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Battle of Aoes

ve11ave11a Posts: 17 Arc User
edited March 2012 in Class Discussion
hey guys :D was wondering whether a lightning mage or a burst marksman is better for instances.... which among the two dishes out the greater damage?
Post edited by ve11a on

Comments

  • noxshadow1noxshadow1 Posts: 184 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    I would say between the two, Lightning Mage...however that has very little data backing it. Only speculation based off the previous nerf Burst Marksmen suffered.

    Also, define "greater damage" because the Marksmen normally do less initial damage with a lot more burn damage, while I notice a lot of the Lightning Mages have a high spike damage.
  • WerePetar - IllyfueWerePetar - Illyfue Posts: 221 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    burst mm is realy good dd on low lvl but later mages become a lot beter on damge,and lighting and ice mage can protect them self from mobs in instaces and since is hard to faound good build marble prot to hold mobs on him think mages are beter idea
  • Borsook - EyrdaBorsook - Eyrda Posts: 2,951 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Fire mage :p
  • IaiStrike - EyrdaIaiStrike - Eyrda Posts: 444 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Glacial priest gogo.
  • Ghundam - EyrdaGhundam - Eyrda Posts: 321 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Fire mage :p

    I am currently burst mm (Ghundam) and also have a fire mage which has been also ice and lightning more times than I will admit (RubyWep). Nothing beats the burst mm in terms of AOE range. Remember we are dealing with AOE and a fire mm has rage of demons as their primary AOE. In terms of consistent AOE damage the burst mm is the best in game. A lightning mage perhaps has the highest damage output but only when tempest is active.

    I have been in parties with much more well geared/gemmed/mastered mages but my burst mm always delivers the most consistent damage.

    Now with all this said the best AOE in the game is an ice mage and I am appalled that 15% and 30% freeze rates can freeze that often. My mm for example has a 50% stun that procs far less than these freezes. No offense to ice mages because I love to be on their side in PvP. In fact ice + burst mm/fire mage in 6v6 or gvg is a rediculously op combo. The fact is though is that the freeze procs far far far too often. I've fight ice mages alot and their freeze ALWAYS works. Never once has any of them failed to freeze me. Remember I'm talking about a 15% and 30% chance to freeze. Not only does it ALWAYS work but the length of time for which you are froze plus the fact that you take damage while frozen is rediculous.

    Once again the developers clearly do not pvp long enough during testing to realise how absurd some of these occurences are. Anyway I stop because now every ice mage on the server will claim how its not op.
  • Aishleen - EyrdaAishleen - Eyrda Posts: 2,005 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Now with all this said the best AOE in the game is an ice mage and I am appalled that 15% and 30% freeze rates can freeze that often.
    Because the 30% is applied on each of the 4 hits of Fury of Ice, so it's basically 30% tried 4 times, since you only need it to trigger once and you get frozen. It's something closer to 80% (lazy to do the math)

    I think it's stupid to be honest and if it was 30% on the first hit only (or last hit) I think ice mages wouldn't be so OP :P
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  • Trogotha - Storm LegionTrogotha - Storm Legion Posts: 662 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Talking with Wars and other DD classes, they tend to prefer Burst MM over Lightning Mage since the mage has knockback on the majority of their aoe skills compared to the long and painful burn effect imparted by Rake of Fury on pretty much everything it hits. If you really want to see some QQ from DDs, use knockback skills on the one subboss in WP that for some reason isn't immune to control effects like knockback unlike pretty much every other boss critter in FW.

    Ice Mage is great for cc but the downside is that once frozen, the mobs take less damage so it still takes longer to kill them.

    Fire Mage is pretty much the standard PVE tree for mages. Personally though, I've found I can hide behind either a Prot or a Fire Mage since both can generate aggro like a ****. I prefer the prot since they can grab aggro from me quicker than a mage and the prot usually has higher def and hp.
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  • CuteNDeadl - Storm LegionCuteNDeadl - Storm Legion Posts: 2,401 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    I personally prefer a mage > marksman in my party, mostly because they got CC and arent as squishy as a marksman.

    Marksman = AoE, AoE, AoE, steal aggro, die.
  • Borsook - EyrdaBorsook - Eyrda Posts: 2,951 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    I am currently burst mm (Ghundam) and also have a fire mage which has been also ice and lightning more times than I will admit (RubyWep). Nothing beats the burst mm in terms of AOE range. Remember we are dealing with AOE and a fire mm has rage of demons as their primary AOE. In terms of consistent AOE damage the burst mm is the best in game. A lightning mage perhaps has the highest damage output but only when tempest is active.

    I have been in parties with much more well geared/gemmed/mastered mages but my burst mm always delivers the most consistent damage.

