great build, but plays more cautiously.

    It's one thing that's kept me into Neverwinter...the skill of the player factors tremendously into the ultimate outcome.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • thefabricantthefabricant Posts: 4,641Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    Please tell the rest of us who has the bigger epeen after you compare

    @mckibben#9750
    @syxoooo not coming back to the forums and bragging about the outcome explains it. Despite being far better geared, he only did about 3/4 of what @thefabricant was doing.
    Did you do a combined run, or two runs? One with each CW? I think that's the more telling difference, as too much of a person's playstyle also accounts for how much total damage they'll do.

    If someone plays very fast and aggressively (and can walk the razor's edge between dying and DPSing), they'll generally end up doing a lot more damage than someone who otherwise has a great build, but plays more cautiously.

    It's one thing that's kept me into Neverwinter...the skill of the player factors tremendously into the ultimate outcome.
    I stayed behind for the most part, not running ahead, because I was chatting with people at the time :p (As @silverkelt and @zekethesinner can attest to, I spend a lot more time chatting then playing the game :p) We did 2 runs, 1 where I used a bonding pet, the second 1 where I did not, because they don't use a bonding pet and so it was only fair that I switched to an augment. There were other factors playing into it though, so I wouldn't exactly consider it a good comparison of builds.
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