    Now with all this said the best AOE in the game is an ice mage and I am appalled that 15% and 30% freeze rates can freeze that often. My mm for example has a 50% stun that procs far less than these freezes. No offense to ice mages because I love to be on their side in PvP. In fact ice + burst mm/fire mage in 6v6 or gvg is a rediculously op combo. The fact is though is that the freeze procs far far far too often. I've fight ice mages alot and their freeze ALWAYS works. Never once has any of them failed to freeze me. Remember I'm talking about a 15% and 30% chance to freeze. Not only does it ALWAYS work but the length of time for which you are froze plus the fact that you take damage while frozen is rediculous.

    Once again the developers clearly do not pvp long enough during testing to realise how absurd some of these occurences are. Anyway I stop because now every ice mage on the server will claim how its not op.
    ??? Ice mages are by far worst in instances, since that's what the thread is about no?

    Fury of Ice has 8 second cooldown, and it's their only AoE. Besides Frost Realm and Ice Edge, both with 45s cooldowns (35s if talented). Really.

    While a burst MM will be far above a mage at low level or mediocre gear, remember that mages are one of the best scaling classes. With above average gear, mages will scale way more than a MM, especially because their burns rely on mastery as direct damage instead of as a multiplier.

    Mage burns, as well, have constant damage which makes them terrible when you are geared -- which is why, even though I'm a fire mage, I am not built for burns at all. We get impressive damage, and even spike damage, though.

    For fire mage, +5% critrate, +40% crit damage on AoE (in PvE mainly), 3% of max mana + 5% if lingering fire as damage (if mobs are close and you thunderclap them all, or if a wind mage is in the party), 130% base on all skills, -450 defense on target, -60 fire/wind/water resistances, +180 mastery from Magic Meditation for 15s once every 2 mins, +45 more if you have the talent, and low cooldowns enough to spam two fire AoEs once every 4 seconds, and thunderclap in-between. (takes 3sec to cast both AoEs)

    And this is with no burn at all.

    But yes, nothing compares to a MM in range of AoE if you want it consistent, but fire mage is close. 2.8s cooldown on Rage of Demons instead of 2s cooldown on Rake of Fury.

    While fire mages get Flame of Fury also, though, but it's a small AoE in comparison to Rage of Demons (and 2s cast).
  • First_Aid - EyrdaFirst_Aid - Eyrda Posts: 110 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    As Borsook said

    Fire Mage > Burst MM

    Dot damage + Spike damage = Win

    Looks matter also..Mage>MM no doubt xD
  • Axym - LionheartAxym - Lionheart Posts: 1,484 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    D: I feel kinda offended....

    I suppose it's all about who you party with though, because I'm almost constantly asked to do instances, and I hardly party with any mages anymore (used to but main mage in guild left). I personally hate mages, even on my bard, especially if they use their knockback skills. It just makes it annoying to run after mobs that get pushed back.

    I suppose it also has to do with how you play your class. I die rarely, lag spikes, healer's lag, or just generally unlucky (many crits) and I'll die. Given, I'm not as powerful as some mm because I focused on survivability more than power, but you can't hit mobs if you die. I know many mages who've done the same, I also know mages who drop like flies if a mob so much as touches them. I know mm's in the same situation.

    As for cc? Really? Given I only leveled my fire mage to 48, but the only "cc" I saw was knockback, which, I hate, my parties usually hate, and I have with my flammable skill anyways in tough situations, and I even entirely skipped adding it to Rage of Demons on my fire mage. Freeze on a fire mage is with a ST skill... I really wouldn't call that cc.

    As for shields, yes mm's shield sucks, we all know that, but I rarely see mage's pop theirs anyway unless they're about to die or are in arena, or tanking.


    Just my counterpoints, mages are about equal to mm as far as I'm concerned like wars = prots in tanking most of the time. Yes wars might be considered better but in some situations, you'd prefer the prot. ;)

    Edit: P.S. Depends on what you're going for in looks. I for one think I look adorable <3 and I really wish I had a good ss to show you :(
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  • StrykerJ - LionheartStrykerJ - Lionheart Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Either of the two is fine, if ur broke and need to keep mobs away because you're too squishy, go lightning. But IMO, i've played every tree, and nothing does better AoE killing than a fire mage. Nothing.
  • IMBALANZE - LionheartIMBALANZE - Lionheart Posts: 4,263 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    burst MM

    they got 4 AOE skills...

    of which 2 has 1 sec CD (could be further boosted for instant CD)

    heheehe
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  • IaiStrike - EyrdaIaiStrike - Eyrda Posts: 444 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Depends on the instance in question and how many mobs you're actually aoeing. As well as how strong the player in question is. Especially since wind mages are just **** without gear/mastery since they depend the most upon spike damage. Not all wind mages can pull of 20k x 6 or more purgatory. Heck, a lot of wind mages I see can't even pull 10k crit per hit.
  • Trogotha - Storm LegionTrogotha - Storm Legion Posts: 662 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    *sings* "I like AOE, put another pot in the mp bar baby..."

    Sorry, couldn't resist. :p
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